Jump to content

N14


756puller
 Share

Recommended Posts

Got a case ih 9390 in with an n14 Cummins customer wants running around 535hp so he can pull his big disc ripper. Has anyone ever done this before? I know it takes bigger injectors and time just don't know the process of it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

N14s in Steigers were all mechanical with the exception of the 9300 series Quadtracs, which just had an electronic governor with a mechanical engine otherwise. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, 756puller said:

Don't see a controller at all, just the old go like **** cable

They change the fuel button and idle fuel pressure when they set the hp up. And no it isn’t like advertised just pour the fuel to them every Cummins engine has a cpl number. There is a manual that has the tune up fuel settings required for those CPLs.As you jump up in hp let’s. Just use the p180 quoted. They had the same cpl as a 976 versatile I believe. 14 to 1 compression pistons a certain cam shaft key to retard timing. Remember as fuel and hp go up you have to retard timing to make engine live. Now you jump to the 9390 with the N14 it is actually a little different engine not much. The 9180 had a big cam 3 now the 9390 has the N14 variant. It would have a different cam profile by a bit, different cam timing, I think 13 or 13.5 to one compression, double nitride treated pistons and a few other things. You can bump them 50 hp reliably but when changing big power you need to change other parts for reliability. I watched a guy Change my buddies 946 to our 976 engine cpl when we overhauled it. The 946 eas 310 hp 976 350 just like the 9180 mentioned. I put factory parts back in our 976. Buddy had local Cummins guy put a different piston number in his. I think they were the 425 hp cpls. He didn’t change cam shaft although he had it out. The camshaft key required to be changed. But over the years of doing this he figured out the timing could be set with the minimum base gasket and a real thin shim gasket on the follower.It was within Cummins  specs to do it like that but not an orthodox way to do it. Just saying if going up in hp that much you need to address lots of other things. You just don’t put a magic fuel button in and leave it at that. You need to address timing and injectors also. A 9390 would be a better tractor than the smaller ones to bump up the power on.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The N14’s in the 93xx tractors were mechanical. They don’t have an ecm. They are STC engines (step timing control)  and are different from the 855’s in the 91xx series in that manner. They ran some STC N14’s in trucks in the early 1990’s then went to ecm and electonic injectors.   To your question you would need to change button in fuel pump and probably do bigger injectors and turbo to support that kind of power I would guess.  We had Midwest Injection set the pumps on all of our 9370’s to 425 horse. You will probably run into the same problem we did. We had them loaded up with all the weights we could stack on but we still would spin before we ran out of power. We had 3 of them that way. They ran 7 shank rippers, dirt scrapers, and pulled 7400 gallon manure tanks.  I can say they ran reliably at 425 horse and didn’t get hot.  You would probably want to check cpl on cummins quickserve to see if it has ceramic coated pistons or not. I don’t think they are. I also want to say our 9370’s had a one piece piston but the N14 in my semi that I overhauled had two piece articulated pistons in it. They’re put together a hundred different ways it seems like. Takes some time to figure out what you got to work with. Best of luck. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You guys can check my math on this, but IIRC, the N14s in the Steigers all had the same CPL regardless if it was a 9370, 80, or 90. Seems like they were all CPL # 2033. All the ag blocks for the N14 were made in Brazil. Also, the ag blocks all still used the water/coolant intercooler instead of air-to-air intercoolers most trucks of that vintage used. I can remember replacing a half-dozen or so intercoolers on the later N14s used in the Steigers and Versatiles as some bean counter at Cummins decided they could eliminate some welding between the intercooler and intercooler cover...only to find out that missing welding caused the cover and intercooler to break away from each other. The 9390 did have a bigger radiator and a different fan drive setup that the 9370/80s did. IIRC, it used a wide serpentine belt to run a clutch/viscous drive fan as opposed to the 9370/80s using the regular fan drive off of the Cummins accessory drive pulley that ran a direct-drive fan belt. Seems like our local Cummins distributor told some of our guys that the N14s in the Steigers could go up to 450-460 HP in their current configuration.

I guess what I would be worried about is all the stuff BEHIND the N14. After all, you're talking about a 25% increase in overall power in a chassis that was pretty well maxxed out in stock form. I assume this is a powershift transmission? The 9390 powershift was bigger than the one used in the 9370s/9380s as the top 2 shafts and their components were bigger, but they did all that just to live behind a 25 hp bigger engine, I doubt it was rated for much more than that. The 9390 came out later to compete with the 9882 Versatile New Holland and the 9400 Deere as they were both rated at 425HP as well. To get all that extra hp to the ground, you're going to have to add a lot of extra weight on it...the 694 axles may not hold up the best, either. Sorry, but I've seen too many guys try something like this....and it usually doesn't end well.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, SDman said:

 

I guess what I would be worried about is all the stuff BEHIND the N14. After all, you're talking about a 25% increase in overall power in a chassis that was pretty well maxxed out in stock form. I assume this is a powershift transmission? The 9390 powershift was bigger than the one used in the 9370s/9380s as the top 2 shafts and their components were bigger, but they did all that just to live behind a 25 hp bigger engine, I doubt it was rated for much more than that. The 9390 came out later to compete with the 9882 Versatile New Holland and the 9400 Deere as they were both rated at 425HP as well. To get all that extra hp to the ground, you're going to have to add a lot of extra weight on it...the 694 axles may not hold up the best, either. Sorry, but I've seen too many guys try something like this....and it usually doesn't end well.

Funny it took 16 replies before someone mentioned this.  To the OP, drivetrain issues is the first question I would have asked at that hp level.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jacked the front end up two years ago and dropped the transmission out for a rebuild, shop owner I work for on the weekends talk to a truck mechanic and the truck mechanic said just have to drop in bigger injectors. It's a twenty four speed transmission.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

don't forget cooling.

 All of that extra fuel make heat.

 should the radiator be on the skimpy side as it is, upping the output will require increased cooling capacity as well.

 I am reminded of a piece I worked on a few years back,  a forestry mower needed a new engine, old one was tired.

 found a low hour engine, did the swap.

 worked like gangbusters when the weather was around freezing.

 summer came along, tractor overheated.

 had radiator opened up, scrubbed out, re-installed it.

 still overheated.

 after a week of going around with this, I pulled the valve covers, and found the injectors on the replacement engine were a bit larger than what was in the original.

 swapped out the injectors, no more overheat.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, 756puller said:

Couple farmers around here that run dirtscrapers alot have put the HP up to I think 525 hp. Claims it works really well to load dirt at 1200 rpm than having to be at full throttle

Those bigger newer  stx tractors won’t let you go full power in lower gear and at half throttle. The torque and low speeds just bust up the gear train. Somebody else will explain it better.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, dale560 said:

Those bigger newer  stx tractors won’t let you go full power in lower gear and at half throttle. The torque and low speeds just bust up the gear train. Somebody else will explain it better.

You're right, Dale. The Quadtracs have all had the derates in the bottom gears, even the 9300 series Quads. That's the main reason they had an electronic governor...they derated the HP 30% in the bottom 3 gears. If you had a keen ear, you could hear the relay under the RH console for the reduced HP "click" when you shifted from 3rd gear to 4th gear, or vice-versa.

The STXs and newer tractors have had proportional derating...in 1st gear they derate a bunch, 2nd gear they give you some more HP/torque, 3rd gear more, etc. That's all written in the software.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...