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I have always enjoyed Messer 80tac+ Rod. Have you any experience or pros and cons. Its dual rated ac/dc, i have good luck with it and it lays down a nice bead, i do best with it going uphill. I havent picked up a stick welder in a  long time but this weekend i was getting fits from the mig so I found some 80t 1/8 i had around. Dad came along and gave me a hard time about not using 7018, i told him if the wing tore off the splitter wedge he could point  and laugh, but i didn’t think it would. 
any thoughts or opinions welcomed 

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23 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

Is that one of those blue "Wonder" rods?????  Never used rods wonder rods myself, but was always told those blue wonders in acid etch tests are nothing more than glue on the surface?

They are blue, but i don’t believe it is a gimmick, should be an 80k tensil ac/dc rod

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Don't know either way, was always told they had next to no penetration in acid etch tests.  There was a traveling guy here years back that was selling a wonder rod, and the one seed corn company bit on it.  They glued everything together with it, used to drive me nuts, I don't know what those rods were, but the weld they laid down was almost like a hard surfacing rod, it would eat grinding wheels trying to get it off.  They used it on the detasseler machines, and by the time I got to use them, they were on the verge of falling apart, and would fall apart on us.  That was no fun trying to get that slop off to fix it like it should have been to begin with.  

I will continue to use my ESAB SureWeld 6010 and Atom Arc 7018 or Excalibur 7018 from Lincoln if I have to burn rod.  

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2 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

Don't know either way, was always told they had next to no penetration in acid etch tests.  There was a traveling guy here years back that was selling a wonder rod, and the one seed corn company bit on it.  They glued everything together with it, used to drive me nuts, I don't know what those rods were, but the weld they laid down was almost like a hard surfacing rod, it would eat grinding wheels trying to get it off.  They used it on the detasseler machines, and by the time I got to use them, they were on the verge of falling apart, and would fall apart on us.  That was no fun trying to get that slop off to fix it like it should have been to begin with.  

I will continue to use my ESAB SureWeld 6010 and Atom Arc 7018 or Excalibur 7018 from Lincoln if I have to burn rod.  

I have no objection to 7018 except that it should be used upon opening and I rarely use a whole box, i needed 10 rods im not opening a 5 or 10 lb box for that. 

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1 minute ago, vtfireman85 said:

I have no objection to 7018 except that it should be used upon opening and I rarely use a whole box, i needed 10 rods im not opening a 5 or 10 lb box for that. 

I keep mine in sealed pvc tubes with a cab on one end and a threaded plug on the other, some Dessicant(SP?) packs in the bottom, seem to work fine.  Have a little oven here, but haven't used it in a long time since I built the PVC tubes.

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I've got a box of big 7018 rods that a welder friend gave me when he went out of business. That was about 15 years ago and they weren't exactly new then.  I burned 4 of them last Thursday fixing the grate in my Outside wood boiler and they were fine. Been stored in an open box in my garage. I have dusted them with the torch when it's been really humid for a while but don't see much difference. I don't often need a rod that big or they would have been used long ago. Probably why I ended up with them in the first place.

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I'm not a professional welder by any means so take this for what it's worth. We don't keep our 7018 rods in an oven at work. The only thing I notice is that the flux seems more brittle if I have to bend a rod to get the right angle, maybe a little harder to start. The guys that do it all day everyday probably notice a big difference. We usually buy ours in smaller boxes to try and keep them fresh.

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3 hours ago, yellowrosefarm said:

I've got a box of big 7018 rods that a welder friend gave me when he went out of business. That was about 15 years ago and they weren't exactly new then.  I burned 4 of them last Thursday fixing the grate in my Outside wood boiler and they were fine. Been stored in an open box in my garage. I have dusted them with the torch when it's been really humid for a while but don't see much difference. I don't often need a rod that big or they would have been used long ago. Probably why I ended up with them in the first place.

@Finneycan correct me here, but due to the cellulose flux which absorbs water rods for inspected work have to be fresh that day or stored for certain times in an oven before use. 
doesn’t mean I wouldn’t use it for my wood splitter wedge, but it certainly is negatively affected by moisture. 
hopefully they can correct my errors here. 
i think it was a Miriam Graves product, or at least marketed through them pretty sure that is what that chart is from. 

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I think all of those distributors have some variation of those rods. I have a few in my rod tube that are from Barnes, I think they are labeled bowma -weld.

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If you get good welds that work use it.  I would think that making a good weld does more than any hydrogen issues in things like wood splitters or equipment repair.


rod ovens keep the rod dry more than anything. Most welds will never know the difference. Get into overhead lifting, spreader bars, and engineered stuff it’s a different story. Not sure I would use 7018 that had been laying out in the open for years on a major frame repair on a implement but each there own. 

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If your 7018 has sat around a while put a rod in the stinger and stick and let it cook a while to dry out.  I used to do this but now I have an old upright freezer with a light bulb in it.

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40 minutes ago, Finney said:

Never heard of that brand, but there is a lot of things I never heard of.

MG is part of the Messer-Eutectic-Castolin family.  They offer some standard welding rods but their bread and butter business is specialty rods and fluxes.  They make just about any kind of rod to weld any sort of metal together or to another product.  The issue is most people only need a stick or two and they only offer it in 5 or 10 pound packs.  

 

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Rods like 7018 have a flux specifically designed to minimize a problem called hydrogen embrittlement.  It’s an issue on pipeline welding that has lead to failures.  One source of the hydrogen is from H20 in the flux, when present.  
 

I think is also more of an issue in higher tensile steels.  Some of these pipe steels are much higher carbon than typical steels used in equipment manufacturing.  


The rods are kept in a rod oven for a minimum of a few hours, it’s it’s expected the welders is using rods from there.  It’s on the standard issue inspector’s checklist, so to speak. 
 

 

1 hour ago, vtfireman85 said:

@Finneycan correct me here, but due to the cellulose flux which absorbs water rods for inspected work have to be fresh that day or stored for certain times in an oven before use. 
doesn’t mean I wouldn’t use it for my wood splitter wedge, but it certainly is negatively affected by moisture. 
hopefully they can correct my errors here. 
i think it was a Miriam Graves product, or at least marketed through them pretty sure that is what that chart is from. 

 

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2 hours ago, vtfireman85 said:

@Finneycan correct me here, but due to the cellulose flux which absorbs water rods for inspected work have to be fresh that day or stored for certain times in an oven before use. 
doesn’t mean I wouldn’t use it for my wood splitter wedge, but it certainly is negatively affected by moisture. 
hopefully they can correct my errors here. 
i think it was a Miriam Graves product, or at least marketed through them pretty sure that is what that chart is from. 

Cellulose and 18 series are 2 different things. Use whatever you like on your wood splitter, if it fails you can reweld it. In my opinion cellulose rods can be too dry and 18 series need to be as dry as possible.

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I've used a ton of 80t's.  IMO one of the best rods to have if you are only going to have one. Nice beads, slag all but falls off and works well in all positions. Great rod for general repair work especially when working in awkward positions like welding a patch on a downspout pipe hanging out of a crane basket 70 feet in the air.....🙃

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32 minutes ago, TomH said:

I've used a ton of 80t's.  IMO one of the best rods to have if you are only going to have one. Nice beads, slag all but falls off and works well in all positions. Great rod for general repair work especially when working in awkward positions like welding a patch on a downspout pipe hanging out of a crane basket 70 feet in the air.....🙃

I find when welding upside down all the blood rushes to my head and i don’t think good. 

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A friend who is a pipeline welder prefers to weld the bottom of the pipe. It's easier on his back since he can lay down when he welds! Thx-Ace 

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19 hours ago, TP from Central PA said:

I keep mine in sealed pvc tubes with a cab on one end and a threaded plug on the other, some Dessicant(SP?) packs in the bottom, seem to work fine.  Have a little oven here, but haven't used it in a long time since I built the PVC tubes.

That’s a great idea we have rods on the trucks that basically end up getting thrown away due to moisture 

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I like using tried and true rods the the USN used on the hull f warships. Depending on he application I use 7018 for everything. Recently I am attempting some SS that is a Blue Demon E308/308L-1 on T-#)$L ASTM A240 sheared flat bar.

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18 hours ago, AKwelder said:

If you get good welds that work use it.  I would think that making a good weld does more than any hydrogen issues in things like wood splitters or equipment repair.


rod ovens keep the rod dry more than anything. Most welds will never know the difference. Get into overhead lifting, spreader bars, and engineered stuff it’s a different story. Not sure I would use 7018 that had been laying out in the open for years on a major frame repair on a implement but each there own. 

Hes got a point, i am using old bolt in cutting edge for my 4 way, still,the  penetration seems excellent and the beads look goodIt it rips off it is unlikely to cause injuries. 

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