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L10 versus 466


ky966boy

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1 hour ago, TroyDairy said:

Those Genesis 89xx are becoming the Blue magnums.  Seeing guys looking for them now for mixer boxes since they just love pto work it seems.

The Genesis tractors were every bit as good as anybody else's tractors built in the 1990s. Good engine, good transmission(in terms of both operating them and in durability), MFD axle that was the same as a Magnum except they offered SuperSteer so they would turn much sharper than a Magnum, a good hydraulic system, decent cab, etc.

A lot of New Holland dealers could have sold twice as many Genesis tractors if they had a modern shop/technicians to support a modern tractor. Previous to the Genesis, most New Holland(previously Ford) dealers sold a small number of tractors compared to their red & green counterparts because the Ford tractors were years behind Deere or IH/CaseIH in technology....Ford tractors were mainly sold because of the cheaper price. With the Genesis, they had to step up their game as now they had a tractor on par with a modern CaseIH or Deere. More than one New Holland dealer restricted the number of Genesis tractors they could sell just because they couldn't take care of that many tractors. Once the Genesis proved their overall reliability, the New Holland dealers were a lot more aggressive marketing them.

The only bad thing about a Genesis for PTO work is that only the small 8670 was available with a 540 PTO; all the rest of them were big shaft 1000 RPM only.

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18 minutes ago, acem said:

What happened to the Genesis tractor line after the merger?

Are they still made in another color?

As far as I know, they are still made/sold under the Versatile name.

When CNH formed, New Holland had to sell their products built at the Versatile plant in Winnipeg, which was the Genesis tractors and the Versatile tractors. Buhler bought the whole thing supposedly for $1. For a few years, they still even used the CNH 7.5L engine in the Buhler Genesis tractors. After a few years, they went to using Cummins common-rail 8.3L and 9L engines in the tractors. Eventually, the Genesis name was dropped, and they were more or less just referred to as a Versatile tractor. I've pretty much lost track of them 10-15 years ago anymore...no dealers around here. CNH ended up renaming their blue Magnums as Genesis tractors a few years ago again.

One of the head designers for the Ford/New Holland Genesis tractors was one of the main forces behind the design of the Magnum tractor during/after the Case/IH merger....a fella by the name of Dr. Glenn Kahle. He actually worked for Deere for years before coming over to IH before the merger, convinced Case's top brass to keep Hinsdale/Burr Ridge open and helped shepherd the Magnum tractor from concept to reality, and then went to New Holland to help with the Genesis design.

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10 hours ago, SDman said:

The Genesis tractors were every bit as good as anybody else's tractors built in the 1990s. Good engine, good transmission(in terms of both operating them and in durability), MFD axle that was the same as a Magnum except they offered SuperSteer so they would turn much sharper than a Magnum, a good hydraulic system, decent cab, etc.

A lot of New Holland dealers could have sold twice as many Genesis tractors if they had a modern shop/technicians to support a modern tractor. Previous to the Genesis, most New Holland(previously Ford) dealers sold a small number of tractors compared to their red & green counterparts because the Ford tractors were years behind Deere or IH/CaseIH in technology....Ford tractors were mainly sold because of the cheaper price. With the Genesis, they had to step up their game as now they had a tractor on par with a modern CaseIH or Deere. More than one New Holland dealer restricted the number of Genesis tractors they could sell just because they couldn't take care of that many tractors. Once the Genesis proved their overall reliability, the New Holland dealers were a lot more aggressive marketing them.

The only bad thing about a Genesis for PTO work is that only the small 8670 was available with a 540 PTO; all the rest of them were big shaft 1000 RPM only.

  Most Ford dealers around here operated out of very small facilities into the 1980's.  Worked OK when the N series was the focus and two N series could be worked on in a single bay garage (12X24).  Beyond plows and disks Dearborn implements were not much of a factor.  When former IH and AC dealers went looking for a new product to sell after the 1980's fallout Ford dumped nearly all of those old time dealers in favor of the former red and orange dealers.  

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11 minutes ago, 766 Man said:

  Most Ford dealers around here operated out of very small facilities into the 1980's.  Worked OK when the N series was the focus and two N series could be worked on in a single bay garage (12X24).  Beyond plows and disks Dearborn implements were not much of a factor.  When former IH and AC dealers when looking for a new product to sell after the 1980's fallout Ford dumped nearly all of those old time dealers in favor of the former red and orange dealers.  

On the New Holland side of things, there were a lot of New Holland company stores in SD back in the early/mid 1980s....even more so than Case company stores at the time.

As far as Ford, several IH dealers(and other dealers with other brands as well) took on the Ford tractor line even a few years before the Case/IH merger. Don't know if they thought IH's days were numbered, or if Ford allowed them to get into selling Ford tractors with little/no investment from the dealer's standpoint, or if there were other reasons, I don't know. That was a little before my time as far as working at a dealership. 

Then in the 1980s/early 1990s, Ford and New Holland merged, and New Holland closed up all of their company stores in favor of independent dealerships....many of which sold CaseIH as well. After CNH was formed, these all became known as "dual-brand" dealerships that sold both CaseIH and New Holland. There are quite a few dual-brand dealerships in South Dakota anymore....my employer operates most of them. 

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1 hour ago, SDman said:

As far as I know, they are still made/sold under the Versatile name.

When CNH formed, New Holland had to sell their products built at the Versatile plant in Winnipeg, which was the Genesis tractors and the Versatile tractors. Buhler bought the whole thing supposedly for $1. For a few years, they still even used the CNH 7.5L engine in the Buhler Genesis tractors. After a few years, they went to using Cummins common-rail 8.3L and 9L engines in the tractors. Eventually, the Genesis name was dropped, and they were more or less just referred to as a Versatile tractor. I've pretty much lost track of them 10-15 years ago anymore...no dealers around here. CNH ended up renaming their blue Magnums as Genesis tractors a few years ago again.

One of the head designers for the Ford/New Holland Genesis tractors was one of the main forces behind the design of the Magnum tractor during/after the Case/IH merger....a fella by the name of Dr. Glenn Kahle. He actually worked for Deere for years before coming over to IH before the merger, convinced Case's top brass to keep Hinsdale/Burr Ridge open and helped shepherd the Magnum tractor from concept to reality, and then went to New Holland to help with the Genesis design.

Funny over the years how one person can effect so many good designs. There are a few versatile dealers here in ND yet you see some new ones every once and a while.

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46 minutes ago, SDman said:

On the New Holland side of things, there were a lot of New Holland company stores in SD back in the early/mid 1980s....even more so than Case company stores at the time.

As far as Ford, several IH dealers(and other dealers with other brands as well) took on the Ford tractor line even a few years before the Case/IH merger. Don't know if they thought IH's days were numbered, or if Ford allowed them to get into selling Ford tractors with little/no investment from the dealer's standpoint, or if there were other reasons, I don't know. That was a little before my time as far as working at a dealership. 

Then in the 1980s/early 1990s, Ford and New Holland merged, and New Holland closed up all of their company stores in favor of independent dealerships....many of which sold CaseIH as well. After CNH was formed, these all became known as "dual-brand" dealerships that sold both CaseIH and New Holland. There are quite a few dual-brand dealerships in South Dakota anymore....my employer operates most of them. 

  There was only one NH company store in my part of NY (Finger Lakes region) so NH was almost always paired up with a dealer that had a tractor line.  Even with NH locations only 10 minutes apart there were not enough franchises for every Ford, Case, White, and AC dealer that wanted one.  This created issues during the 1980's in terms of having enough store traffic to survive.  Case was perhaps the earliest to see that this was going to present a major problem in its survival.  It had pared products out of its line and by 1980 with White declaring bankruptcy was in danger of losing its moldboard plow supplier.  Its marketing slogan at the time was "We're Case.  The tractor specialists" was in part to deflect from its contraction.  Many business publications around the time of the buyout of IH by Tenneco indicated that the biggest asset for Case was to be the IH dealer network which was accustomed to having a full line of equipment to sell and the facilities plus capital to do so.  There was one IH dealer during the late 1970's-early 1980's who was dualed up with products to match his IH offerings in terms of selling Hesston, Wilrich, Steiger, Deutz, and later Versatile plus Kinze as though he expected IH was not going to be around in the long term.

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On 6/22/2024 at 11:05 AM, jass1660 said:

They look like John Deere’s now

IMG_0012.png

When they first came out with that design they still used the maroon and cream paint, and I thought they were the ugliest tractor ever designed! Then they switched color schemes and I actually like the design!

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