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I just noticed that Fleet Farm is caring IH merchandise. It seemed about they had before was JD. Maybe Case IH finally realized how important this stuff is to fans.

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I just noticed that Fleet Farm is caring IH merchandise. It seemed about they had before was JD. Maybe Case IH finally realized how important this stuff is to fans.

Blain's Farm & Fleet has been handling the old IH/FARMALL stuff for a couple years, coffee mugs, thermometers, playing cards, T-shirts, etc. My Wife even bought me an IH/FARMALL wallet a couple months ago.

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The IH Archives now has the Corporate annual reports online. They're playing around with the website design, so the best way to find the annual reports is to search them.

Lee Grady has been promoted within the Historical Society. He's still covering the IH Collection, but there should be a new archivist in the new part of the year.

I did donate my service bulletin collection and spreadsheet to the archives, so if you are looking for them, hit up the Ask McCormick email!

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I retired in 2007 and started as a service Tech in a Company store in 1966 It has been my observation that up until the buy out in 1985 that poor judgement tipped the scales to the inevitable.

Too often people without decision making skills were PROMOTED into higher positions in the Co. rather than fired as they should have been. These people then hid behind office doors and things went downhill from there. Sum it up, Poor management and failure to reinvest in their future. ie: TA versus Quad rangeI never drove a true multi speed power shift until I drove a 6 speed Case in 1985 and I can tell you that if I was buying a tractor that day it would not have been red..

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I had seen it said here by somone that the M was behind its time compared to the olliver ( no live pto or hyd) but I have a hard time thinking the reason m&w sold so many handclutches, behlen had p/s units, m&w (and others ?) had live hyd add ons was because so many people would rather add these attatchments to what they considered a far superior tractor in the long run. I dont think at that time anyone with a row crop sold anywhere near the numbers farmall did, and in my observations a higher percentage of those farmalls have survived than others

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I had seen it said here by somone that the M was behind its time compared to the olliver ( no live pto or hyd) but I have a hard time thinking the reason m&w sold so many handclutches, behlen had p/s units, m&w (and others ?) had live hyd add ons was because so many people would rather add these attatchments to what they considered a far superior tractor in the long run. I dont think at that time anyone with a row crop sold anywhere near the numbers farmall did, and in my observations a higher percentage of those farmalls have survived than others

(I was always told this.) Oliver made a FINE tractor! But their dealerships were WAAAY fewer than I.H. , and the options/implements available for them were limited as well. It was harder to seek things out for them. As we know ,the H sold ONLY second to the Ford 8N in that era helping to boost the popularity of Farmalls.

As we know,they said "FARMALL" on the hood for a reason. Because the one tractor could be outfitted to do most ANY farm task of it's time.

More versatile, more options ,and more easily available to get them.

I have said on here MORE than a few times. I LOOOVE my Super M. It was my "dream tractor" . But if I was not allowed to have an I.H. ,my next choice would have been an Oliver Super 88 with ZERO regrets. ;)

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I have only read a little bit on this, but it seemed that when IH was restructuring to weather a changing market they tried to finance it with loans. Now you borrow to pay loans, and recieve a higher interest rate. They did what people were doing with credit cards today.

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I am new to red power and this site, but i did work at a IH dealer in the early 80s and always had red power on the farm. I think the fall was caused by many different things and no one reason was to blame, as with anything if you only knew then what you know now

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I retired in 2007 and started as a service Tech in a Company store in 1966 It has been my observation that up until the buy out in 1985 that poor judgement tipped the scales to the inevitable.

Too often people without decision making skills were PROMOTED into higher positions in the Co. rather than fired as they should have been. These people then hid behind office doors and things went downhill from there. Sum it up, Poor management and failure to reinvest in their future. ie: TA versus Quad rangeI never drove a true multi speed power shift until I drove a 6 speed Case in 1985 and I can tell you that if I was buying a tractor that day it would not have been red..

the thing that most dont think of when they talk about the TA is was that was the only shift on the fly on the market in 1954.

and we have had deere h the 4020 with the 8 speed power shift and m&w turbo was easy to drive but on our farm I had the choice between that or our 1206 with silver shift I always took the old 1206

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I had a great conversation today with a gentleman who worked at the Rock Island plant for several summers when he was a college student in the early 60's. He worked 11 pm to 7 am in the foundry, mostly shoveling sand off the floor.

He said the plant was very safety conscious, and when there was an incident, everything shut down immediately until it was resolved.
It sounds like the air was heavy with iron dust because he said his skin would be rust colored after a shift and it was uncomfortable. The plant handed out some special salve that was some sort of miracle cure. He said he still has a container of it. I believe it was called "hox salve" or something like that.

The best story was about a bar nearby that would cash paychecks on payday. There was 2 guys by the door with double barrel shotguns. You walked in by them, proceeded up the stairs and up there was a guy with a double barrel shotgun on his lap and he cashed out the checks, and often, most of the money never left the premises. The bar would only shut down from 5am to 6am for floor sweeping.

He said when the 806's first started rolling off the line there was a 60% scrapping rate.

Often the management would argue publicly and loudly on the floor between shifts over who would get what and when as far as supplies and components.

The Union protected fair amount of 'dead weight' who abused the system. 1 guy wandered around all day quoting Bible passages. 1 guy goofed off for 40 hours a week, but then worked well for overtime and piecework.

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So, a lot has changed in the 7 years since this thread began. Ag isn't exactly on top of the world presently. Lot of layoffs at all colors. What will become of it? I can't say I'm real excited about the Italian management of red. They're getting more and more like a European tractor every series. Is Racine in danger yet? I hope we don't have to read a book in the near future called "CaseIH, a Merger Tragedy"

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23 hours ago, Virginia Veg. said:

So, a lot has changed in the 7 years since this thread began. Ag isn't exactly on top of the world presently. Lot of layoffs at all colors. What will become of it? I can't say I'm real excited about the Italian management of red. They're getting more and more like a European tractor every series. Is Racine in danger yet? I hope we don't have to read a book in the near future called "CaseIH, a Merger Tragedy"

i don't think things are that bad for farmers yet but equipment companies seem to be getting hit. one big problem seems to be the way they've pushed people to lease over the last decade or so which has caused used equipment to pile up. the sheer amount of equipment that is only leased for 2-3 years has to end up somewhere. much of that equipment is also too big for the smaller farmer who either doesn't want it or simply can't afford it. with crop prices falling the small farmers have even less money to spend so that used equipment simply isn't moving and most of the bigger guys are still leasing just as they always have.

heard a rumour the other day that JD bought up 160 acres they plan to fence off to store excess used and repossessed equipment so it would seem they are preparing for the worst and with the way the equipment market is i really wouldn't be surprised if they end up filling that 160 acres pretty quick. also supposedly leasing prices are increasing 50% in an attempt to force people back to buying rather then leasing. not sure how well that's gonna go over now that they have have people used to always having the newest and greatest 

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Not exactly covering the time of IH being sold, but I joined Case IH as Manager of Combine Headers, one of 6 Engineering Managers we had in Crop Harvesting.  Three of us were located at the East Moline plant, the other 3 in Hinsdale.  The other 2 at East Moline had spent much of their career at the Rock Island plant.  We made at least one trip to Hinsdale weekly so I got to hear a lot of Farmall stories.  One of the guys, who was once head of the Tractor Operation, placed a great deal of the blame for failure on the McCormick family's insistence on being paid their dividend come **** or high water.  Of course the Axial Flow development took a lot of resources but the machine was in production and resources were once again being spent on tractors.  The Tractor QA manager said (and pardon me if I have an error here - we are talking nearly 30 years ago) they had redone the 2+2 and redesigning the power train so it was finally capable of handling the power (the original was cobble existing parts together and cross ones fingers) but along came Case and the project was scrapped.  He had saved copies of the publications - operators manual, sales literature, etc. - by grabbing them out of the trash as they cleaned out at the end.

I am not sure how things were during the International days but East Moline under Tennaco was not a good place to work.  An executive officer was hired from Chrysler and he brought a lot of Chrysler people along with him.  It was management by terror.  Part of the assembler's pay was based on output - if they achieved 100% they got their regular pay but could earn up to 140% with higher output.  I witnessed assemblers using rejected parts to assemble combines because if they waited to get corrected parts, their incentive pay went away.  For 1991 we managers were told by our executive VP that quality cannot be compromised; however, write into your employee's performance plan that their job depends meeting their cost improvement target.  If they failed to meet their annual target we were to terminate them.  Knowing their jobs were at risk, our Engineering staff took unbelievable risks.  Now that I am retired, I own one of those combines.  With many of my breakdowns I recall the cost reduction project that saved a person's job at a cost to the customer.  My used combine is old, over 4,000 hours.  The cost reductions implemented were usually good enough to get it through the warranty period but long term - not the old International standard.

I do have an earlier history with International.  My father became a dealer in 1939 and lost his dealership in 1954 when he would not build a new building in town.  He sold almost all the A's, C's, H's, and M's in this area.  Once International was gone, Case came knocking at the door.  We also farmed and switched to Case on our farm but I was very happy when my dad and uncle got fed up with Case quality and we bought our 806.  That was right as I graduated from college and left the farm only to return after retirement.

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I have caught a couple of misconceptions on here that seem to be repeated.  Seems several folks think that IH dropped out of the #1 equipment slot in the '80's, when the company was about to fail.  Not so - IH slipped into the #2 position, behind Deere, in 1958.  IH had just gotten rid of one of the worst presidents in its history, John McCafferty, and Deere was celebrating the first major changes made by a really sharp, really aggressive CEO, William Hewitt.  Hewitt was the first Deere president who was not content with running second place behind IH and made bold moves to change that situation.  McCaffrey put engineering and R&D on the back burner behind sales during his tenure, and when Deere replaced the 2-cylinders with the New Generation tractors, IH was suddenly and unfortunately placed in the position of playing catch-up, something they never quite managed to pull off, except possibly with the 88 series.

And guys, I have no problem with Case equipment or the Case company,  but there seems to be a repeated question here as to why anyone would prefer an IH over a Case.  If for no other reason, availability would have to play a part in that.  I live in Tennessee, and I cannot tell you where a single Case dealer was located in this state prior to the Case-IH merger, nor do I recall as a young man ever seeing any of that equipment for sale.  Case just wasn't readily available in this area, and you didn't see it in the fields.  I'm sure it was more available in other areas, especially up North where the farms are larger, but there is a very basic fact that needs to be recalled - from 1902 until 1958, IH was the world leader in agriculture equipment - and not by just a little bit, but by a very wide margin.  You could literally buy IH equipment pretty much anywhere in the civilized world, and few were the equipment companies that could legitimately make that claim.  And although there have been periods of time and certain models of IH equipment that were not up to par, I find it hard to believe that they could ever have achieved that position without superior products to back it up.

I have a good friend who managed a Case-IH dealership for a while, and his stories about his management training were interesting to me.  Like me, he approaches the Case-IH brand from the IH end.  He found it interesting, and somewhat discouraging, that the corporate managerial training focused almost entirely on the history of the Case company and made almost no mention of IH history prior to the merger.  Case-IH sure didn't achieve the "#2 equipment manufacturer in the world" status based on the Case name, whatever you or they may think of it.  And he found it amusing that they did admit that the reason that the Case-IH tractors are red is that the IH dealers who survived the merger refused to sell them in any other color. Since the IH dealers far outnumbered the Case dealers, the company was forced to abandon the Case colors for the new product lines.

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I don't know all the issues with the 86s that caused them to be unpopular, but another issue besides the shifting problems  that plagued those models were hydraulic system problems.  My dad bought an early 1086 in 1976 and had no end of trouble with it blowing O rings in the internal parts of the hydraulic system.  He lost 3 weeks of peak tillage season one year because of this, and spent a considerable amount of time and money trucking it back and forth to the dealership until he traded for a Deere 4440 in 1979.  He never looked back from that, but I always kept my preference for IH.

Kinda interesting to me was one of the posts on here about how the SoundGard cab on the Deeres drew customers away from IH.  Dad was just the opposite, one thing he missed after the trade was the larger cab on the 1086.  He missed the larger size and liked the fact that you could get into the IH cab from either side, whereas the Deere cab had only one door and it was a bit tight for him.

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On 2/12/2016 at 9:30 PM, flashy said:

 

The best story was about a bar nearby that would cash paychecks on payday. There was 2 guys by the door with double barrel shotguns. You walked in by them, proceeded up the stairs and up there was a guy with a double barrel shotgun on his lap and he cashed out the checks, and often, most of the money never left the premises. The bar would only shut down from 5am to 6am for floor sweeping.

He said when the 806's first started rolling off the line there was a 60% scrapping rate.

Often the management would argue publicly and loudly on the floor between shifts over who would get what and when as far as supplies and components.

The Union protected fair amount of 'dead weight' who abused the system. 1 guy wandered around all day quoting Bible passages. 1 guy goofed off for 40 hours a week, but then worked well for overtime and piecework.

Yes, The FARMALL TAP was a popular hang-out for workers.  The place suffered the same fate as Farmall.

The story I heard about the 706/806 series start-up was the design of oil circulation in the rearend casting REALLY pushed the limits of automated casting mold making technology available in 1963.  Thin wall steel conduit was used for oil flow paths inside casting walls.  Keeping those conduits in position while you poured 2700 degree molten iron into the molds took a while to perfect the process,  That's where the 50-60% scrap rate was.  Most castings were able to be reworked and within a month or so the amount of scrappage dropped significantly.

   I have seen many Nose-to-Nose confrontations on shop floors.  Most at Farmall were in the small Foreman and General Foreman offices located in every dept.  The offices were just big enough for a desk, a file cabinent, and 2-3 chairs.  Once you got over "Across the Street" into the upper managers offices the discussions got much more heated.  I was in the Manager of Material Procurement and Distribution when an Assembly Superintendant told him He thought it was "Time for a new Tire Buyer".  The Superintendant always tried to stir things up, cause drama, I had caught him screaming about being out of tires when I had been in the plant between Midnight and 2 AM finding the tires he needed scattered all over his department, most of them 20 feet from his office door.  I made him look like an idiot to my Boss's Boss's Boss.

There were two UAW locals at Farmall, #1309 for assembly and production personel,  and #1310 for skilled trades, tool makers, machine repair, electricians, millrights. Like all places that employ people, about 5% do anything and everything possible to keep production going, 20% try really really hard to keep things going. About 50% are your typical good employees, then 20% are the ones that do as little as possible, and the last 5% try to do anything but work all day every day.  I've been in plants that employ 3500, and about 650, and about 500, and about 300, 150, and 15.  Those percentages are accurate in all cases.  One Huge advantage a Union gives a company is a reliable source of trained manpower.  One place I worked, Not an IH plant, we had 3 unions,  one guy in one dept. wandered around all over the plant 8 hours a day, even in the front offices, I think he even worked over-time so he could wander around at Time and a Half.  I liked working a little over-time too, 4 to 16-20 hours a week.  One job I had I got paid straight time for actual hours worked.  I worked 3000 to 3200 hours a year.

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