High School Guidance Counselors

[Dirt_Floor_Poor]

My daughter had a back to school night the other day and it just got me thinking about my experiences with school in general. I couldn’t wait to graduate and get out of there. I miss the friends I made and even a few of the teachers, but the biggest reason was that I wanted to get to work. I wanted to farm. The last few years of high school involved mandatory meetings with the guidance counselor for every student to discuss what your plans were after high school. I told her on several occasions that my plans were to farm full time with my dad and my grandfather. She told me every time that my plan was not a good one and that it would almost certainly fail. I needed to pick a better career and the only way to have any success at all was by going to college. I did end up going to college for a little bit, but it was obvious that if I wanted to make the farming work I was going to have to give it all that I had. Trying to farm after school was never going to work. Of course my plans didn’t work out exactly how I thought, most notably because my grandfather died shortly after my graduation, but in general I was able to make it work. I was just wondering if other people had similar experiences with people that “know best” trying to steer them in directions that they did not want to go, especially your school. My experience sure makes me want to pay close attention to what someone is trying to tell my kids. 

[nate]

If the counselors would focus more on telling the kids to get off their as! and work if you want things in life. I think there would be a lot better outcome for most

[766 Man]

  Don't know the background of your high school counselor to know where she was coming from.  I started college during the early 1980's.  Day one item one was about your expected future on the farm.  The instructor was right to the point in terms of what a student's financial capabilities might be.  Just because the neighbor can swing a 25 cow addition to the barn does not mean that you can.  Which means do not assume you are on the same financial footing as your neighbor and don't expect him to be straight with you as to his.  Second was more farm families fight over finances and responsibilities than a person can imagine.  If dad, grandpa, and uncle shout at each other at the top of their lungs every day this means likely division will happen with the farm being sold.  Third, if the first two items are highly relevant then no shame would be had to walk out the door and into another major or off campus altogether.  Better to figure it out when you are 18 instead of 40 with a bottle (of alcohol) in your mouth or a gun aimed at the side of your head.  As to the high school counselor I did it twice.  Both came out the same in that they were just doing what they were obligated to do with no more concern than that.  As far as they were concerned maybe a couple dozen names in a class mattered (out of almost 200) in terms of college and everybody else could go stock shelves, flip burgers, or change tires.  I had a couple close friends in high school but other than that it was something I had to endure in order to get to college.  In those days getting into college was very iffy with a GED.   

[edwardporter1]

I garuated in 1972. The counselor called me in May of that year informed me I didn't have enough  credits to graduate. I grabbed the paper off his desk and pointed out  his arithmetic was wrong. DUMB sob couldn't add the numbers correctly. So much for his guidance. He couldn't find his way out of a paper bag. I went on to ag college and was a successful  farmer till Jimmy Carter destroyed the farm economy along with everything else

[766 Man]

2 minutes ago, Art From Coleman said:

The only things I would change would be the number (possibly 5) out of a class of 52 +/-) that were the chosen few.  No one ever mentioned college to me despite being #3 on the ACT scoring.  (I hated dear old DHS, as much as I hated the town)(With the exception of the most excellent hamburgers/cheeseburgers at one of the local beer joints)

In truth, I probably, NO, I know that I would have partied myself right out of college.

As it turned out, TSTI gave me a useful education, that allowed me somewhat of a secondary career, when I went stupid and quit Halliburton after 19 years, learned some of the tricks of the trade, and bought a boatload of Snap-on tools, during the three years I was a John Deere "technician", before going back to work another 18-19 years for Halliburton, where I got to see lots of airports, and ocean views.

  The counselors at my school did not care and especially when it came to me.  They were almost downright hateful including saying that quite a number of my good attributes would be better spent on someone else.  I took college very seriously because I figured nobody would be there to pick me up if I stumbled.  Also, at that time lenders such as Farm Credit were insisting that young borrowers have some college.  The farm crisis of the 1980's was far worse two years in versus the start of college.  You could see the attitude shift in real time.  

[Dirt_Floor_Poor]

28 minutes ago, 766 Man said:

  Don't know the background of your high school counselor to know where she was coming from.  I started college during the early 1980's.  Day one item one was about your expected future on the farm.  The instructor was right to the point in terms of what a student's financial capabilities might be.  Just because the neighbor can swing a 25 cow addition to the barn does not mean that you can.  Which means do not assume you are on the same financial footing as your neighbor and don't expect him to be straight with you as to his.  Second was more farm families fight over finances and responsibilities than a person can imagine.  If dad, grandpa, and uncle shout at each other at the top of their lungs every day this means likely division will happen with the farm being sold.  Third, if the first two items are highly relevant then no shame would be had to walk out the door and into another major or off campus altogether.  Better to figure it out when you are 18 instead of 40 with a bottle (of alcohol) in your mouth or a gun aimed at the side of your head.  As to the high school counselor I did it twice.  Both came out the same in that they were just doing what they were obligated to do with no more concern than that.  As far as they were concerned maybe a couple dozen names in a class mattered (out of almost 200) in terms of college and everybody else could go stock shelves, flip burgers, or change tires.  I had a couple close friends in high school but other than that it was something I had to endure in order to get to college.  In those days getting into college was very iffy with a GED.   

I could respect someone if they were informed and were telling you to be careful. There were people who I went to school with who were mediocre athletes at best. When they said they wanted to try and play their sport on a higher level no one in the school told them to get real, that’s never going to happen. When I had conversations about what I thought were reasonable and attainable goals I was told to forget it, it will never happen. It just makes my blood boil to think about how much bad advice just this one counselor gave out over her many years of employment. I never heard her even one time even mention that someone should consider becoming an apprentice or learning a skilled trade. All it was, was college, college, college. No wonder so many young people are mad about student debt and no future. So many counselors in the country are telling them that if they go to college it will be smooth sailing from then on. Nobody is telling them to work hard at whatever they choose and give it your all to try and make it work. 

[766 Man]

8 minutes ago, Dirt_Floor_Poor said:

I could respect someone if they were informed and were telling you to be careful. There were people who I went to school with who were mediocre athletes at best. When they said they wanted to try and play their sport on a higher level no one in the school told them to get real, that’s never going to happen. When I had conversations about what I thought were reasonable and attainable goals I was told to forget it, it will never happen. It just makes my blood boil to think about how much bad advice just this one counselor gave out over her many years of employment. I never heard her even one time even mention that someone should consider becoming an apprentice or learning a skilled trade. All it was, was college, college, college. No wonder so many young people are mad about student debt and no future. So many counselors in the country are telling them that if they go to college it will be smooth sailing from then on. Nobody is telling them to work hard at whatever they choose and give it your all to try and make it work. 

  I saw the same thing with athletes at my high school.  Like I said the staff was all in on a few students and aloof as to the rest.  No one made a career out of being an athlete.  Fact was nearly all had humility handed to them in college.  Some said many years later failing at that point was the best thing that happened to them.  That they finally saw past all the praise and worked on what they needed to do to have a good career and be good with their families.  

[oldtanker]

I remember in grade school and high school being preached at over and over and over "you don't want a job where you get dirty, you need to go to college". Left a high school that graduated a thousand kids a year and moved to rural MN. Same thing. College, College College. Now back in those days you could major in about anything and get a decent job. I graduated HS in 73. Today we have far more college grads than needed except in a few career fields. Tons of folks out there with serious degrees in things like management and business that can't find a decent job because the market is flooded. Lots of others with degrees in things like music and interpretive dance who's diplomas should have had a WalMart application printed on the back of that diploma. We as a nation need to stop sending kids to college for things that they will be lucky to find a job. And we need to teach kids that there isn't a darned thing wrong with getting dirty or working with your hands! 

 

Rick  

[Frank H]

I went to a school that graduated 135 of us. The entire experience I got with guidance was "What do you want to do after high school?"" I don't know. " . That was it. Guidance was only there to cater to football players. 

[vtfireman85]

I went to a private college prep school. I did go to college, did not finish and have developed a deep disapproval of the practice of funneling kids into college. 
i can cite probably more examples of being a total waste and a huge debt associated with it that they are paying off doing unrelated work than i can point to people using their degree. 
i will gladly support my daughter if she chooses a career path requiring a college degree, but I refuse to push her into it. 
her mother, who has a masters in education would agree with this philosophy. 

[zleinenbach]

I worked on furnace at my guidance counselors house and said “who’s the dummy now!!?”

we were scorned, the vocational rejects I do recall being labeled by teachers in school.

Like said above if the shoe fits, wear it.

college isn’t for everyone and honestly, many would be more successful if they steered clear.

 

on a side bar, probably unrelated, but don’t the charge interest on student debt? Someone’s making money

[Ihfan4life]

6 minutes ago, zleinenbach said:

 

on a side bar, probably unrelated, but don’t the charge interest on student debt? Someone’s making money

I believe it’s a high “fixed” rate too. I’m not sure if you save any interest by paying the loan earlier than it’s due, either.

 

[Finney]

Graduated in 73. Counselor told us if we didn't go to collage we would wind up digging ditches for minimum wage. Saw her at our 10th reunion, asked her if she wanted to compare pay stubs, then I asked about all the collage graduates in my class making 20-30,000. 

I wonder if the collages paid a bounty to the counselors to get kids to sign up.

[Dirt_Floor_Poor]

The ones making money hand over fist because of student loans is the colleges and universities that you pay all the money to. People are talked into “higher education” because it doesn’t matter if you can pay for it. We can get you a loan. My brief period of time in college was like going to a used car dealership. They can fix you right up with this loan or that loan, pay years and years later.

[zleinenbach]

Just now, Dirt_Floor_Poor said:

The ones making money hand over fist because of student loans is the colleges and universities that you pay all the money to. People are talked into “higher education” because it doesn’t matter if you can pay for it. We can get you a loan. My brief period of time in college was like going to a used car dealership. They can fix you right up with this loan or that loan, pay years and years later.

Yep and the 18year old boys I graduated with had about 2 things on their mind, and financial security and planning weren’t in the top 10 let me tell ya

[TractormanMike.mb]

I graduated class of 95, we were told that we had to go to college if we wanted any chance of an employer even looking at a resume or application. One English teacher even devoted a segment of his class to the whole job seeking process. We had to do a cover letter, resume, application and all that stuff. If you got one thing wrong, didn't dot an I or cross a t or left out punctuation it was tossed out because "that's what the people in human resources do". I've never written a cover letter or resume and only filled out one application in my working career and I think I've done ok for myself.

When I graduated, my focus was to get my autoCAD certification and work in that field. Long story short, I decided a career in agriculture was a better fit for me. So many people tried to talk me out of it or tried encouraging me to at least get my certification and then I wanted to I could " play on the farm" and I would still have that to fall back on. The problem with that was that software is constantly changing so even if you are certified, it could be outdated making it worthless. 

A few comments were made about sports. I'm all for high school sports, the lessons it teaches and its a great outlet for those athletes and they need that. that being said, I also think sometimes way too much emphasis is put on it. When I was a junior, we went to a tech fair at a local technical college. My mechanical drawing instructor signed me up for the mechanical drafting competition. We were basically sat at a drafting table and given a sheet of paper with a written description and dimensions of an object that we were to draw a picture of.  Probably much the same way that a draftsman would be handed a project.  Out of nearly 100 competitors from the greater north eastern Wisconsin area I finished second place. On the bus ride back to our school our vocational ed instructor was telling us how much of a big deal this was for our school and that we would definitely be hearing about this in the next mornings announcements. Well, we didnt. Someone broke two school records at a track meet that same day so that was all everyone had on there mind the next day. Yay sports!

[560Dennis]

I never had a meeting with guidance counselor that I remember , maybe to drop a class . 
Did fine without them . Nothing else positive to say 

[vtfireman85]

 

[zleinenbach]

15 minutes ago, vtfireman85 said:

 

Lies !!!! You’re an electrician!!!!!!!

[Binderoid]

4 hours ago, edwardporter1 said:

I garuated in 1972. The counselor called me in May of that year informed me I didn't have enough  credits to graduate. I grabbed the paper off his desk and pointed out  his arithmetic was wrong. DUMB sob couldn't add the numbers correctly. So much for his guidance. He couldn't find his way out of a paper bag. I went on to ag college and was a successful  farmer till Jimmy Carter destroyed the farm economy along with everything else

You garuated? Apparently the credits you were lacking was in English 😜

[vtfireman85]

7 minutes ago, zleinenbach said:

Lies !!!! You’re an electrician!!!!!!!

Don’t  you start with me i don't need your crap. 
jackass ignorant BS . UP YOURS! 
I would kick your a$$ but the ADA would be all over me. 

[iowaboy1965]

1 hour ago, Ihfan4life said:

I believe it’s a high “fixed” rate too. I’m not sure if you save any interest by paying the loan earlier than it’s due, either.

 

It's came down from 8.2 ish to 7.2 I was told recently. This same person's school loan debt had tripled in the last 15 or 20 years and probably quadrupled from the time he and his wife graduated.  Granted some mistakes or bad luck was probably involved here. I don't claim to know how the whole system works but something is off with how things are done if this story is correct. And I have little reason to doubt the basic facts given by this person.

[edwardporter1]

15 minutes ago, Binderoid said:

You garuated? Apparently the credits you were lacking was in English 😜

Spell check. A new invention since I matriculated

[ray54]

I graduated in 73 and sports where important in my home town. But that was not my thing, but out of 200 graduates one did make it into Major League Baseball. He only played in a handful of games but one was with the Detroit Tigers in a World Series game and he got a RBI. Spent most of his years at Kansas City, couching and scouting. 

 

I don't ever remember talking to a counselor.  I was involved in FFA and the adviser moved next door in the summer between my junior and senior year. My father was not allowed to finish high school as his dad rented property 8 mile from home and sent him to farm it with 8 head of horses. So my dad insisted his kids went to college. Wanting to farm and having a good ag school 40 miles away I went. In most ways I don't think it made that much difference but I got that diploma somewhere. Oh the other part of that met my wife at college.  

But my wife is where a worthless councilor comes in. My wife is a natural born elementary school teacher. All she ever wanted to be, as kid did not like summer vacation, could not wait for school to start again. She had councilor talk her out getting a teaching certificate. Was a Ag Business major when we met.

After having 3 kids and getting the youngest into kindergarten, and volunteering 2 or 3 days a week at school a principle talked her into taking a test or 2 and start subbing. Which lead to 2 years of night classes and finally the credential she should have gotten years earlier.  She retired in 16 but has gone back to subbing at the country school 2 of our grandkids go to. 

[zleinenbach]

30 minutes ago, vtfireman85 said:

Don’t  you start with me i don't need your crap. 
jackass ignorant BS . UP YOURS! 
I would kick your a$$ but the ADA would be all over me. 

Only two things stopping you….

Fear 

and common sense

 

well distance too I guess