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50 series early vs late.


acem

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7 minutes ago, hillman said:

other than JD every manufacturer was effected by bankruptcy, buyouts,mergers etc

 

 

 

 

 There were dealerships closing all over. I am not aware of an area not effected by the 80s. It was the worst economic event in my lifetime and people my age had no opportunities starting out of school.  I tend to think those who say it wasn't bad were not born or were children. IMHO it was a nightmare

  It was worse in some respects around here as we lost quite a number of non-farm employers.  At  one plant the company broke the union by 1985 so the jobs that remained were on pay scales less than half of original.  By 1985 I was wondering if taking ag economics in college was a wise choice.  Mom and dad a few times pondered out loud as to whether they wanted to keep going with the farm.  As I said before their were some that were not affected by grain and milk prices but they had their own worries.

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In mentioning the large inventory found on most IH dealers' lots in the early/mid 1980s, that is one big difference I can remember between IH dealers and their Deere dealer counterparts. I don't remember Deere dealers having the large glut of inventory like that. I think Deere was a little more prudent and conservative at the time.

Seems like a lot of IH dealers at the time felt that IH was pushing them to have too much inventory that was more than what the market could bare. I imagine IH was trying to help their bottom line by getting as much off the books as possible. This whole problem was created by Archie McCardell's partner in crime in IH management...a man by the name of Warren Hayford. IIRC, in the book "A Corporate Tragedy" it mentions that he previously worked in the tin can industry before coming to IH. His mentality was that a factory was most efficient when it operated 24/7/365. That probably works OK in the tin can industry where there is probably a steady demand for your product, but not in a cyclical industry like agriculture.  

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29 minutes ago, SDman said:

In mentioning the large inventory found on most IH dealers' lots in the early/mid 1980s, that is one big difference I can remember between IH dealers and their Deere dealer counterparts. I don't remember Deere dealers having the large glut of inventory like that. I think Deere was a little more prudent and conservative at the time.

 

I know from Iowa whose family had their IH dealership yanked away in 1985 and then went across town and bought the JD dealership tell me when they took over, there was 2 year old unsold tractors still on the lot and they had to dig new planters and tillage equipment out of the weeds.  Their dealership was in eastern Iowa.  I do recall reading IH's over production was another reason they faltered.  

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8 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

I know from Iowa whose family had their IH dealership yanked away in 1985 and then went across town and bought the JD dealership tell me when they took over, there was 2 year old unsold tractors still on the lot and they had to dig new planters and tillage equipment out of the weeds.  Their dealership was in eastern Iowa.  I do recall reading IH's over production was another reason they faltered.  

Even up until the early 1990s it wasn’t uncommon for a new piece of equipment to sit on the lot for a year or more. My Mennonite Potato buddy bought a mfwd 4455 from a Kansas dealer that was a year old and brand new. It was a nice tractor for its time. He had family in Kansas so he was always on the lookout for machinery wherever he went. He told me new outright price once also, 59,000 with loader valve added. Another neighbor here bought a new 1990 Chevy single cab 2 tone blue andwhite 1500 it was on the lot for a year and a half.

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On 3/21/2023 at 9:12 AM, Qc.Can.IH man said:

It may also have been to prevent radio theft. I see that @SDman mentioned that in his post also.

I know a couple of dealers in my area that would get the radios stolen out of the tractors while sitting in the yard. 

 

 

Theft was an issue, and IRRC that even a stolen knob required radio replacement as the knobs were not available as parts.  
I also remember removing the factory radio to install an aftermarket radio with the customer requested features.  It makes sense to only have to mess with the radio once at the dealer.  Brian

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Here’s a couple of 50 series tractors that I went to look at in April 2022

One was a 5488 that was built late in 1982 with an Elwood front wheel assist. It’s the only 50 series I’ve ever seen with an Elwood  
 The other one was a 1985 5088 FWA. According to the serial number it was the 27th from the last built 5088. It was the original owner with only 4450  hours. It even had the original rear tires on it. 
I was interested in both tractors but they were priced about $10,000 more than I was willing to pay. I’m kind of kicking myself for not buying them.

 

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2B3FD18D-89C5-4A4F-9330-CB4E019261DF.jpeg

C58D63FB-9682-461F-BFD8-DA0701D21061.jpeg

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23 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

I love this propaganda from any color.  Reading this makes me wonder why anybody bothered to buy any tractor other then IH. 

Good to see that Mr. AnythingButIH is still alive and kicking!

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On 3/21/2023 at 11:00 PM, Big Bud guy said:

I love this propaganda from any color.  Reading this makes me wonder why anybody bothered to buy any tractor other then IH. 

that propaganda was given to salesmen only . If I was an IH salesman or dealer  I would do cart wheels with the introduction of that tractor. The IH line up from top to bottom was second to none. Field demos would be exciting for the IH dealers . 

 In a better economy with an IH not mired in debt that series would have sold much better and they are the foundation of the Magnum,  too late IMHO but they addressed everything the 86 series haters could drag up 

 

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12 minutes ago, hillman said:

 

that propaganda was given to salesmen only . If I was an IH salesman or dealer  I would do cart wheels with the introduction of that tractor. 

 

I don’t doubt that for a second.  And IH was right talking about the 16 speed and 8 speed transmission. But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out
 

I have MF and JD salesman only literature plus 2 Cylinder Magazine reprinted some salesman literature put out by IH comparing their new 806 to the 4020 and it’s interesting as well.  

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1 hour ago, Big Bud guy said:

I don’t doubt that for a second.  And IH was right talking about the 16 speed and 8 speed transmission. But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out
 

I have MF and JD salesman only literature plus 2 Cylinder Magazine reprinted some salesman literature put out by IH comparing their new 806 to the 4020 and it’s interesting as well.  

LOL, this is a screen shot from one of Farmington's IH videos. 

 

" But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out" says who ?LOL    if IH had any money the Power shift they were developing would have been out sooner .

its hard for you to give IH  credit isn't it⁉️.

ihfarminting (3).jpg

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57 minutes ago, hillman said:

LOL, this is a screen shot from one of Farmington's IH videos. 

 

" But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out" says who ?LOL    if IH had any money the Power shift they were developing would have been out sooner .

its hard for you to give IH  credit isn't it⁉️.

ihfarminting (3).jpg

"Is this true shift on the go? If it is, old John Deere himself better prove it"  I might've fallen short of the quote word for word but if you've seen the video, you know what I'm talking about 

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2 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out

I’ve never driven the 15 speed but I have run the Deere 16 speed as found in the 8420.  That transmission still isn’t as well sorted as the 18 speed powershift that goes back to IH. 

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11 minutes ago, Farming Enthusiast said:

"Is this true shift on the go? If it is, old John Deere himself better prove it"  I might've fallen short of the quote word for word but if you've seen the video, you know what I'm talking about 

better described as " shift on the fly" LOL

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13 hours ago, hillman said:

But all that hype lasted only for a year before the green 50 series came out" says who ?

Was there any salesmen literature put out by IH for the IH 50 series vs JD 50 series.  Do you have any? 

15 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

I don’t doubt that for a second.  And IH was right talking about the 16 speed and 8 speed transmission. 

Apparently you glossed over this. 

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25 minutes ago, Gearclash said:

I’ve never driven the 15 speed but I have run the Deere 16 speed as found in the 8420.  That transmission still isn’t as well sorted as the 18 speed powershift that goes back to IH. 

Can you elaborate????  Would you a take a Tri 6 over either the 15 speed green or the 18 speed in the Magnum

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57 minutes ago, Farming Enthusiast said:

"Is this true shift on the go? If it is, old John Deere himself better prove it"  I might've fallen short of the quote word for word but if you've seen the video, you know what I'm talking about 

You beat me to it. I remember watching that film for the first time in March of 2014 and thought that line was killer. Neat film for sure. On DVD 13 there’s a short film of the 1256 verses the 4520 and DVD 15 there’s a film of the 4020 versus the 826. 

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26 minutes ago, IHhogfarmer said:

You beat me to it. I remember watching that film for the first time in March of 2014 and thought that line was killer. Neat film for sure. On DVD 13 there’s a short film of the 1256 verses the 4520 and DVD 15 there’s a film of the 4020 versus the 826. 

Yes I have them dvds as well. Some cool videos that Farmington Implement restored. Much respect to them for preserving history like that.

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27 minutes ago, Farming Enthusiast said:

Yes I have them dvds as well. Some cool videos that Farmington Implement restored. Much respect to them for preserving history like that.

Absolutely. I have all the DVD’s. This last weekend I spoke to Craig the owner of it all, for a couple hours. Speak to him once a year as they stay busy. Great people!

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1 hour ago, Big Bud guy said:

Can you elaborate????  Would you a take a Tri 6 over either the 15 speed green or the 18 speed in the Magnum

Can’t comment on the STS or the 15 speed. Never driven them. There is an excessive ratio jump between gears 15 and 16 on Deere 16 speed powershift. Really have to slug the engine down hard before downshifting or the engine will run against the governor and things get more herky jerky than they need to be. The 18 speed does not have that fault. 
 

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23 minutes ago, IHhogfarmer said:

Absolutely. I have all the DVD’s. This last weekend I spoke to Craig the owner of it all, for a couple hours. Speak to him once a year as they stay busy. Great people!

One of the stories he had in the "IH ALL THE WAY" segments that stuck with me is he has an 826 hydro with 15,000+ hours on it and although he's replaced the engine with a 360 the transmission has never failed. Just makes me wonder if the hydros got a bad rap because they got abused. 

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