IH Tractors on Montana Farm

[Loadstar]

I'd sure be surprised if they were different.

Ralph, do you have any literature showing torque curves for a 304 or 345?

All I have is my Chiltons guide for the Scout. They list the 304 at 180 hp at 4400 and 262 torque at 2400.

Surprisingly they only rate the 345 at 182.5 hp at 3800 Torque is 309 at 2200 rpm.

Strange to think there are a lot of pickups carrying nothing at all and have double the horsepower and torque of my little 304 which grosses out around 30,000 pounds. Like John said, it takes a while to build up speed even with a 4 and 2. .

[Delta Dirt]

We had (still have its remains) a Scout II with the 258 6 cyld engine. The rear end went out----------and we found a wrecked Scout with a 345 V8. I bought the whole truck--------had a neigbor who had a Loadstar with a bad 345. He installed the 345 out of the Scout into his Loadstar and never noticed any difference. I was always under the impression that they were the same engines.

Regarding the 304 and the 345-----------I always figured these engines had room to play with if somebody wanted to "sweeten them up a little". But-------I never heard of anybody jacking one up; everybody was happy with them the way they were (just good steady workhorses--------and still alot of them around).

I always thought that IH did a good job with their gear ratios------tire sizes, and engines to match up with the intended work load, etc. Gearing definitely makes a difference with the load you can move and with the fuel mileage.

That's a great looking load MB Cat has pictured-----------might be a little more valuable than an equivalent weight load of grain!!!!! Sure does my heart more good anyway!!!

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

[Old Binder Guy]

I never owned a 345 in anything, but I had three 304s and got along fine, two in pickups and one in the 1600 Loadstar. I had a 1960 B-184 with a V-365, I think. It had originally been a State Highway dump truck, then a machinery truck at Woods Brother's Implement at Hobson. That had a five and a two and never lacked for power. Went uphill and downhill, loaded or unloaded about the same. I really liked the air brakes it had. I had a 1959 B-170 with a 264 six cylinder, a five and two. That was a decent old truck but not nearly the get up and go that B-184 had. If you check the displacement of those two engines, that one extra cubic inch REALLY made a difference!

Here is a picture of a wrecked steam locomotive and passenger train. It appears a bridge collapsed. There is still smoke coming out of the smokestack at left, on the locomotive. Gary

[farmerboy3]

my uncle bought the loadstar off the floor in the middle of winter drove it home and put it in the shed till spring and it's been on the farm everyyear and it will die on the farm we are close to about 37xxx miles lucky to put about 250-300kms a year hauling spray water from the well to sprayer

i haven't notice much difference between the motors but before the motor blew we would load that sucker right full of grain and go through the coulee with it no problem

are mufflers are rusting around the outlet piece of pipe not sure but hey it's 37 yrs old and i love that ol truck

[Tubacase47]

All of this talk about Loadstars just reminded me of the one I drove in 1976-77. I was a deliveryman for a frozen food company out of Wichita, KS. I had a route starting at Sterling, KS and extending out to Scott City, Oakley, Colby, and Norton. That was one darn good truck; it had the MV404 engine and I got several speeding tickets as I had popped the company installed governor. I ran about 1300 miles per week and I suppose I averaged about 2 tons of food per trip out of the warehouse (twice weekly).

I always thought it would have made a great grain hauler.

[Loadstar]

All of this talk about Loadstars just reminded me of the one I drove in 1976-77. I was a deliveryman for a frozen food company out of Wichita, KS. I had a route starting at Sterling, KS and extending out to Scott City, Oakley, Colby, and Norton. That was one darn good truck; it had the MV404 engine and I got several speeding tickets as I had popped the company installed governor. I ran about 1300 miles per week and I suppose I averaged about 2 tons of food per trip out of the warehouse (twice weekly).

I always thought it would have made a great grain hauler.

I doubt my Loadstar would break the speed limit, well maybe running empty and if I ran the engine up to the red line (4400) but of course that extra hundred cubic inches in your 404 can make a difference . At the time I had this 304 rebuilt I considered finding a used 392 but never went ahead with it. Kind of wish I had now. I've heard talk that the older (SV?) IH engines like mine were better built than the newer (MV?) engines but have no evidence to back up that statement. Here is an ad showing the newer Loadstar in a scene that had to be shot in Western Canada. I doubt many 914 pull type combines found their way out of Canada.

[farmerboy3]

when we were looking we ended up taking what ever we could could first which happend to be a 345 V8

the seller told us it ran good when it was pulled out so we took it but a 392 would have been better but hey if some people can still move grain with a 304 we can move with a 345 yet, we have a newer IH truck as well with a 404 gas that was the city of swift current truck at one time and it can haul big loads the only thing is it needs an internal rebuild for more power (starting to lose it ) and stop the back fireing

[M Diesel]

I'd sure be surprised if they were different.

Ralph, do you have any literature showing torque curves for a 304 or 345?

All I have is my Chiltons guide for the Scout. They list the 304 at 180 hp at 4400 and 262 torque at 2400.

Surprisingly they only rate the 345 at 182.5 hp at 3800 Torque is 309 at 2200 rpm.

Strange to think there are a lot of pickups carrying nothing at all and have double the horsepower and torque of my little 304 which grosses out around 30,000 pounds. Like John said, it takes a while to build up speed even with a 4 and 2. .

I hear ya.

And thanks. Reason I ask is because it is real common to see that type of distribution across an automotive product line, meaning very little difference in peak power. My guess is the 392 makes around 360 torque? None of the numbers are outstanding at all, but being trucks I commend their thinking. Still, to have higher torque to accelerate with and then limit top end so much that you have to shift shorter is such an oxymoron situation.

My 345 with 4 and 2 is a slow beast, but me and Dad have a hoot running around with it. It has an exhaust spit at the right front so the engine may be doomed. Given the tranny forks are so wobbly it is hard to hit the gates, it may get a transplant. I'd prefer an Olds 455 w auto but will likely settle for a 460 Ford if it happens.

[Old Binder Guy]

Here's a picture from a Nichols & Shepard advertizement of one of their 35hp engines plowing with a Reeves steam lift plow in South Dakota.

This is a scarce engine. It is a 35hp Advance tandem compound, side mounted engine and it has a scarce option with that front water tank. I believe this was taken in Indiana and sent to me by my old friend Chady Atteberry years ago.

Maybe this encore photo will work for a while. I took it at Whitefish, Montana years ago when I was pulling my 15hp Case inside with my TD-40 TracTracTor. That should make for an IH Tractor on a Montana Farm? Gary

[IH Steve]

Has anyone transplanted a diesel into an old 1960's Loadstar? A 7.3 to keep it IH? Not sure when 466's could be spec'd in a Loadstar, but when your gasser is shot and you have an old F250 with a 7.3..........

[Delta Dirt]

IH Steve----

I would think it could be done----------my neighbor who operates a turf farm next door had a S-1600 with a factory 7.3 in it.

One of the main problems with the gas to diesel swap is gear ratios----------due to the diesels turning lower rpms than the gas V-8s. This little truck had a 5 speed with a single speed rear end------------and I am thinking the ratio was in the neighborhood of 4:40-1 with 8.25x20 tires. (He didn't run this truck much and wanted to sell it------I looked it over at one time, but just not enough truck for what I needed)

You most likely would need to change the rear end out------------and also find a new source of boost for your brakes.

********

Talking about hp and torque---------does anybody have access to the ratings on a factory propane Ford 429 truck engine. Ended up buying an 89 F700 with the 429 on factory propane. This truck was originally spec'd as a propane delivery truck for running in the Ozark mountains over in Arkansas and is geared extremely low. Got lots of power-----------but limited on top end and fuel economy (runs @ 4 mpg; loaded/empty----up hill or down hill-----switch on/switch off).

I had a Ford shop foreman tell me that the factory propane engine carried a higher compression ratio than a gas 429---------so to compensate for the slight loss of btu's from the propane. He figured it was approximately 11-1 compression ratio and would be rated @ 250+/- hp; but never found any information for me. I'm sorta like MB Cat------just gonna have to keep putting fuel in it to get back home---------we don't run it much, but I don't have to worry about climbing hills.

Got some pictures from some of my recent ramblings-----maybe I can get something posted over the week end.

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

[Old Binder Guy]

IH Steve----

I would think it could be done----------my neighbor who operates a turf farm next door had a S-1600 with a factory 7.3 in it.

One of the main problems with the gas to diesel swap is gear ratios----------due to the diesels turning lower rpms than the gas V-8s. This little truck had a 5 speed with a single speed rear end------------and I am thinking the ratio was in the neighborhood of 4:40-1 with 8.25x20 tires. (He didn't run this truck much and wanted to sell it------I looked it over at one time, but just not enough truck for what I needed)

You most likely would need to change the rear end out------------and also find a new source of boost for your brakes.

********

Talking about hp and torque---------does anybody have access to the ratings on a factory propane Ford 429 truck engine. Ended up buying an 89 F700 with the 429 on factory propane. This truck was originally spec'd as a propane delivery truck for running in the Ozark mountains over in Arkansas and is geared extremely low. Got lots of power-----------but limited on top end and fuel economy (runs @ 4 mpg; loaded/empty----up hill or down hill-----switch on/switch off).

I had a Ford shop foreman tell me that the factory propane engine carried a higher compression ratio than a gas 429---------so to compensate for the slight loss of btu's from the propane. He figured it was approximately 11-1 compression ratio and would be rated @ 250+/- hp; but never found any information for me. I'm sorta like MB Cat------just gonna have to keep putting fuel in it to get back home---------we don't run it much, but I don't have to worry about climbing hills.

Got some pictures from some of my recent ramblings-----maybe I can get something posted over the week end.

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

Anson,

Trade rear ends with that diesel rig that was too high geared. Then you've fixed both of those trucks!

Gary

[Loadstar]

Talking about hp and torque---------does anybody have access to the ratings on a factory propane Ford 429 truck engine. Ended up buying an 89 F700 with the 429 on factory propane. This truck was originally spec'd as a propane delivery truck for running in the Ozark mountains over in Arkansas and is geared extremely low. Got lots of power-----------but limited on top end and fuel economy (runs @ 4 mpg; loaded/empty----up hill or down hill-----switch on/switch off).

I had a Ford shop foreman tell me that the factory propane engine carried a higher compression ratio than a gas 429---------so to compensate for the slight loss of btu's from the propane. He figured it was approximately 11-1 compression ratio and would be rated @ 250+/- hp; but never found any information for me. I'm sorta like MB Cat------just gonna have to keep putting fuel in it to get back home---------we don't run it much, but I don't have to worry about climbing hills.

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

Anson, I have no figures for you on the Ford propane engine but I have always heard that burning propane does not produce as much horsepower as the equivalent engine burning gas. On the upside, that propane burning engine will likely outlast you and the next generation. It is known as such a clean burning fuel that the engines last almost forever. Had a neighbour converted a Ford pickup years ago. He put an awful lot of miles on it and it outlasted him.

I got my start driving on this old 46 Ford (I may already have posted this pic) after my Dad retired it from grain hauling. I never hauled anything heavy on it with the flatdeck but Dad used to haul grain from the combine with it when the box still had the sides on. He kept in shape shoveling the grain off at harvest time as the truck had no hoist.

[mtoldiron]

IH Pick-up on a Montana Farm

You guys were talking about exhaust fires in the stubble field, which brought back memories of my IH caused fire.

We sprayed crops and stubble (chem.-fallow) with a 1965 IH ¾ Ton 4 X 4 with a 500 gallon, 60 foot boom, pick-up mounted sprayer. It was quite a load for the old girl. It had a 304 V8, 4-speed. This pick-up was “rode hard and put away wet” before we ever got it on our eastern Montana farm. It belonged to my wife’s grandfather and was used on a cattle ranch in western Montana. It had a very heavy, home-built livestock rack built permanent to the pick-up. The rack extended over the cab to haul horses. The rack was very well built and weighed nearly as much as the old pick-up. This probably saved it a few times when the road went one way and the IH pick-up went another way. The pick-up ended up on its side more than once. When we got it on the farm near Geraldine, it only had about 60,000 miles on it. It was mechanically in good condition, the body however not so much. The driver’s side door would barely close and latch enough to use it. We thought it would make a short term sprayer pick-up; however we sprayed with that thing for at least 15 years and it held up good.

One spring the fields had a lot of wet spots. One day I started to spin; I laid into the gas, thinking it would bite and pull through. Wrong! It sunk to the frame and the hot exhaust was sitting on the tall stubble—instant fire! Like many farmers we had a fire fighting hose on board and with a quick turn of a valve I put the fire out with Round-up spray—very expensive in those days. I saved it anyway with no damage to anything.

[664 CDN]

No planting in March this year.

Mar. 26/11

Mar. 19/10

taken about the same spot.

Ray

[T 20]

Here's a couple of picts of logging when logs were LOGS...

Mo

[Loadstar]

IH Pick-up on a Montana Farm

You guys were talking about exhaust fires in the stubble field, which brought back memories of my IH caused fire.

Like many farmers we had a fire fighting hose on board and with a quick turn of a valve I put the fire out with Round-up spray—very expensive in those days. I saved it anyway with no damage to anything.

That was a little too much excitement having your truck stuck and on fire, unable to drive away from the fire. Lucky you had the roundup to spray although I remember how expensive it used to be. Something in the $30 per litre range? Monsanto finally figured out they would sell a lot more if they lowered the price.

Ray, interesting comparison shots and I'd agree, no planting in March. Make that April for us. I think we will be lucky to get out in the field in May. Its staying cold here, very little melting at all and deep snow everywhere.

I took this picture of my air seeder a couple of weeks ago before the last blizzard. Looks like it will be a day or so before I hitch onto it.

And just to meet the required level of IH tractor content here I will include this shot of my Uncle's Farmall M taken back in the early sixties. Hitched up to the stoneboat ready to haul manure.

[664 CDN]

And just to meet the required level of IH tractor content here I will include this shot of my Uncle's Farmall M taken back in the early sixties. Hitched up to the stoneboat ready to haul manure.

Ralph, when I was a kid in the late 1940,s Dad used to haul manure out to a pile in the field with the horses and sleigh with a flat rack.

Then we got our exercise loading the manure spreader by hand in the spring.

I think I like the new good old days better.

BTW with all our snow & ice I don,t think the truck could start a fire in the stubble here.

Ray

[farmerboy3]

IH Pick-up on a Montana Farm

You guys were talking about exhaust fires in the stubble field, which brought back memories of my IH caused fire.

Like many farmers we had a fire fighting hose on board and with a quick turn of a valve I put the fire out with Round-up spray—very expensive in those days. I saved it anyway with no damage to anything.

That was a little too much excitement having your truck stuck and on fire, unable to drive away from the fire. Lucky you had the roundup to spray although I remember how expensive it used to be. Something in the $30 per litre range? Monsanto finally figured out they would sell a lot more if they lowered the price.

Ray, interesting comparison shots and I'd agree, no planting in March. Make that April for us. I think we will be lucky to get out in the field in May. Its staying cold here, very little melting at all and deep snow everywhere.

I took this picture of my air seeder a couple of weeks ago before the last blizzard. Looks like it will be a day or so before I hitch onto it.

And just to meet the required level of IH tractor content here I will include this shot of my Uncle's Farmall M taken back in the early sixties. Hitched up to the stoneboat ready to haul manure.

hopefully we'll get seeding about the 11th of May i'm hoping my air seeder ain't covered since the wings are up but near the south of our yard theres snow taller than i am and i'm about 5'2 but in the feilds you can see the stubble so it's gone down a bit but comin up again with this snow

but my mom said in the late 60's early 70's (before i was born) they'd have snow that would dang near cover the house and the quanset is facing north-south on that homestead (my uncle farms it now) and the snow would pack hard against it and all my aunts and uncle and my mom would get the sleds and spend the afternoon sliding down the hill

[Loadstar]

I took this picture of my air seeder a couple of weeks ago before the last blizzard. Looks like it will be a day or so before I hitch onto it.

hopefully we'll get seeding about the 11th of May i'm hoping my air seeder ain't covered since the wings are up but near the south of our yard theres snow taller than i am and i'm about 5'2 but in the feilds you can see the stubble so it's gone down a bit but comin up again with this snow

but my mom said in the late 60's early 70's (before i was born) they'd have snow that would dang near cover the house and the quanset is facing north-south on that homestead (my uncle farms it now) and the snow would pack hard against it and all my aunts and uncle and my mom would get the sleds and spend the afternoon sliding down the hill

No stubble showing here yet. In fact many places the top wire of the barbed wire fences is covered. I took this one in my yard yesterday. Still haven't measured the depth of that drift but I think it is higher than the roof of my Blazer.

Here is the link to the video I shot clearing some of that drift away earlier .

[farmerboy3]

well i think the southern part of saskatchewan is gonna have trouble this spring around here in West Central sask were gonna have enough trouble but we have fairly good run off on all of our land so we'll be fine but some people are gonna still be in trouble

[M Diesel]

Glad I'm not feelin the white stuff. It cleared up quite a bit today and got some nice weather moving in.

And spent some time fixing roads today.

After all, gotta keep it shiny.

[Loadstar]

Ralph, when I was a kid in the late 1940,s Dad used to haul manure out to a pile in the field with the horses and sleigh with a flat rack.

Then we got our exercise loading the manure spreader by hand in the spring.

I think I like the new good old days better.

Ray

Ray, your story is much the same as mine. Dad used horses on the stoneboat until the mid fifties when he sold them. From then on it was tractor power. I don't recall him using a stoneboat but by the time I was old enough to help it was the good old general purpose "rack" that did the hauling. Originally it had been for hauling sheaves to the thresher and likely had the high wooden spoke wheels but these wheels were cut down to accept a 15 inch rim and rubber car tire which was a big improvement. That old rack served a lot of purposes on the farm from hauling manure, bales, picking rocks, hauling logs for firewood. The odd time in a wet spring we would even ride it behind the tractor to meet the school bus when our half mile driveway was impassable to anything less than a tractor.

You can see it parked by the barn in this pic from 1965. Hard work, good exercise, good memories of working with my dad.

[Delta Dirt]

Got a few photos from my recent ramblings down here in the Mississippi Delta-----not all IH, but gonna start off with an IHC Farmall H on a Mississippi farm. And-------since some of our good old Delta Dirt washed down here from Montana-----these photos should qualify for this thread!!!

Here is a Farmall H with the exhaust turned down-----this was common place during the harvest when pulling cotton trailers to the gin------so to prevent sparks from the upright exhaust possibly starting a fire in the cotton. That is a #458 or #457 (??) belly mount planter (missing hoppers)sitting in front of the H------and you can see a M Farmall under an early model 1 row cotton picker sitting in the back ground. The big steel wheel grader is an Adams---------and it's one of the largest steel wheel graders I have seen, but I did not find a model number on it. I have a model 12-----but this one is much larger.

Here are some "new fangled" IH fiberglass hoppers that might be adapted to the old 458 planter (the 457/458 planters carried steel hoppers)-------the frame being utilized for this photo looks as if it might have started out yellow in its early life. (the IH logo is always colorful wherever you find it).

edit: the old belly mount IHC planters on primarily M's and Super M's planted (and harvested) many an acre of cotton across the mid-south. As the larger tractors came along-------it wasn't uncommon to see a F-20, M or Super M still planting (some farmers just left the planter on the tractor year around)------almost as if the planter was a self propelled unit.

More coming later-------

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

[Loadstar]

Got a few photos from my recent ramblings down here in the Mississippi Delta-----not all IH, but gonna start off with an IHC Farmall H on a Mississippi farm. And-------since some of our good old Delta Dirt washed down here from Montana-----these photos should qualify for this thread!!!

Here is a Farmall H

Delta Dirt

Avon, Ms 38723

Anson, I'm glad to see you take the time to photo and document these old rusty machines. I imagine it won't be long before most of it goes to the crusher or the restorer. That H definitely looks worth saving.

I've got a red tractor pic here but not IH, its a Cockshutt, model 80 I believe. Of course that line of Cockshutts were actually Olivers in red paint.

You can see it at work in this video I shot back in 99.