counter shaft nut

[jnbru]

I have read several times over the many months that counter shaft nut coming off during operation seems to be a problem and below is some recommended fixes from other posts. My big question is the 1486 either 83 or 84 model had no lock washer nor Lock-tight nor anything else to keep it on. It was left hand threaded nut tho. Are the problem ones right hand threaded? I have seen that before. I am a first time owner and re-builder of these big IH tractors and I want to put if back together right the first time.

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I have been Red Locktiteing the countershaft nut,bending the tab on the lock, Staking the shaft-nut interface and Drilling and roll pinning. Might be overkill to some but I have never had one come loose after it has been in my shop. I have not tried spot welding but that would be fool proof also.

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I spot weld that big nut on after you torque it tight.............. piece of mind that it WONT come loose

[Ed Leaman]

The left hand version may be a little less likely to come loose but they can come off, they all get staked here, Many in east here put a spot of weld on threads or a roll pin as well.

ed

[Maynard]

I have read several times over the many months that counter shaft nut coming off during operation seems to be a problem and below is some recommended fixes from other posts. My big question is the 1486 either 83 or 84 model had no lock washer nor Lock-tight nor anything else to keep it on. It was left hand threaded nut tho. Are the problem ones right hand threaded? I have seen that before. I am a first time owner and re-builder of these big IH tractors and I want to put if back together right the first time.

Quote

I have been Red Locktiteing the countershaft nut,bending the tab on the lock, Staking the shaft-nut interface and Drilling and roll pinning. Might be overkill to some but I have never had one come loose after it has been in my shop. I have not tried spot welding but that would be fool proof also.

Quote

I spot weld that big nut on after you torque it tight.............. piece of mind that it WONT come loose

The right handed thread counter shafts were prone to loosening of the nut. The lock tab washer was eliminated with the introduction of the left hand thread shaft and nut. A roll pin and safety wire should be adequate insurance to prevent loosening. Welding the nut is overkill IMO.

[jnbru]

LOL I know what you mean about over kill.

[gonzo 1066]

You do have to understand the forces that actually loosten the nut. It is not the direction of the shaft or the threads. The hollow shaft flexes under heavy load, this causes the spacers to walk and wear. When the spacers wear (or the locking washer) there is clearence and the tension on the shaft (from the nut) lessens and THEN the nut starts to loosen. The key is to TORQUE CORRECTLY with a larger than stock nut. And fasten it with something other than the stock keyed and flanged washer. OVERKILL IS GOOD IN THIS OPERATION.

This kind of problem seems more prevelent in tractors that are used in very heavy tillage in 2nd and 3rd gear. Those being furthest from the bearings on ether end of the countershaft.

[jnbru]

I can see what you mean gonzo 1066. This 14 came out of Michigan and 3rd on the main shaft is shot! With 1/3 to 1/2 of every tooth missing, but the counter shaft gear looks good. From hard running, miss use or T/A is trash. I got T/A pieces every where and it still bolted in. I don't know if this is common or not but the bear cage I think it is called behind the T/A has 3 inch section broken out. I hope to break more of it down next weekend.

[Owen Aaland]

I always use the thicker nut and add a 1/8 X 1/2 roll pin with a safety wire.

No matter how well you tighten the nut it will become loose after enough use. Using the thicker spacers and the front thrust washer help but they will all become loose as the gears and spacers wear. The gears are not a press fit on the countershaft so there is always a little movement which eventually causes the wear on the spacers and gears.

[gonzo 1066]

I can see what you mean gonzo 1066. This 14 came out of Michigan and 3rd on the main shaft is shot! With 1/3 to 1/2 of every tooth missing, but the counter shaft gear looks good. From hard running, miss use or T/A is trash. I got T/A pieces every where and it still bolted in. I don't know if this is common or not but the bear cage I think it is called behind the T/A has 3 inch section broken out. I hope to break more of it down next weekend.

The shaft that goes into the rear of the TA is called the quill shaft. The quill shaft engages the upper constant mesh gear. The housing you mentioned being broke is probably the quill housing. There are aftermarket Quill housings available (HYCAPs is $88) Allied Precision is making a billit steel if you feel you need to go extra strong.

Do keep in mind that the torque spec for tightinig the countershaft should be used. Beg Borrow or Steal a big torque wrench. The proper torque will slightly streach the countershaft to help keep things tight.

[jnbru]

I found a torque wench I can barrow, think they said it would go well past what I need about 1600. Yes it is the one the quill shaft runs though. I am checking the local junk yards first, but they may not be any cheaper. It amazed me that the old thing would still move under it's own power. Either High was out for long time or they never used the T/A cable is siezed in low. On the way to shop to pull it down stop at a gate the t/a did fail had to drag it though the gate. Washed it down and the next day up and running again. It had 4 Sprag bearings parts, 6 springs and 8 large gear teeth in the bottom of the case. But despite all that the inside is still very clean and mostly un harmed.

[Maynard]

Torque speed transmission counter shaft nut to 300 ft. lbs. (right or left handed thread)

Old style thin nut is significantly less torque and I'm not going to look it up right now.

Jim N.

[acem]

I had a countershaft back off on my 706. Dad had the TA go out and a local shop repaired it (back when my dad's health was starting to slip but I had not come back yet). The tractor sit alot for a few years.

When I came back it got put to work. Within a SHORT time it would not go into 1st gear and was making lotts of shavings. I split the tractor and saw the ruined shaft. I bought a slavage 806 for parts (at the backgate auction in stutgart). I got it home, split it and it was the same... My friend who has a salvage yard said it was like finding two cross eyed horses.

Anyway I replaced the shaft and a couple gears. I torqued the nut to specs and locked the collar. It has run over 10 years w/o problem now.

Thx-Ace