Jump to content

Farmall 450-560 combo


Farmall560D

Recommended Posts

Was just wondering if it was possible or if anyone had ever done it? Was thinking it would be nice to use the back half of a farmall 560 with a farmall 450 engine. I like the reliability and power of the 450 but the better hydraulics on a 560 are nice. Or wonder if you could put the engine from a 450 into a 560 easily.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Putting the back half on a 450 tractor can be worked if you rig up a pressure hose and return hose to and from transmission. Few things to consider, if a clutch type pto the pto  drive gears would need changed to the planetary set to get PTO and hydraulic pump near speed. 560 has a deeper reduction ring and pinion that would also be slowed down with some trans gear options.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, DWV said:

Putting the back half on a 450 tractor can be worked if you rig up a pressure hose and return hose to and from transmission. Few things to consider, if a clutch type pto the pto  drive gears would need changed to the planetary set to get PTO and hydraulic pump near speed. 560 has a deeper reduction ring and pinion that would also be slowed down with some trans gear options.

I hear what you are saying but the RPM difference between the two is 350. I would surely think the C281 is capable of being turned up at least 10% on the RPM which would then put it at around 1600 RPM vs the 560 at 1800. If the Pto was retained from the 450 It should have the correct gearing to work properly on the tractor. You may loose a little hydraulic capacity it will still be ahead of the hydraulics on a 450. As far as gear selection you will loose a little speed but is it really enough to matter on a working toy... No. To me the hardest part is figuring out how to get all the controls and sheet metal configured correctly to look like a 450. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Our 560 diesel has been here since it was new in 1962, still feeds cattle every day the sun comes up.  It will pull a 7x14 high sided silage wagon loaded full up the fairly steep hill to the top of the silage pit in 3rd gear.  Pretty good power and reliability to me.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, JDpartsman said:

I hear what you are saying but the RPM difference between the two is 350. I would surely think the C281 is capable of being turned up at least 10% on the RPM which would then put it at around 1600 RPM vs the 560 at 1800. If the Pto was retained from the 450 It should have the correct gearing to work properly on the tractor. You may loose a little hydraulic capacity it will still be ahead of the hydraulics on a 450. As far as gear selection you will loose a little speed but is it really enough to matter on a working toy... No. To me the hardest part is figuring out how to get all the controls and sheet metal configured correctly to look like a 450. 

If a puller can get 3000+ out of 'em surely there's a way to get 1800.

Assuming stock RPM though, the PTO gearing starts at the flywheel. The ratio at the IPTO drive gear up front is different on the 560 vs the 450. You can get the TA clutch out of a 450 without any extra work, but if I'm not mistaken on a 560 you have to pull the PTO and the IPTO shaft to drop the driven gear out of the way to do the same job. On the 450 it's big driving little, and on the 560 it's little driving big.

I'm thinking if there is room to put a 450 IPTO drive and driven gear up front, the PTO and hydraulics will function more or less normally. You'll still be on the slow side with gearing, but 560s are geared fast anyway.

Now is the goal to make a 450-looking 560 or a 560-looking 450? That'll determine how much effort is required on the sheet metal. Personally I would keep the 560 sheet metal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably definitely easier to use the 560 tin as then you don't have to stretch the hoods 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/14/2023 at 9:48 PM, JDpartsman said:

I hear what you are saying but the RPM difference between the two is 350. I would surely think the C281 is capable of being turned up at least 10% on the RPM which would then put it at around 1600 RPM vs the 560 at 1800. If the Pto was retained from the 450 It should have the correct gearing to work properly on the tractor. You may loose a little hydraulic capacity it will still be ahead of the hydraulics on a 450. As far as gear selection you will loose a little speed but is it really enough to matter on a working toy... No. To me the hardest part is figuring out how to get all the controls and sheet metal configured correctly to look like a 450. 

450 high idle is 1600. I bought a 450 that was the fellows' big tractor many years back that ran a little over 1900. It had a lot of power but used considerably more gas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/14/2023 at 9:05 AM, Farmall560D said:

Was just wondering if it was possible or if anyone had ever done it? Was thinking it would be nice to use the back half of a farmall 560 with a farmall 450 engine. I like the reliability and power of the 450 but the better hydraulics on a 560 are nice. Or wonder if you could put the engine from a 450 into a 560 easily.

A lot of work to me. Just get a good if you can find 560, 656 or 706 diesel. Those engines will last for ever. The 450 was good but it sounds like more work than i would ever want to do. Plus if you breakdown you might have to stop and have a few certain parts made.

I do not know how happy you would be going from a 263 6 cylinder to a 281 4 cylinder. Dad had both in LP gas the 560 had honestly a little more power but always used oil from the first day it was new. 450 never used oil. Dad used to like to plant and do row crop work with the 560 as he said a "lot smoother power" his old timer hired hand loved the 450 though

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you should go ahead a try it. It'd be a cool repower. Just need a hyd pump delete distributor drive, to eliminate the engine driven hyd pump. 

Worst part of the swap, as said, will be lining the hoods up.

Good friend of mine, his dad bought a 450 new and farmed with it. Traded it for a 560, used it for maybe a day while plowing I believe, then called the deer and bring his 450 back. 560 would not lug down and pull like the 450 would while doing field work, always shifting down, not keeping up on speed. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Dan Robinson said:

I think you should go ahead a try it. It'd be a cool repower. Just need a hyd pump delete distributor drive, to eliminate the engine driven hyd pump. 

Worst part of the swap, as said, will be lining the hoods up.

Good friend of mine, his dad bought a 450 new and farmed with it. Traded it for a 560, used it for maybe a day while plowing I believe, then called the deer and bring his 450 back. 560 would not lug down and pull like the 450 would while doing field work, always shifting down, not keeping up on speed. 

my complaint having both, try lugging a 6cyl 263 you have to keep them wound up and singing - a 450 will lug all day long just depends on application 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...