407 rear main seal

[DT Fan]

Need to change the rear main seal on my 856. The manual says not to change the wear sleeve unless it is "worn, scratched, or nicked". The only way Case IH sells them is seal and sleeve. Do you just throw away the new sleeve if you don't use it? Is there an aftermarket seal available?

[Nebraska1206]

Any of them that I put a rear main seal in, I take off the old wear sleeve, and install the new wear sleeve with the new seal.  That seal is meant to be installed with new sleeve together with the seal installer.  Way too easy to roll the lip of the seal trying to do it without.

There are aftermarket seals that are like the more traditional spring-loaded lip seal, but I've never used them.

[R190]

At one time you ordered the sleeves separately from the seal that quit years ago.

. Now they come as a unit as seal technology has changed this is one place where I would deviate from a book written  53+ years ago and use modern recommended practices also every bodies idea of worn ,scatched or nicked  tolerances is different along with seal positioning I would definaly replace it.

 

[hippy5488]

the case ih one is aftermarket. from reliance

[stronger800]

X2.  100% is aftermarket from reliance. I bought one two  years ago for our 856, CNH bag, says reliance on the inside. I have never seen a ring that was not worn, we have always replaced them. 

[ksfarmdude]

Replace all of it 

[stronger800]

There’s also that gasket behind the seal retainer plate

[DT Fan]

Ok, thanks for all the insight.

Next question; Does this job use the same install tool as the 400 series engines? Friend of mine has one I could use.

Jobs like this are a little intimidating when you've never done anything quite like it and really don't want to have to do it twice.

[nepoweshiekfarmalls]

@Dan Robinson

[R190]

2 hours ago, DT Fan said:

Ok, thanks for all the insight.

Next question; Does this job use the same install tool as the 400 series engines? Friend of mine has one I could use.

Jobs like this are a little intimidating when you've never done anything quite like it and really don't want to have to do it twice.

The  black seal installer tool from IH years ago ( OTC I think) was drilled for both, the later aftermarket stuff I have no idea as I got mine when the 400 series engines came out. The silver one was just the 361-407 maybe the 429.

[stronger800]

I borrowed the tool out of our dealer mechanic’s truck. When he gave it to me he said that he had  just used it on his 1466.  It was black. 

[Farmall1066]

Same tool as 466

[ksfarmdude]

I made one that I use on the 400 series engines

[Dan Robinson]

Use the Teflon lip style seal not a rubber lip with the spring. 

The same tool for 361/407 as for used with 400 series. 

[DT Fan]

8 hours ago, Dan Robinson said:

Use the Teflon lip style seal not a rubber lip with the spring. 

The same tool for 361/407 as for used with 400 series. 

Is the Teflon lip style available at the dealer?

[CIHTECH]

36 minutes ago, DT Fan said:

Is the Teflon lip style available at the dealer?

Yep, 

1809964C92, you can purchase it almost anywhere and you will probably get the same thing regardless of where you get it. Truck shop, Navistar dealer, auto parts store, Ag Parts, Hy-Cap and so on....

That said I order from Ag Parts or CNH depending on what all parts I need for my job. If doing a clutch job then from Ag Parts as that is where clutch comes from. If doing other engine work, I order from CNH along with the rest of the parts. 

[FarmerFixEmUp]

I'm getting these from Don's Diesel. No reliance markings anywhere.

[DT Fan]

Update, of sorts. Talked to a friend of mine about doing this job for me. He has a great shop and much more knowledge than I. He's pretty busy but he didn't say no. Well, talking to him last night, he thinks the rear main seal is probably ok. He's thinking it's hydraulic fluid getting on the clutch. Makes sense to me. Engine oil would have to get around the flywheel to get to the clutch. Will still have to be split but one less thing, (hopefully) to fix while in there.

[stronger800]

When it’s split, usually for a clutch, we always replace both.    And resurface flywheel. And replace Ipto shaft and seals and bearings

[Gearclash]

3 hours ago, DT Fan said:

He's thinking it's hydraulic fluid getting on the clutch.

That’s perfectly possible.  I have an 856 that oils the clutch from the trans side.  Amazing how long that clutch is lasting under a feeder wagon -- poor man’s wet clutch.  Just don’t try hauling down the road with it.   If there is oil dripping out the clutch housing it will soon be obvious which side it is coming from -- engine oil will be black, trans oil translucent.