Really!!!! Are the American people this dumb?

[mmi]

On 2/10/2022 at 7:49 PM, Art From Coleman said:

Was that a requirement to getting an education?

Watching a bunch of NO IQ, drug addicted, criminally inclined buffoons in their silk pantaloons, chasing each other around, playing grab azz with each other is NOT my cup of tea..

A 'minority' is still too many, and a total waste of tax money.

$2mil  was the latest (only 3yr old) refab to  high school track circle,but thats PC bc 60 days a year "PUBLIC"  "can" (but < 30 do)use it.

ALL this BS should be on PAY PER USE,along with cidiotes on full HOA $$$$$   not my back.

90% of the school and govt buildings are < 15 yrs old. $100 mil in last 10 years.

We are getting a $30 Mil ($10 m over budget) taj mahal, town center to keep up with the jones/s.   old govt center to be razed and rented to grocery chain/despite ALL those put it in writing,not interested P &L dont work there.

each prior farm to cidiote village includes $75K + per year tax funded open space,where the govt employees sleep 1/2 the day,we dont need more at each school site for 60 days use.

grounds keeping is more $ than many of your total local govt $

[lorenzo]

4 hours ago, mmi said:

$2mil  was the latest (3yr) refab to  track circle,but thats PC bc 60 days a year "PUBLIC"  "can" (but < 30 do)use it.

ALL this BS should be on PAY PER USE,along with cidiotes on full HOA $$$$$   not my back.

What language is that ?  I read it three or four times and it makes absolutely no sense what so ever .  

[hardtail]

I think he's saying $2 million upgrades to either rail transit or bus routes, politically correct because 60 days a year less than 30 people use it 

The users should pay what it costs along with the city idiots on full handouts instead of on the working stiffs that pay taxes

I realize I could be way off

[jeeper61]

30 minutes ago, lorenzo said:

What language is that ?

It must be old school or maybe no school 

Not a delict I am familiar with and I am pretty good with most street and backwoods jinglish  

[jeeper61]

5 minutes ago, hardtail said:

I think he's saying $2 million upgrades to either rail transit or bus routes, politically correct because 60 days a year less than 30 people use it 

The users should pay what it costs along with the city idiots on full handouts instead of on the working stiffs that pay taxes

I realize I could be way off

Well done you should be a translator 

[ksfarmdude]

On 2/8/2022 at 7:48 PM, lorenzo said:

If it was a frozen pizza, the Box would probably taste better anyway

[yellowrosefarm]

5 hours ago, mmi said:

$2mil  was the latest (3yr) refab to  track circle,but thats PC bc 60 days a year "PUBLIC"  "can" (but < 30 do)use it.

ALL this BS should be on PAY PER USE,along with cidiotes on full HOA $$$$$   not my back.

I'm reading it as; it took 3 years and 2 million dollars to refurbish the local walking track that  only gets used by about 30 people, 60 days a year. And, instead of property taxes paying for it, it should be funded on a pay as you use it system.

[cjf711]

1 minute ago, yellowrosefarm said:

I'm reading it as; it took 3 years and 2 million dollars to refurbish the local walking track that  only gets used by about 30 people, 60 days a year. And, instead of property taxes paying for it, it should be funded on a pay as you use it system.

 

1 minute ago, yellowrosefarm said:

I'm reading it as; it took 3 years and 2 million dollars to refurbish the local walking track that  only gets used by about 30 people, 60 days a year. And, instead of property taxes paying for it, it should be funded on a pay as you use it system.

Some of these things like parks, or dog parks, or schools, or bike trails seem to cost alot of money but can be major factors to why people live in your community,  A bike trail may be the difference in the decision a general practice MD makes on where he lives and decides to set up his practice?  Does the school have a swimming team for his daughter?  Not saying its right, but, I dont think i agree with pay as you go urban planning really either.  Just because its good for the community doesnt mean its good for everyone in the community.

 

 

 

 

 

[Diesel Doctor]

If, or when, everything goes south, we will have to deal with the people who are receiving the hand outs.

They will continue to want and that will be what we have.

It will be a mess unless this is straightened out, and soon.

You cannot let the asylum be run by the inmates.

There will be a day of reckoning.

It is time we look out for #1, US!

[Diesel Doctor]

What is a battery?' I think Tesla said it best when they called it an Energy Storage System. That's important.

They do not make electricity – they store electricity produced elsewhere, primarily by coal, uranium, natural gas-powered plants, or diesel-fueled generators.  So, to say an EV is a zero-emission vehicle is not at all valid.

Also, since forty percent of the electricity generated in the U.S. is from coal-fired plants, it follows that forty percent of the EVs on the road are coal-powered, do you see?

Einstein's formula, E=MC2, tells us it takes the same amount of energy to move a five-thousand-pound gasoline-driven automobile a mile as it does an electric one. The only question again is what produces the power? To reiterate, it does not come from the battery; the battery is only the storage device, like a gas tank in a car.

There are two orders of batteries, rechargeable, and single-use. The most common single-use batteries are A, AA, AAA, C, D. 9V, and lantern types. Those dry-cell species use zinc, manganese, lithium, silver oxide, or zinc and carbon to store electricity chemically. Please note they all contain toxic, heavy metals.

Rechargeable batteries only differ in their internal materials, usually lithium-ion, nickel-metal oxide, and nickel-cadmium. The United States uses three billion of these two battery types a year, and most are not recycled; they end up in landfills. California is the only state which requires all batteries be recycled. If you throw your small, used batteries in the trash, here is what happens to them.

All batteries are self-discharging.  That means even when not in use, they leak tiny amounts of energy. You have likely ruined a flashlight or two from an old, ruptured battery. When a battery runs down and can no longer power a toy or light, you think of it as dead; well, it is not. It continues to leak small amounts of electricity. As the chemicals inside it run out, pressure builds inside the battery's metal casing, and eventually, it cracks. The metals left inside then ooze out. The ooze in your ruined flashlight is toxic, and so is the ooze that will inevitably leak from every battery in a landfill. All batteries eventually rupture; it just takes rechargeable batteries longer to end up in the landfill. 

In addition to dry cell batteries, there are also wet cell ones used in automobiles, boats, and motorcycles. The good thing about those is, ninety percent of them are recycled. Unfortunately, we do not yet know how to recycle single-use ones properly.

But that is not half of it.  For those of you excited about electric cars and a green revolution, I want you to take a closer look at batteries and also windmills and solar panels. These three technologies share what we call environmentally destructive embedded costs.

Everything manufactured has two costs associated with it, embedded costs and operating costs. I will explain embedded costs using a can of baked beans as my subject.

In this scenario, baked beans are on sale, so you jump in your car and head for the grocery store. Sure enough, there they are on the shelf for $1.75 a can. As you head to the checkout, you begin to think about the embedded costs in the can of beans.

The first cost is the diesel fuel the farmer used to plow the field, till the ground, harvest the beans, and transport them to the food processor. Not only is his diesel fuel an embedded cost, so are the costs to build the tractors, combines, and trucks. In addition, the farmer might use a nitrogen fertilizer made from natural gas.

Next is the energy costs of cooking the beans, heating the building, transporting the workers, and paying for the vast amounts of electricity used to run the plant. The steel can holding the beans is also an embedded cost. Making the steel can requires mining taconite, shipping it by boat, extracting the iron, placing it in a coal-fired blast furnace, and adding carbon. Then it's back on another truck to take the beans to the grocery store. Finally, add in the cost of the gasoline for your car.

A typical EV battery weighs one thousand pounds, about the size of a travel trunk.  It contains twenty-five pounds of lithium, sixty pounds of nickel, 44 pounds of manganese, 30 pounds cobalt, 200 pounds of copper, and 400 pounds of aluminum, steel, and plastic. Inside are over 6,000 individual lithium-ion cells.

It should concern you that all those toxic components come from mining. For instance, to manufacture each EV auto battery, you must process 25,000 pounds of brine for the lithium, 30,000 pounds of ore for the cobalt, 5,000 pounds of ore for the nickel, and 25,000 pounds of ore for copper. All told, you dig up 500,000 pounds of the earth's crust for just  one  battery."

Sixty-eight percent of the world's cobalt, a significant part of a battery, comes from the Congo. Their mines have no pollution controls, and they employ children who die from handling this toxic material. Should we factor in these diseased kids as part of the cost of driving an electric car?"

I'd like to leave you with these thoughts. California is building the largest battery in the world near San Francisco, and they intend to power it from solar panels and windmills. They claim this is the ultimate in being 'green,' but it is not! This construction project is creating an environmental disaster. Let me tell you why.

The main problem with solar arrays is the chemicals needed to process silicate into the silicon used in the panels. To make pure enough silicon requires processing it with hydrochloric acid, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, hydrogen fluoride, trichloroethane, and acetone. In addition, they also need gallium, arsenide, copper-indium-gallium- diselenide, and cadmium-telluride, which also are highly toxic. Silicone dust is a hazard to the workers, and the panels cannot be recycled.

Windmills are the ultimate in embedded costs and environmental destruction. Each weighs 1688 tons (the equivalent of 23 houses) and contains 1300 tons of concrete, 295 tons of steel, 48 tons of iron, 24 tons of fiberglass, and the hard to extract rare earths neodymium, praseodymium, and dysprosium. Each blade weighs 81,000 pounds and will last 15 to 20 years, at which time it must be replaced. We cannot recycle used blades. Sadly, both solar arrays and windmills kill birds, bats, sea life, and migratory insects.

There may be a place for these technologies, but you must look beyond the myth of zero emissions. I predict EVs and windmills will be abandoned once the embedded environmental costs of making and replacing them become apparent.  "Going Green" may sound like the Utopian ideal and are easily espoused, catchy buzzwords, but when you look at the hidden and embedded costs realistically with an open mind, you can see that Going Green is more destructive to the Earth's environment than meets the eye, for sure.

[Steve C.]

15 hours ago, Diesel Doctor said:

It will be a mess unless this is straightened out, and soon.

You cannot let the asylum be run by the inmates.

 

[MTB98]

14 hours ago, Diesel Doctor said:

 

 

Also, since forty percent of the electricity generated in the U.S. is from coal-fired plants, it follows that forty percent of the EVs on the road are coal-powered, do you see?

 

Einstein's formula, E=MC2, tells us it takes the same amount of energy to move a five-thousand-pound gasoline-driven automobile a mile as it does an electric one. The only question again is what produces the power? To reiterate, it does not come from the battery; the battery is only the storage device, like a gas tank in a car.

 

 

Electricity production is not 40% coal in the US. Coal as a source of electricity generation has been declining for 20 years. 

Your formula about energy use doesn’t take into consideration the inefficiency of burning fuel in an ICE. That is <30% efficient use of the energy potential of a gallon of gasoline or diesel. Electricity generation is much more efficient and an electric motor is about 90% efficient at converting energy to propulsion power. There is also the fact that single point emissions (from a power plant for example) is easier to manage and control than emissions from millions of independent sources through millions of tailpipes. 

The same arguments about energy used to make batteries would apply to making ICEs and drivetrain components. What happens to old used up starting batteries, engines, transmissions etc now?  They are recycled just like EV batteries will be recycled. 
 

If you want to have an honest debate you need to have facts correct and not only cite the negatives for one form of energy. 

[int 504]

According to what I've read and a conversation with an engineer friend solar panels are net losers on the carbon equation. The cradle to grave carbon to manufacture, install, operate and dispose of (recycle?) a solar panel exceeds the carbon value of the energy it produces during its lifetime. Thus every solar panel installed makes climate change worse not better. This is starting with the minerals in the ground and those costs.

[Pid 1831]

Interesting website.

https://gridwatch.co.uk/

 

shows the uk electricity generation by type compared to demand.

 

Seems to work better on a mobile device whilst set as A desk top site.

[Gearclash]

On 2/13/2022 at 6:57 AM, MTB98 said:

Your formula about energy use doesn’t take into consideration the inefficiency of burning fuel in an ICE. That is <30% efficient use of the energy potential of a gallon of gasoline or diesel. Electricity generation is much more efficient and an electric motor is about 90% efficient at converting energy to propulsion power. There is also the fact that single point emissions (from a power plant for example) is easier to manage and control than emissions from millions of independent sources through millions of tailpipes. 

Everybody goes wow gaga over the efficiency of the motors in EVs.  The reality is that efficiency losses of EVs are a shell game.  Physics is physics and chemistry is chemistry; when energy gets converted from one form to another losses occur.  Looking at the entire energy flow for EV: most of the efficiency losses occur at the electrical generation point.  In the case of natural gas there is about a 50% energy efficiency turning gas BTU into electricity.  Then the losses of transmitting and distributing electricity.  Then there are losses during EV battery charge, and again at discharge.  Then all the losses of the motor and drivetrain.  Plus some efficiency loss getting the NG from the well to the power plant.  Compare that with ICEV energy losses from well to road and EV is somewhere from negative to 10% more energy efficient than ICEV depending on the source of electricity.  

There is no doubt that managing emissions is easier at a few power plant vs many automobiles but at what overall cost is that worth it?

Then there is the concern where all the electricity would come from that it would take to make the entire US vehicle fleet EV.  I’ve worked that out and I just shake my head.  

40% of our electricity comes from natty gas; and we wonder why, when there is a severe widespread cold snap, the electric generation system is maxed out.  Too much demand on one energy source.  

None of this is hard to figure out.  All the numbers are out there, and the science behind it is high school level.

[Matt Kirsch]

On 2/10/2022 at 11:09 AM, IH 986 said:

Even have directions on how to carry their pizza.

They're just trying to be cute there...

[MTB98]

18 minutes ago, Gearclash said:

Everybody goes wow gaga over the efficiency of the motors in EVs.  The reality is that efficiency losses of EVs are a shell game.  Physics is physics and chemistry is chemistry; when energy gets converted from one form to another losses occur.  Looking at the entire energy flow for EV: most of the efficiency losses occur at the electrical generation point.  In the case of natural gas there is about a 50% energy efficiency turning gas BTU into electricity.  Then the losses of transmitting and distributing electricity.  Then there are losses during EV battery charge, and again at discharge.  Then all the losses of the motor and drivetrain.  Plus some efficiency loss getting the NG from the well to the power plant.  Compare that with ICEV energy losses from well to road and EV is somewhere from negative to 10% more energy efficient than ICEV depending on the source of electricity.  

There is no doubt that managing emissions is easier at a few power plant vs many automobiles but at what overall cost is that worth it?

Then there is the concern where all the electricity would come from that it would take to make the entire US vehicle fleet EV.  I’ve worked that out and I just shake my head.  

40% of our electricity comes from natty gas; and we wonder why, when there is a severe widespread cold snap, the electric generation system is maxed out.  Too much demand on one energy source.  

None of this is hard to figure out.  All the numbers are out there, and the science behind it is high school level.

The inefficiency of gas and diesel is <30% at the end use, it doesn’t account for alll the transportation costs and inefficient transporting oil from halfway around the world. Lots of complicated math to do a total in depth analysis comparing the two equally. You could also calculate required maintenance over their lifespans, EV has almost none while ICE requires frequent fluid and filter changes. 
EVs do have some drawbacks and shortcomings as do ICEs.

[Gearclash]

16 minutes ago, MTB98 said:

The inefficiency of gas and diesel is <30% at the end use, it doesn’t account for alll the transportation costs and inefficient transporting oil from halfway around the world. Lots of complicated math to do a total in depth analysis comparing the two equally.

I have done the research and crunched the numbers -- EV and ICEV are not that far apart from a total  propulsion energy use efficiency standpoint.

Yes EV is low maintenance -- until the battery goes bad.  Then big $$$$$.  Currently around $15,000 to replace the battery in a Tesla.

EV has a place, but it won’t be practical to substantially replace ICEV for a long time yet.  

ICEVs could be a lot more energy efficient but the will to accomplish that clearly isn’t there.

[N S]

On 2/8/2022 at 9:00 PM, mmi said:

(only option) scan, auto calculate hasnt reached you yet?

trouble is they cant do MONEY even when it tells the change, the poor protected class that lock the doors 20 minutes early from being over worked ,5 customers per hour.

Gommermint employees, the only reason they get hired is because they follow what ever they're told without question. Hence they can't get fired cause they wouldn't find world elsewhere. The reason the schools have gone to teaching the new modern math, for gommermnt employees who can't count, now any answer is correct. Example: 2 + 4 = 1321. Makes perfect sense to me. And if you don't believe it you're wassist.

[N S]

On 2/9/2022 at 4:54 AM, Wes806 said:

When that happens totally. Guess that's when I'll have to stop living cause cash is all I know and use.

I always have preferred cash unless it's very hard to use, such as now having to buy parts from 3-4-6 states away. They don't want to take cash anymore, but then see how they glamour for cash when the lectric no worky and they don't have any riches but the lint in their pocket. When the lights go out and all your wealth is tied up in digital currency, U B Broke son. And yet everyone is simply enthralled by the digital currency. Cept for us that paid attention to grandpa.

[oldtanker]

Lotta complaints about young folks here. You were not born with knowledge. You had to learn things!

Most day to day life skills I have learned was from my parents. Dad taught me how to use tools and fix things. Taught me financial responsibility too. Mom taught me how to cook, clean, do laundry and repair clothing as needed. She taught me how to shop for food too. Together they taught me right from wrong and how to stand on my own feet.

What you have today is kids who's parents taught them nothing. Most likely their parents taught them nothing either. When I was a kid on Saturday mornings my dad did maintenance on the car, lawn mower or garden tractor (1960's). I had to help. Or he was fixing something else. Washer, dryer, replacing a door ECT. My friends were playing ball and riding bike. All dad did was wash and wax the car. My friends actually came to my dad to learn the stuff I was learning. Don't knock the kids. Often you can't even knock the parents. Look at grand ma and pa. Course may not be their fault either. Could be the great grand parents. 

By the time I retired from the Army trainees were being taught financial management and how to balance a check book. That was in the early to mid 90's. So this isn't a new problem. 

 

Rick

[mike newman]

11 hours ago, N S said:

I always have preferred cash unless it's very hard to use, such as now having to buy parts from 3-4-6 states away. They don't want to take cash anymore, but then see how they glamour for cash when the lectric no worky and they don't have any riches but the lint in their pocket. When the lights go out and all your wealth is tied up in digital currency, U B Broke son. And yet everyone is simply enthralled by the digital currency. Cept for us that paid attention to grandpa.

,,,good to see you are still above the grass...

Mike

[hardtail]

And you Mike been very quiet from NZ?

[midnightman]

9 hours ago, oldtanker said:

Lotta complaints about young folks here. You were not born with knowledge. You had to learn things!

Most day to day life skills I have learned was from my parents. Dad taught me how to use tools and fix things. Taught me financial responsibility too. Mom taught me how to cook, clean, do laundry and repair clothing as needed. She taught me how to shop for food too. Together they taught me right from wrong and how to stand on my own feet.

What you have today is kids who's parents taught them nothing. Most likely their parents taught them nothing either. When I was a kid on Saturday mornings my dad did maintenance on the car, lawn mower or garden tractor (1960's). I had to help. Or he was fixing something else. Washer, dryer, replacing a door ECT. My friends were playing ball and riding bike. All dad did was wash and wax the car. My friends actually came to my dad to learn the stuff I was learning. Don't knock the kids. Often you can't even knock the parents. Look at grand ma and pa. Course may not be their fault either. Could be the great grand parents. 

By the time I retired from the Army trainees were being taught financial management and how to balance a check book. That was in the early to mid 90's. So this isn't a new problem. 

 

Rick

Definitely have to agree with you. I think as western society we have slowly let this happen over the years. Parents that want things easier for their kids than they had growing up. School systems that teach so many things without focusing on the basics first. The constant distraction of the internet and social media. It’s made it hard for people to develop any confidence in decision making and problem solving skills. As an employer trying to train apprentices and a parent, I’ve almost had to become a psychologist. It’s hard for an individual to do anything different when they have been led to believe that this is right and normal. That’s all that they see around them, so why would they do anything different.

[oldtanker]

3 hours ago, midnightman said:

Definitely have to agree with you. I think as western society we have slowly let this happen over the years. Parents that want things easier for their kids than they had growing up. School systems that teach so many things without focusing on the basics first. The constant distraction of the internet and social media. It’s made it hard for people to develop any confidence in decision making and problem solving skills. As an employer trying to train apprentices and a parent, I’ve almost had to become a psychologist. It’s hard for an individual to do anything different when they have been led to believe that this is right and normal. That’s all that they see around them, so why would they do anything different.

Yep. Not only did I have to learn to balance a check book in high school there were other life skills we learned too. It's just simple. Kid can't know how to do something if they were not taught how to do it in the first place.

Things they should teach in HS besides math, English and history?

Financial management. Things like budgeting, balancing a bank statement and such. Plus credit, again how it works. How to figure total cost ECT.

Insurance. What it does, how it works and why you should have it.

Check vehicle fluid levels and change a tire.

How to buy food and plan a balanced meal plus how to cook it.

They could make it one class called "Life Skills". Make it mandatory to graduate.

 

Rick

 

Rick