Jump to content

What IH model was the equivalent to the JD 5010?


Michael Halsall
 Share

Recommended Posts

24.5x32 duals were an option on 15s but I've never seen one with them.

The 1586 was very popular in eastern Arkansas and all I've seen had 20.8x38 duals originally. I've seen some converted to 20.8x42 but that left little clearance for the rice and cane tires we like.

Most of the 1586s down here were weighed and turned way up. Then (without a TA) they pulled with a 4840 and held up good. The TAs won't last pulling that hard. 

Y'all mentioned JD 4x4s being popular out west. The early JD had a terrible reputation until the 90s round here. The 4586 was considered much more reliable than the big jd 4x4s (8630, 8640, etc) but the stiegler and versatile were best liked. Alot of guys who bleed green ran stiegler or versatile 4x4s.

Thx-Ace 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have seen a 1586 factory 30.5-32 on cast centers on feedmixer duty at a dairy in central PA around 18 years ago. Not sure who runs the dairy now as the owner passed away 10 some years ago

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

There is no wrong.  Claiming a 15 whatever will out pull a 6030 is like claiming a 4630 will out pull a 15 whatever.  Just ain't going to happen.  Can you manipulate them to achieve desired slanted results.  Sure but that is not real world experience.  Honestly, I sometimes wonder why they even bother to do drawbar testing since the way tractors are setup vary so much.  No 6030 ever went to the field with no ballast.  Since we are on the subject of tires, was duals 24.5-32 ever an option on 1586s??

I'll concede that common sense tells you that a heavier tractor with more ci and a fair amount more db hp should out pull the smaller tractor. I basically just found some info to stir the pot a little along with giving ih a little respect. But like I said before in this thread I think ih was thinking more 4wd and awd when it comes to heavy tillage and knowing what we know now I don't think anybody will argue that was wrong. It's not their fault the market wasn't ready for it. And I don't consider a 6030 an all purpose tractor. I've never heard anybody talk about how well their 6030 did on the feed mill or cultivator it's always how much they pulled with it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, acem said:

 

Y'all mentioned JD 4x4s being popular out west. The early JD had a terrible reputation until the 90s round here. The 4586 was considered much more reliable than the big jd 4x4s (8630, 8640, etc) but the stiegler and versatile were best liked. Alot of guys who bleed green ran stiegler or versatile 4x4s.

Thx-Ace 

 

I don’t know who claimed what on popularity.  But the JD old 4x4s were popular here but that’s only comparing them to IH.  Steiger and especially Versatile ruled the roost.  Next came JD and Case.  Lastly IH.  The only tractors that sold worse was white and AC.  You mentioned JD guys running Steiger and Versatile.  That was true here too but our IH dealer sold Versatile over their own IH Steigers which didn’t help sales any. I ain’t $hi!!ing when I say I can count on one hand the number of the Steiger IHs I have seen around here.  Pretty sore there was more back in the day but they didn’t stick around very long. The old yellow 4100s are way more common.  

Also I’ll take your word the 4586 was much better then the JD 30/40 series down there.  I don’t farm in your area, conditions are not the same between us and so yes I believe it.  My opinion the JDs had to be treated like a tractor 2 sizes down to be reliable. But also redpower is the only place I’ve seen anybody claim the 4586/4786s were good tractors.  Even LeeKlancher's book mentions some quality issues.  And I’d have to look but it seems like IH’s market share declined towards the end and I thought they sold off their share in Steiger to live another day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Farmer in training said:

I'll concede that common sense tells you that a heavier tractor with more ci and a fair amount more db hp should out pull the smaller tractor. I basically just found some info to stir the pot a little along with giving ih a little respect. But like I said before in this thread I think ih was thinking more 4wd and awd when it comes to heavy tillage and knowing what we know now I don't think anybody will argue that was wrong. It's not their fault the market wasn't ready for it. And I don't consider a 6030 an all purpose tractor. I've never heard anybody talk about how well their 6030 did on the feed mill or cultivator it's always how much they pulled with it. 

Well typically when you buy the biggest tractor in the lineup they get put to use in heavy tillage.  That being said 6030s can be all around tractors.  Just because you didn’t hear of it doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.  Why did JD make cultivators for the 6030.  Heck Steiger and Versatile made rowcrop 4x4s.  If there was enough demand for those then somebody out there was using a 6030 to cultivate with.  My cousins 6030s I keep referencing whenever the subject comes up were used on forage choppers and haybuster wagons back in the day when they weren’t summer fallowing. You’ll probably laugh but they have of course retired both of them.  They took the hot one and removed the chloride, removed the duals, removed all the weights and got the AC working and now it spends its life pulling a Vermeer twin V take during the summer.  The other 6030 gets used occasionally on a tub grinder.  Tractors that size new and old get used for many non tillage jobs all around jobs here.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Big Bud guy said:

I don’t know who claimed what on popularity.  But the JD old 4x4s were popular here but that’s only comparing them to IH.  Steiger and especially Versatile ruled the roost.  Next came JD and Case.  Lastly IH.  The only tractors that sold worse was white and AC.  You mentioned JD guys running Steiger and Versatile.  That was true here too but our IH dealer sold Versatile over their own IH Steigers which didn’t help sales any. I ain’t $hi!!ing when I say I can count on one hand the number of the Steiger IHs I have seen around here.  Pretty sore there was more back in the day but they didn’t stick around very long. The old yellow 4100s are way more common.  

Also I’ll take your word the 4586 was much better then the JD 30/40 series down there.  I don’t farm in your area, conditions are not the same between us and so yes I believe it.  My opinion the JDs had to be treated like a tractor 2 sizes down to be reliable. But also redpower is the only place I’ve seen anybody claim the 4586/4786s were good tractors.  Even LeeKlancher's book mentions some quality issues.  And I’d have to look but it seems like IH’s market share declined towards the end and I thought they sold off their share in Steiger to live another day.

  It was a mixed bag here.  86 series 4 X 4 tractors were sold by IH dealers who lacked a Steiger or Versatile franchise which was about 96 percent of the IH dealers here.  Not extremely detrimental but the few 86's that got sold were still money for those dealers.  When Ford started selling their blue Steiger's that did help a couple of Ford dealers that were in grain and vegetable country.  The one IH dealer that did sell Steiger hedged his bets at that point by picking up Versatile.  To my knowledge he was the only one in NY to carry Versatile until Versatile was acquired by Ford-NH.  The White 4-1XX tractors did well here with their mechanically driven PTO.  All the brands actually had a presence here including MF and AC.  The local AC dealer sold 3 7580 in a territory not noted for big grain farming at the time.   The dealer just to the west sold 2 8550's.  JD was the sales king with a few aggressive dealers despite the reliability issues in the 40 series.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don’t take me wrong guys I am not promoting John Deere. I always thought the 5010, 20 6030 were big ugly tractors. One thing they had was mass and cubic inches. That made them brutish but tough. Anything they touched moved is what one guy told me. Just to set record straight on 4 wd tractors they all had their issues. Versatile seemed to be simplest and most favored. Steiger was good but unlike versatile a lot of parts different between models. IHC tractors weren’t bad either but they had weakness to.
most of their trouble were axle bearings and motor after a few thousand hours. Actually the later 903 powered Massey tractors were pretty well built. They went on to the challenger lineup. If white wouldn’t have gone under they had 300 hp tractors coming.  Just to set the record straight on John Deere by the late 30 series John Deere had the 4wds figured out. Serial 7000 something on a 8630 there are a lot of parts different than early tractors. John Deere dealers were to upgrade early tractors with some of these parts.  The 8640,50 tractors were trouble free actually. Lots of improvements over the 1st design. The 8850 that everyone hates actually ran well for the first few thousand hours and like 5020 heavy and thick. The motor problems on jd were having it as structure member. Once the 60 series 4 wd came along motor issues were gone. Also I would love to have a early row crop 806 and a 4010 , or 20 in the shed one day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The local ih dealer sold a few ih 4wd and several stiegler 4wd. Not many, if any jd 4x4 were sold new here. There was no versatile dealer. Honestly western Arkansas is small time crop farming.

Eastern Arkansas is where the big farms are and they have dealers for everything. I wasn't there much until the 90s so my information is from others who were there. Stiegler and versatile were strong sellers and well liked. The ih stiegler was well liked early but became dated later.  Jd sold some but had a  poor reputation. The primary reason for 4x4 in eastern Arkansas is flotation in rice fields. They preformed tillage too but the articulated 4wd with big rice and canes will get through muddy rice fields when nothing else will.

I've seen exactly one 4100 in eastern Arkansas and no 4156, 4166 or 4186. Several 2+2 were in around but magnums moved them on.

Thx-Ace 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, dale560 said:

Don’t take me wrong guys I am not promoting John Deere. I always thought the 5010, 20 6030 were big ugly tractors. One thing they had was mass and cubic inches. That made them brutish but tough. Anything they touched moved is what one guy told me. Just to set record straight on 4 wd tractors they all had their issues. Versatile seemed to be simplest and most favored. Steiger was good but unlike versatile a lot of parts different between models. IHC tractors weren’t bad either but they had weakness to.
most of their trouble were axle bearings and motor after a few thousand hours. Actually the later 903 powered Massey tractors were pretty well built. They went on to the challenger lineup. If white wouldn’t have gone under they had 300 hp tractors coming.  Just to set the record straight on John Deere by the late 30 series John Deere had the 4wds figured out. Serial 7000 something on a 8630 there are a lot of parts different than early tractors. John Deere dealers were to upgrade early tractors with some of these parts.  The 8640,50 tractors were trouble free actually. Lots of improvements over the 1st design. The 8850 that everyone hates actually ran well for the first few thousand hours and like 5020 heavy and thick. The motor problems on jd were having it as structure member. Once the 60 series 4 wd came along motor issues were gone. Also I would love to have a early row crop 806 and a 4010 , or 20 in the shed one day.

  In many eyes JD turned the corner with their 40 series 4WD's in the 1980 model year when JD went from a camshaft driven oil pump to a crankshaft driven pump.  Of course other improvements were made before and after that point.  Many would bypass an eight thousand series 4WD for a 9000 4WD and they would be justified although the price points are fairly different.  Back to the 40 series 1980 was when the grain embargo hit so those improved 40 series 4WD's never had a chance to be widely sold.  The 50 series 4WD drives hit in 1982 several months ahead of the row crops.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, jass1660 said:

 

Nice vid but I have to ask is that actually impressive or just normal for that size and age of tractor? Reason I ask is because I got chastised somewhat when posted a video of a JD 830 pulling a 12 row planter.  Made it sound like a Farmall M could pull a 12 row planter up hill both ways.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/16/2021 at 4:53 PM, 766 Man said:

  It was a mixed bag here.  86 series 4 X 4 tractors were sold by IH dealers who lacked a Steiger or Versatile franchise which was about 96 percent of the IH dealers here.  Not extremely detrimental but the few 86's that got sold were still money for those dealers.  When Ford started selling their blue Steiger's that did help a couple of Ford dealers that were in grain and vegetable country.  The one IH dealer that did sell Steiger hedged his bets at that point by picking up Versatile.  To my knowledge he was the only one in NY to carry Versatile until Versatile was acquired by Ford-NH.  The White 4-1XX tractors did well here with their mechanically driven PTO.  All the brands actually had a presence here including MF and AC.  The local AC dealer sold 3 7580 in a territory not noted for big grain farming at the time.   The dealer just to the west sold 2 8550's.  JD was the sales king with a few aggressive dealers despite the reliability issues in the 40 series.

I forgot about Massey which is stupid since we had one.  Even those outsold IH Steigers both the 15/1800 series and the later 4000s.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

Nice vid but I have to ask is that actually impressive or just normal for that size and age of tractor? Reason I ask is because I got chastised somewhat when posted a video of a JD 830 pulling a 12 row planter.  Made it sound like a Farmall M could pull a 12 row planter up hill both ways.

I don’t think there is any other two wheel drive tractor of that vintage that could pull it. I guess that’s at least somewhat impressive for that reason. That is a 3700 Kinze planter. I have a 3800 the same size and in my area 300hp is about the minimum to pull it. Although we are no till and that video is not. I don’t think that most tractors that age would have good enough hydraulics to even lift it either. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That 6030 is about 350hp too, I know that guy pretty well lol! Obviously it doesn't take 350hp to pull that planter though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My neighbor pulls a 24 row jd no till vacuum planter (1750?) With 200 hp tractors. They are oversized but his smaller tractors don't have enough hydraulic capacity. His land is flat too. 

A 1586 would pull his but not run the hydraulics.

Thx-Ace 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We have two 3800s and pull one with a 8295R and the other with an 8530 Deere. We have used an 8650 Deere as well. The 8295R and 8650 are barely adequate here in no till and our hills. Going up hill in clay ground with the bulk fill tanks full is a big load on a roughly 300hp tractor. Flat land would be a lot different. I’ve always been envious of people who get to farm where it’s flat. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/17/2021 at 7:37 PM, Dirt_Floor_Poor said:

I don’t think there is any other two wheel drive tractor of that vintage that could pull it. I guess that’s at least somewhat impressive for that reason. That is a 3700 Kinze planter. I have a 3800 the same size and in my area 300hp is about the minimum to pull it. Although we are no till and that video is not. I don’t think that most tractors that age would have good enough hydraulics to even lift it either. 

If your planter is a vacuum planter with bulk fill and/or fertilizer that’s an entirely different animal than a box finger planter. I would wager to say that any companies big 2wd tractor from that era would pull and lift that planter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, ZG6E said:

If your planter is a vacuum planter with bulk fill and/or fertilizer that’s an entirely different animal than a box finger planter. I would wager to say that any companies big 2wd tractor from that era would pull and lift that planter.

My planters are bulk fill and vacuum, but I don’t carry any fertilizer. Like I said, flat land would be a lot different as well as conventional tillage. 175 horsepower would not pull a 24 row 30 in my area, no matter the configuration. The hitch weight on mine is 8,000 pounds when it is folded. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, cornerpost said:

5010-5020-6030 heavier. A 1456 as much pto hp as a 5020. If I was a collector would want one of each. Coffee group member had a 6030 back in the day. First time he pulled it in hard plowing front end came off ground. He said all he saw was hood when he looked ahead. 

My cousins had to put chloride in the front tires on their first 6030 to keep the front end down.  Still came up every time they crested a hill.  A “international”  1456 with wheatland options is far more collectable then those 3 if you go by numbers 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...