Old Binder Guy Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 There was some discussion over on the IH Tractor On Montana Farm thread regarding IH D series trucks. Rather than confuse things too much I will post the ad here as I know Gary stops by once in a while. This is a 1947 ad showing the KB 6 taking on a load of dirt. GVW of 14,500 pounds but using IH's "point rating system" they allowed an increase to 16,000 pounds for other jobs. I would guess that GVW was exceeded about a hundred percent of the time. Ralph, I stated over on the Montana thread how I liked listening to the 6-cylinder engine used in the KB-6 engines. Does anybody know: was that a 282 cubic inch engine? I had a 1960 B-170 with a non-synchromatic 5-speed transmission and that engine. I sure liked that truck. I remember it as being 282 CU IN, or one cube smaller than the Chevy V-8 of that time period. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Ralph, I stated over on the Montana thread how I liked listening to the 6-cylinder engine used in the KB-6 engines. Does anybody know: was that a 282 cubic inch engine? I had a 1960 B-170 with a non-synchromatic 5-speed transmission and that engine. I sure liked that truck. I remember it as being 282 CU IN, or one cube smaller than the Chevy V-8 of that time period. Gary Gary, there is some interesting discussion and photos about an Australian version of the IH 282 engine with a unique split intake and exhaust manifold here. http://oldihc.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=3247 It seems it was not available in North America. My information is telling me that the KB6 had a Blue Diamond 250 engine. http://tractors.wikia.com/wiki/International_KBS-6_Truck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George 2 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 That Australian version is a Black Diamond 282. This is similar to the C282 engine used on a 403 combine. (3 11/16 x 4.39). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 That Australian version is a Black Diamond 282. This is similar to the C282 engine used on a 403 combine. (3 11/16 x 4.39). That seems to be the consensus over at the oldihc.org site too George. What a unique engine it would be? GM used the same idea for the power plant in the first generation Corvette. A split intake/exhaust manifold on the old 235 six cylinder engine to give the Corvette a little more get up and go than the plain old Chevy sedans. Although I believe the Corvette had triple carbs on that intake. Here is an ad for the introduction of International's D series trucks in 1937. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta Dirt Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Don't know the workings of the electronic governor on the Moline Universal D--------but it was advertised as a 10 speed tractor; -----and was simply by twisting the knob on the governor setting. (speeds 1----10 clearly marked)-----best I can tell the transmission carried forward and reverse. DD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Binder Guy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 There was some discussion over on the IH Tractor On Montana Farm thread regarding IH D series trucks. Rather than confuse things too much I will post the ad here as I know Gary stops by once in a while. This is a 1947 ad showing the KB 6 taking on a load of dirt. GVW of 14,500 pounds but using IH's "point rating system" they allowed an increase to 16,000 pounds for other jobs. I would guess that GVW was exceeded about a hundred percent of the time. Ralph, I stated over on the Montana thread how I liked listening to the 6-cylinder engine used in the KB-6 engines. Does anybody know: was that a 282 cubic inch engine? I had a 1960 B-170 with a non-synchromatic 5-speed transmission and that engine. I sure liked that truck. I remember it as being 282 CU IN, or one cube smaller than the Chevy V-8 of that time period. Gary Whatever engine the KB-6 had as standard, with one side of the valve cover zigzagged and the other side straight, I think, that's the "sound" I'm thinking of. My B-170 had that same head and valve cover and sounded like the KB-6. My 403 combine may have had a 282 engine, but it sounded just like an old BD 240 engine would, and nothing like the KB-6. Or my B-170. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George 2 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The larger KBs in that size had the Blue Diamond engine. This one had the distributor mounted high beside the valve cover. As far as I know it was available in a 282 displacement in the 1940s ( different bore and stroke than Black Diamond 282 which came later in the mid 1950s) The Blue Diamond was available in a 308 displacement by the late 1950s The Blue Diamond had a blue valve cover. The place I worked summers during 1964 had a 1957 AC180 short cab with the Blue Diamond 308. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Ralph, I stated over on the Montana thread how I liked listening to the 6-cylinder engine used in the KB-6 engines. Does anybody know: was that a 282 cubic inch engine? I had a 1960 B-170 with a non-synchromatic 5-speed transmission and that engine. I sure liked that truck. I remember it as being 282 CU IN, or one cube smaller than the Chevy V-8 of that time period. Gary Whatever engine the KB-6 had as standard, with one side of the valve cover zigzagged and the other side straight, I think, that's the "sound" I'm thinking of. My B-170 had that same head and valve cover and sounded like the KB-6. My 403 combine may have had a 282 engine, but it sounded just like an old BD 240 engine would, and nothing like the KB-6. Or my B-170. Gary My BD 240 sounds pretty much the same as my BD 264. Loud! Not sure, did the 403 combine have a BD 264 engine as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Binder Guy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The larger KBs in that size had the Blue Diamond engine. This one had the distributor mounted high beside the valve cover. As far as I know it was available in a 282 displacement in the 1940s ( different bore and stroke than Black Diamond 282 which came later in the mid 1950s) The Blue Diamond was available in a 308 displacement by the late 1950s The Blue Diamond had a blue valve cover. The place I worked summers during 1964 had a 1957 AC180 short cab with the Blue Diamond 308. Geroge 2, Now you're talking! That's the engine I was referring to. Why did that engine sound so nice... and different than the black diamond? I know why the green diamond sounded its unique way as it was a flathead. I sure listened to a lot of them over the years. The first two combines I ran; a 123 SP and a 125 SPVC both had it. Trucks and pickups around the farm too. Then uncle Bill's 141 SP came with the BD engine. Such familiar sounds around the farm as a kid. But my favorite was that KB-6 engine and my B-170. Well, maybe the TD-40s and the two TD18A's engines were nothing short of fantastic sounding. Uncle Charley's pickup was a Chevy 6 and I could tell when it was coming, as well as the neighbor's Ford truck with its flathead V-8. Such memorable sounds, compared to today's engine sounds. Then later came the 806 & 1256 with its turbo, then the 4568 with its turbo V-8. I wish I could get a CD of those sounds to pipe into my room when I'm (Hopefully a lot) older in a rest home! I've darn near written non-rhyming poetry this morning! Sorry Ralph. I didn't mean to burn up so much web space here so meaninglessly. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta Dirt Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Nothing to do with farm machinery or trucks here------------but interesting enough to me anyway. Here is an advertisment from Ludlow, Vt. dated 1860. My great, great grandmother was a Pettigrew from Ludlow------------don't know as of yet how these two old boys are related. May be her brothers---or one could be her dad--------I gotta chase the family tree?? I don't think Ludlow was ever a metropolitan area??? Some of the viewers may be from up in that general area----------but, most surely a whole lot closer to Ludlow, Vermont than I am down here in Mississippi. I received this via e-mail today from a geneology specialist I have contact with up that way. Delta Dirt Avon Ms 38723 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Nothing to do with farm machinery or trucks here------------but interesting enough to me anyway. Here is an advertisment from Ludlow, Vt. dated 1860. My great, great grandmother was a Pettigrew from Ludlow------------don't know as of yet how these two old boys are related. May be her brothers---or one could be her dad--------I gotta chase the family tree?? I don't think Ludlow was ever a metropolitan area??? Some of the viewers may be from up in that general area----------but, most surely a whole lot closer to Ludlow, Vermont than I am down here in Mississippi. I received this via e-mail today from a geneology specialist I have contact with up that way. Delta Dirt Avon Ms 38723 Thanks for adding a bit of history to this thread Anson. Most old ads seem to give us a good insight into life back in that time. Now this ad here, some might get the wrong idea at first glance, but it is actually a Valvoline motor oil ad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Not meaningless at all Gary. Very descriptive memories. Its been a while since I've heard any of my Ford flatheads run but I sure remember the sound of it as well as that characteristic transmission whine that the trucks had. Like this 1950 Mercury for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Just another forgotten tractor brand. Regal tractor from 1949. Does that ad refer to a "Chrysler 8" flathead engine? I never knew (or else have forgotten) that Chrysler produced a straight 8 flathead engine.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George 2 Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Hard to tell from the picture but is that a V8. The hood is wide and the exhaust manifold looks like it might be on an angle. Otherwise I might be seeing something not actually there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Diesel Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'm with George, and it doesn't look right for a straight. Looks like the power statement would be justified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I really doubt that could be a Chrysler V8 . They were still building the flathead straight 8 up to 1950 according to this article at http://www.allpar.com/mopar/flat.html It is interesting reading. That flathead 8 was 323.5 cubic inches. It would make a powerful tractor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevingweq Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I looked around a bit and found a chrysler straight 8 made in the mid - late 30's and used in the Airstream's Then I found a small article about Regal tractors , They seem to have been multi-branded http://aveartfarm.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I looked around a bit and found a chrysler straight 8 made in the mid - late 30's and used in the Airstream's Then I found a small article about Regal tractors , They seem to have been multi-branded http://aveartfarm.blogspot.com/ Thats it Kevin. They had to lengthen the Airflow to accomodate the straight cylinder engine. I used to think those Airflows resembled a Volkswagen Beetle. Here is the type of Chrysler you might have found one of those straight 8 engines in. A 1950 Windsor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Binder Guy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Ralph, I can't say that I've ever seen a Chrysler straight-8 engine? I probably grew up under a rock?? I never spent much time around OLD Chrysler Corp. automobiles of the 1930s. I was always fascinated with the Chrysler Airflow, and I agree, one of their engineers must have sent drawings to Volkswagen in the late 1930s? I had an uncle who drove Plymouths all along and his son later drove Chrysler products. He had the first "hemi" engine I ever saw. I remember just thinking it would be difficult to change spark plugs in, as when they came out, they didn't have those "spark plug" sockets with the "grabber nabber" rubber inside. Now, since my father in-law had these; I spent a little time on a 21 Massey-Harris "Harvest Brigade" combine, a little more time on a 90 Special Massey-Harris and a lot of time on a Massey-Harris 92 (No, not a Super 92.). The 92 was one straw walker narrower than the Super 92. Anyway, my point, I've heard LOTS of Chrysler 6-cylinder engines in my ears, while harvesting. And of course, I could tell the difference between the Chrysler industrial 6-cylinder flathead engine and the flathead V-8s in his trucks! The Chrysler industrial 6-cylinder flathead was a different, but similar sound to the old Green Diamond IH engines I listened to on the 123 SP and 125 SPVC SP IH self propelled combines I grew up on. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Ralph, I can't say that I've ever seen a Chrysler straight-8 engine? Now, since my father in-law had these; I spent a little time on a 21 Massey-Harris "Harvest Brigade" combine, a little more time on a 90 Special Massey-Harris and a lot of time on a Massey-Harris 92 (No, not a Super 92.). The 92 was one straw walker narrower than the Super 92. Anyway, my point, I've heard LOTS of Chrysler 6-cylinder engines in my ears, while harvesting. And of course, I could tell the difference between the Chrysler industrial 6-cylinder flathead engine and the flathead V-8s in his trucks! . Gary Gary, I am guessing that Chrysler sold a lot more flathead six engines than straight eights. Considering how many Massey (and Cockshutt) combines had them. Not to mention Dodge and Fargo trucks, that six cylinder flathead sure got around. It made a lively pickup engine I know. Of course I prefer the V8 sound of that Ford truck in your photo. As seen here in this 1950 ad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Binder Guy Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Ralph, Thanks for posting that 1950 Ford ad. My wife grew up with that 1950 Ford 3/4 ton pickup and was the first thing she ever drove. She's peeking out the passenger window as her dad does something in the back of the pickup. Her dad let her take it up to the "North quarter" where they had a dump pile for "unused items," then back to the farm. It was also at that time her dad nicknamed her, "Barney Oldfield", whatever that meant??!!!! I may have sent you this ad before? It is the 25 hp Gaar Scott double simple "Montana Special" steam engine and I know you have some pictures of one that you'd posted on IH Tractors on a Montana Farm, in the past. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George 2 Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 OBG: Barney Oldfield was an early race car driver. Drove old 999. He was associated with the early Detroit auto industry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 OBG: Barney Oldfield was an early race car driver. Drove old 999. He was associated with the early Detroit auto industry What a perfect opportunity for me to post the vintage as I have showing Barney Oldfield driving a tractor and pull type combine. Unfortunately I can't find it on this computer. Maybe later. For now here is a forgotten name brand. Frost and Wood became a part of the Cockshutt Farm Equipment company and here is their combine in 1931. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George 2 Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Ralph: If you read Bill Cockshutt's book "About Cockshutt" you quickly find out the ties between Cockshutt and Frost & Wood. They were allied for a long time before they became part of Cockshutt. If you have ever been to Smiths Falls you would have to wonder about a farm equipment manufacturer being located there. Smiths Falls was at the eastern end of the limestone and bush belt in eastern Ontario. However the Rideau Canal ran through it and that was a major means of transportation into Lake Ontario, As such it was a good transport location in the 1800's. Then one of the railway from Ottawa to Toronto ran through there also. My uncles had a F&W mowing machine when I was a kid. They also made a variety of other implements. I once lived in Kemptville (about 15 miles east of Smiths Falls) back in 1967-68. F&W was all gone by then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Binder Guy Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Ralph, I have some Barney Oldfield pictures I can't find. I don't know why? One was him racing an Allis Chalmers tractor and may have been your picture in the first place? Would this have been it? I don't think so? Here are a couple pictures of Henry Ford's 999 racer. Roger may have more? Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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