IH Tractors on Montana Farm

[Old Binder Guy]

17 hours ago, Sledgehammer said:

I came across an Oil Pull that I might be able to afford coming up on a local auction. It’s one of the smaller models and has been repainted at some point....  Anybody know what model it is for sure?  Even looks like an experienced operator with it....

Todd, I'm going to call that a 20-30 Lightweight Oilpull you're kicking the tires on, since Roger is upset with me now and won't tell you the model. 

You should also buy one of these Oilpull Cup Grease buckets to keep your Oilpull in top shape. This one sold at auction five years ago. Rumely Oilpull Cup Grease bucket at auction sold for $1980.00 10-9-16.

Also you'll need one of these signs like mine. It's important to run "Dewaxed" "Triple Tested" Oilpull Oil in your new Oilpull. Gary😁

[Delta Dirt]

Quote: 

 "Rumley Oil Pull Cup grease bucket for $1980.00"--------blows my mind!!!!!

 

Where was the auction??   Was it expected to bring something in that range of value----or just a fluke????

Still scratching my head..........

 

DD

[Sledgehammer]

4 hours ago, Old Binder Guy said:

Todd, I'm going to call that a 20-30 Lightweight Oilpull you're kicking the tires on, since Roger is upset with me now and won't tell you the model. 

You should also buy one of these Oilpull Cup Grease buckets to keep your Oilpull in top shape. This one sold at auction five years ago. Rumely Oilpull Cup Grease bucket at auction sold for $1980.00 10-9-16.

Also you'll need one of these signs like mine. It's important to run "Dewaxed" "Triple Tested" Oilpull Oil in your new Oilpull. Gary😁

Those would make a nice addition to any collection Gary. This Oil Pull is for sure the light weight model. It was easier to transport that way. The smaller ones like that used less of your cup grease also making the 10lb bucket last a loooooooong time. 
 

I don’t have an OilPull sign but I did bring this crusty gem home yesterday. When I was a kid, there was a grocery/dry goods store in town called Stewart’s. The Stewart family has been here for many generations and had invested in the town as it grew starting in the early 1800’s. The stores have long since closed but I knew the son of the owner. This sign hung over the denim section of the store. Years after the store closed I asked the owner about this sign. He wasn’t interested in selling (which is fine). Fast forward probably 10 more years and the owner has passed away. The family was having a few sales to get rid of some things. I inquired to the son about the sign. We struck a deal on price and I was able to bring it home yesterday. Not that large and the well worn/chipped porcelain is rough but it is a memory to me of a place I admired as a child. 

[Old Binder Guy]

On 10/6/2021 at 5:45 PM, Roger Byrne said:

The model Oil Pull appears to be a 15-25 Model L or a 20-35 Model M because of the solid flywheel.  They had the same profile and they were built from 1924 to 1927.  In late 1927, they made a few minor changes including going to a spoke flywheel along with increasing the RPMs and they were re-rated as the 20-30 Model W and the 25-40 X.  They built these newer "Super Power" versions until late 1930.  After Allis-Chalmers bought out Rumely in 1931, Allis continued to sell the remaining stockpile of Oil Pulls as late as 1932.

The ringing sound you hear is the reason they got rid of the solid flywheel.  It made all the sounds in the engine a lot louder . . . like a bell amplifier. 

Roger, ol' buddy, ol' pal, I hadn't noticed this post when I posted about the 20-30 toy. You know I don't know (check your rubber boots) $h-- about the later Rumely Oilpull tractors. I was just being an ice breaker for Todd, I thought, but I just didn't look close enough. If you guys want me to stop posting on this thread, I'd understand why. After all, I think you and Anson are stalling somehow about getting that load of melons to Helena, Montana, up the Mississippi and Missouri Rivers.

I think he doesn't have the melons and he can't talk you out of the IHC AutoWagon, in order to deliver it to Silver Creek and lock it in the shed. I think you can picture in your mind what I'd look like driving it? I'd think that'd get you off of dead center and get that truck up here? After all, you can float it down the Mississippi River to Anson's Delta Dirt Estate.

And before I forget, I had a visitor at Silver Creek this afternoon. 

Tom Railsback stopped in from Great Falls today at Silver Creek Shop. We didn't have any ammunition, but we sure shot the breeze!

Just because you guys on here can't get along with my caps, the correct polka dot, generic or A. Blinkin's Hat, they get along just fine. They all live on my mill/drill in the machine shop at Silver Creek. I even keep that cursed "choo-choo" cap in the same room with the real caps. 

 

I've kept that Choo-Choo cap in case I ever get to pull the throttle on a live steam locomotive again, like I did in the 7th grade in Lewistown. It was no Big Boy or big locomotive, it was just an old Milwaukee RR "tea kettle" engine, but it was real on real tracks!

I had to put another photo of my mug here. I get smiley when I am behind the steering wheel of a Model T Ford. So you get this giddy, selfie from behind the steering wheel last week.  Gary😁

 

 

[Old Binder Guy]

Monday was Columbus Day, so federal employees got the day off. So, that was the day Mike chose to put the steam engines away, back into the shed for the winter. And speaking of "winter" this photo is what I saw when I got up, raised the blind and saw the white roof on Linda's condo across the street. Her roof is actually dark grey.

Well I ate a bite, drank coffee and fixed a cup to drive to SC. This was my view out the windshield after I ran the windshield wipers.

The engines set outside all summer, parked alongside Mike's shed as in this file photo.

Mike is an early riser and goes to work early at 0:Dark:30 at Fort Harrison. So he got up and had steam up by the time I arrived at 10:30.

Being so cold outside as it snowed most of the day, but didn't stick very often. The STEAM was so cloudy all the time around the engines. I had the 15 hp Case turning over in these photos.

The 1925 Model TT was in the road. The battery was dead, but I had the charger on. I started it on Battery and turned it over to magneto, and unhooked the charger. The truck went into the shop bay where the 1926 Model T Coupe set, because of the grain in the box that Mike mixes with oats, corn and barley.

The Coupe got moved to Mike's Garage.

Then there were a couple of McCormick-Deering tractors setting in the way. Audie, the 1936 TD-40 TracTracTor. The crawler and F-12 are both hand crankers. Mike moved the TD-40 up by the front door again, so it's handy to get out in case of an emergency.

And the Johnny 1935 Farmall F-12 needed moved, so it went outside for a while. Mike had the other IH tractors outside already.

The shed was pretty well cleared out. Mike then put the F-12 back into its winter berth.

Toot the 1942 IH Farmall M was setting outside. 

And so was Annie the 1939 IH Farmall H outside.

Mike parks Annie beside Johnny the F-12.

I had to make a couple of laps around the place with the Case, before we put it inside for the winter. I have video but no still photo. Mike backed it into the shed doorway where we removed the wood in the firebox (i.e. pulled the fire) and he backed it in. But Randy had showed up and he wanted to take the Reeves out to the cul-de-sac before putting it inside. The Fire Chief and wife from nearby Marysville drove in with his family. Randy gave his two boys and two girls a ride on the Reeves. It's always great to see the happiness a steam engine gives kids. Heck, even adults like them. Randy had to toot the whistles for the kids too.

These next two photos are "file photos" from last year. But you get the idea. Mike leaves a space between the engines to bring firewood into the shop from the woodpile.

Mike brought the IH 300 Utility and Toot into the shed. Again, I took video (that I can't post here, because I'm not doing YouTube) in the shed, but forgot to take a still photo.

After draining the engines' water tanks and getting the hoses hooked to the boiler drains, and drained, we went to the house for some of Mike's birthday cake and ice cream (yes... ice cream!) On the way to the house I took this photo of the mountain from Mike's driveway, that is just before you approach the Great Divide Ski Run.

I took this photo of the Elkhorn Mountains. They are partially visible from Silver Creek. I took this photo about six blocks from our apartment in Helena. We were supposed to get about 2" of snow overnight. It didn't show up though! 

I think that was about all of the decent photos I took. There were IH Tractors on a Montana Farm in this post!

Ooops, I forgot one photo. I only took one selfie of myself Monday.  Gary😁

 

 

 

 

 

[Poorboy]

Gary, I love all your machines!!! They are very beautiful!!! I wish to one day to our family machines this nice. Thanks. Jesse

[Old Binder Guy]

1 hour ago, Poorboy said:

Gary, I love all your machines!!! They are very beautiful!!! I wish to one day to our family machines this nice. Thanks. Jesse

Thank you Jesse. Ours are more mechanically right than aesthetically right, but we do have fun with them. I've been very blessed in this life to get to play with such toys. And some of those are IH Tractors on a Montana Farm too! Gary

[jeeper61]

On 10/4/2021 at 5:38 PM, Old Binder Guy said:

I think this is a TD-18 (I can't make out the exhaust pipe(s) for sure?) hauling pulpwood on ice in winter, in Maine.

 

On 10/4/2021 at 7:17 PM, hardtail said:

One on the timber line hard to say, TD18’s we’re used, looks to have 2 stacks but side by side?

Here is a close up of the crew on the pulp wood train 

What do you think the "blade" is for?

 

[hardtail]

Looks like for a V plow

[Delta Dirt]

3 hours ago, jeeper61 said:

 

Here is a close up of the crew on the pulp wood train 

What do you think the "blade" is for?

 

The heavy bar that the crew is standing on is part of the Bucyrus Erie angle dozer attachment.

The blade mounts with a pivot pin at the point of the V out front------with side arms that slide front and rear along the big bar that the boys are standing on--------angle done manually with pins dropping in to lock it in position.

Here is a picture of my TD14 pushing Dirt with same set up.

For drawbar work------I sometimes left the entire blade on or part of it as pictured for better weight distribution.

I believe these old boys have the drawbar  pull just about maxed out in the cat train picture!!!!  (wonder about braking when going downhill-------come in King of Obsolete)????

 

[jeeper61]

1 hour ago, Delta Dirt said:

The heavy bar that the crew is standing on is part of the Bucyrus Erie angle dozer attachment.

The blade mounts with a pivot pin at the point of the V out front------with side arms that slide front and rear along the big bar that the boys are standing on--------angle done manually with pins dropping in to lock it in position.

Here is a picture of my TD14 pushing Dirt with same set up.

For drawbar work------I sometimes left the entire blade on or part of it as pictured for better weight distribution.

I believe these old boys have the drawbar  pull just about maxed out in the cat train picture!!!!  (wonder about braking when going downhill-------come in King of Obsolete)????

Thanks Delta that explains it!!

Leave the blade off for the winter pulp wood train and put it back on for the summer road building work.

Nice old photo of your TD-14 working was that you on it?

[Old Binder Guy]

I am inclined to agree with Hardtail, that they used a "V-plow," similar to this massive snow plow being used, ca 1924-25.

But like Anson said, it can also be used for an angle dozer or blade. Some of the Bucyrus Erie (IH) hydraulic blades were not able to be angled. They were fixed in a 90° square permanent position. My late uncle Fritz's TD-14 had such a Bucyrus Erie fixed blade. Anson's and mine were able to be angled to either side discharge of material. So, like an erector set, I'd say the TD-18 hauling pulpwood had a couple of possibilities. 

Son Mike and Daughter Michaelle on the 1955 TD-18A, 181 series that I had. By pulling those pins on both sides, the blade could be angled either direction from square. There were holes for the pins in each of those positions. Below the front upper track support roller was a large pin on each side that held the larger channel to the main frame of the dozer. I am drawing a blank as to how, but the blade could be tipped with one corner bit lower than the other, for cutting ditches. The circular post can be seen behind the center of the blade, where the main frame hooks on. Ah, my "brane" just recalled that there were wedges on both angle frames, on the outer ends of the blade that allowed the blade to be tipped down on one or the other side, then the wedges driven back in with a big hammer.

So this TD-18 shows the main frame. Thanks for that photo, Jeeper61! It sure clears up whether that is a TD-14 or a TD-18!  Gary😁

[Delta Dirt]

1 hour ago, jeeper61 said:

Thanks Delta that explains it!!

Leave the blade off for the winter pulp wood train and put it back on for the summer road building work.

Nice old photo of your TD-14 working was that you on it?

 

Yep-----that is me (circa 1980 or so)

The bar (main frame) the boys are standing on also made for an easy step to climb up onto the tracks with.  Probably handy item in the ice and snow????

 

DD

[ray54]

The blade is 12 feet wide. You could angle it to be narrower but then it sticks it way out ahead. Three pins and the blade is off the U frame. So much faster and easier to just remove blade. And very possible if they wanted a V plow could be pined on very fast too.

But with the "train" they have in tow width of the blade would not be much in the way.

[oldscoutdiesel]

My TD-14A has the fixed blade and the factory called that a "bull dozer".  I think the adjustable blade was called a "bull grader".  That adjustability would allow it to put a grade on the dirt instead of just pushing it around.

[Old Binder Guy]

13 hours ago, oldscoutdiesel said:

My TD-14A has the fixed blade and the factory called that a "bull dozer".  I think the adjustable blade was called a "bull grader".  That adjustability would allow it to put a grade on the dirt instead of just pushing it around.

Thank you oldscoutdiesel, I knew there were two designations for those two styles of blades, but it had escaped me. And "Bull Dozer" has been an all encompassing term, whether IH, Cat, AC or Cletrac, it seems. I'll attempt to remember that mine was a "Bull Grader!" But I sure dozed dirt and snow with it! Gary😁

 

[mike newman]

1 hour ago, Art From Coleman said:

I, too, would like to know what that frame is for.

There are no brackets for mounting a blade to the push arms, just as there are no brackets that allow for angling a blade.

.......but  those''A"'  frame's  had vertical holes for the sidearms on those old   "B /E"  setups.....and surely there was yet another orifice   ...up in the apex of the  "A" frame for the blade pivot.........and, on those old set ups...there is / was   a state of the art   angling set up ,where the side arm  ''attached ' to the blade.....as in   Gary's picture of the TD18...

There are wedges  to remove...then after a super human effort to tilt /angle the blade...there are wedges to bash back  in....simple......certainly that was the way on the TD9 set up....

Unless I have missed something, obvious...which happens from time to time....surely that is the way of the mystery frame...????..No  ??

Mike

[mike newman]

12 minutes ago, Art From Coleman said:

If you look at the upper picture of the TD-18, you can see how the inner push arm can slide back into the outer part, and, as you say, to angle the blade must have been a source of much joy as the operator attempted to angle the blade after the two pieces had rusted in place or gotten full of dirt. (much like trying to adjust a adjustable front axle, after years of not being moved.

Now, look at the lower picture with the 'mystery frame', as it is all one piece, and as you say, doesn't even have a ball and socket to serve as a pivot point.

One could think that the frame is for a "push cup" for loading a scraper, as the frame angle would keep the push arms from getting into the rear tires on the scraper, but there appears to be NO attachment points for the push cup.

Sure Art.....but on the smaller  ""B/E"   type setups...there was just an orifice in the  apex of the "A"  frame as I prevously stated....and on the acompanying   "blade'...at the rear of said blade,,,in the middle ..there was an circular fitting , complete with two '' lugs'  which fitted over the apex of that 'A" frame...thus enabling the 'tilt''  to be accompished... the lugs were part of this ''circular fitting''..which was trapped behind a circular ring...which held this arrangement  in with fidteen or twenty studs,threaded into the ''base '' for this which in turn, was welded to the back of the blade

Now those Bucyrus   Erie   blade /''A''   and ""C'' frame setups were built in New Zealand , under license  , by CWF Hamilton  Ltd..(who invented the ''jet '' boat..)..in Christchurch....and how i have endeavored to describe the  intricate features  threreon.....is  how  TD6/9 and 14's were fitted up....

A less than concise explanation , Art....I hope you get the gist of it ...

Mike

[mike newman]

..in fact Art..if you look hard at that TD 18  of Gary's  ..it appears  to have that set up   ...as I described so accurately......in my synopsis  above.......??

Mike

[Fred B]

 

Gary, some years ago I was talking with a Canadian fella and he said that when using a train like in the picture, if they had to stop at night they would try to stop in a letter C form as much as they could (and then reverse a little to take all the slack out of each sled) so in the morning when they moved and all the sled runners would be frozen to the ground and if they started from a C shape, as each sled tried to straighten out it would break the ice that had it frozen to the ground, whereas if you tried to start from a straight line they could not move it.  Also, looks like that crawler has ice grousers.  

And that Model T, that guy sure must have had a positive attitude.  

I enjoy your photos.  

Fred

[Old Binder Guy]

Art, Please read Mike Neuman's explanation. There are no holes or brackets on the sides of that dozer frame.

Gary😉

[mike newman]

...Gary...I have brought a book from a ''pre owned ''   book shop.....a  book    about the plethora of ''bush tram lines ''   over all New Zealand...as the indigenous  forest, unique  to NZ   was , I   guess, 'raped' for the verdant green  farmland , NZ   is known for...There are photo's ''stolen '' from this book....by my old Canon   camera.......and I am putting this one on your site...I think it might amuse you !!  The other photo's  are on @jeeper61  topic...."'Logging Sleigh's "'

Quote  the text:  This home -made bush 'lokey'  conjures up images  of weird and wonderful   machines, built in back blocks    workshops, operated in obsure locations ...and long since fogotten

This one  was converted about 1904 from a Burrell      traction engine. The rear four wheels were driven by a chain...the front four were a bogie It was successful  enough for its owners, Manson and Co, to take it from Hawkes Bay...(about half way up the North Islands East Coast)...to Lake Brunner  on the West Coast...   (of the South Island...this  would have entailed quite an 'act'' given it required a trip on one of the old Steam Ships, that frequented NZ's Coastal Ports back in the days....and then having reached the South Island port of Lyttleton..also on the East Coast...it would then have to be taken across to the West Coast, through  a  Mountain  Pass, in one of two places...

Mike

[Old Binder Guy]

6 hours ago, mike newman said:

...Gary...I have brought a book from a ''pre owned ''   book shop.....a  book    about the plethora of ''bush tram lines ''   over all New Zealand...as the indigenous  forest, unique  to NZ   was , I   guess, 'raped' for the verdant green  farmland , NZ   is known for...There are photo's ''stolen '' from this book....by my old Canon   camera.......and I am putting this one on your site...I think it might amuse you !!  The other photo's  are on @jeeper61  topic...."'Logging Sleigh's "'

Quote  the text:  This home -made bush 'lokey'  conjures up images  of weird and wonderful   machines, built in back blocks    workshops, operated in obsure locations ...and long since fogotten

This one  was converted about 1904 from a Burrell      traction engine. The rear four wheels were driven by a chain...the front four were a bogie It was successful  enough for its owners, Manson and Co, to take it from Hawkes Bay...(about half way up the North Islands East Coast)...to Lake Brunner  on the West Coast...   (of the South Island...this  would have entailed quite an 'act'' given it required a trip on one of the old Steam Ships, that frequented NZ's Coastal Ports back in the days....and then having reached the South Island port of Lyttleton..also on the East Coast...it would then have to be taken across to the West Coast, through  a  Mountain  Pass, in one of two places...

Mike

Thanks for that Traction Engine Locomotive Mike. I have some photos of American examples. That must have been somewhat popular? Here are a couple of different Geiser Peerless engines built into them.

This is a Buffalo Pitts.

This is a Russell.

And this is a British built engine of some kind and is believed to be in Australia or New Zealand. They may even be of your family, Mike?🙃  Gary😁

[Delta Dirt]

On 10/17/2021 at 2:51 PM, mike newman said:

..in fact Art..if you look hard at that TD 18  of Gary's  ..it appears  to have that set up   ...as I described so accurately......in my synopsis  above.......??

Mike

 

Good job in describing the design Mike--------of course if you are in the northern hemisphere you would simply need to turn Mike's "synopsis" up side down!!!!!!

A close and enlarged view of the side view of Gary's TD-18 gives you a full picture of the angle and tilt mechanisms.

This situation is a case where a picture is definitely worth a thousand words!!!!

I bet the old Marines and SeaBees thought it was a major innovation during WWII.

 

DD

[Old Binder Guy]

3 hours ago, Delta Dirt said:

 

Good job in describing the design Mike--------of course if you are in the northern hemisphere you would simply need to turn Mike's "synopsis" up side down!!!!!!

A close and enlarged view of the side view of Gary's TD-18 gives you a full picture of the angle and tilt mechanisms.

This situation is a case where a picture is definitely worth a thousand words!!!!

I bet the old Marines and SeaBees thought it was a major innovation during WWII.

 

DD

Here are your US Marines using their TD-18 on the invasion of an island in the Pacific.

 

I had the blessing of getting to operate my late friend Carl W. Mehmke's USMC WWII TD-18 a few years back. I felt honored to also take an old former Marine for a ride on this crawler at that show. He'd operated on in the jungles building runways during WWII.

Ironically, Carl knew his neighbor had farmed with this TD-18. It had been repainted (Red, I believe?) after the farmer had removed all of the extra "stuff." The winch, the double seat and rear basket. When Carl asked about it, the neighbor asked if he was wanting any of the stuff he'd taken off and left setting "in the junk pile." Carl bought it and put it all back together and repainted it pretty correctly.

I had to take a photo from my operator's seat, just for old times sake! And incidentally, this TD-18 had been an IH Tractor on a Montana Farm.  Gary😁