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Oil level or MCV valve?


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1066 open station

Cut some fields several weeks ago.  Had a leaking height cylinder on flexwing so disconnected it.  Later on, had leaking cylinder on wing lifts, got it fixed.  (point being, some oil was lost and I'm not sure how much AND this was over several months during summer, not all last couple weeks)

Everything worked 100% fine when I cut the fields.  No discernable oil under tractor when parked.

Today, headed out to visit the orchard, on way there noticed the Tellite was on while driving in low range, 4th gear.  Steering was jerky.  I recalled (if I recall correctly) that steering has some priority, so if steering is jerky, something else should be problematic.  Nothing is that I can sense.

Check oil since I'm guessing it's a starvation thing.  I was low.  I put about seven gallons in (and am still about a gallon low).  Headed slowly to field and the drive of the machine was jerky....  stopped dead in its tracks in place, then lurched, popping a tiny wheelie (about .0989032782 inch)  

Now, I'm debating on driving to the orchard or not....don't want to walk back.  My memory says if the TA goes out, you are dead in the water??  I had moved it from direct to low range (is that what it's called when TA is pulled back?)

Anyway, machine continued, steering was jerky.

Tellite was coming ON during the drive.  Thought maybe it had fallen out of adjustment so checked and the adjusting lever seems as snug as when I last touched it.

Continued on....  Tellite came on, went out....came on....went out....  then it seemed to stay out for the duration and my steering was back.

 

So, this has me thinking I might have an issue brewing OR, it might have possibly been an air bubble/lock that had to work its way through the system??  (is that even possible?)

Once it had that bit of distance on it, everything seemed to go back to normal, suggesting it was indeed an oil starvation issue.  Still....  this type tractor is still new to me (with TA and Tellite) so thought I'd ask for opinions.

I must have lost more oil than anticipated when the wing cylinder went out, that's the only leak I'm aware of.

Thanks!!

 

 

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If the ta is good it will still move in low side with no hyd pressure. Hyd presure is required for high or direct side to work as I understand it.

Good idea to check hyd level everytime, or at very least when you have had a known leak.

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Seven gallons low? Good Lord...would love to help you out with a good answer, but some guys are just their own worst enemy. 

I'm not a fan of overfilling like a lot of guys think to do, but in your case, it wouldn't hurt. 

Before doing that, remove and inspect and possibly change your hydraulic filter....

Travis

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3 hours ago, Coytee said:

Filter was changed when I replaced fluid....  still think the same?  (were you thinking it was old?)

Change your Hy-Tran every 1000 hours.

Change your filter every 250 hours. (I change the coolant filter at the same time, to help keep track).

Travis

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Heh, I doubt I put 100 hours on it per 12 months.  I've never really paid attention though, but recalling back to when my backhoe was new (and I DID then tend to watch the meter), I was lucky to hit 100 hours/year and I used it more than I use this.

Since I don't know what oil was in it when I purchased it, I drained all old and replaced with HT.  I was planning on running it for this past summer, then swap it again just to 'wash out' whatever might be old....  but at approximately $150/5 gallon bucket, I decided to slow that one down.

 

Side question for anyone....  aside from any issues I might or might not have had...  when I was redoing this, I slowly bought the number of buckets to drain/refill with new.  I had two extra buckets that I was accumulating for the second change as referenced above....

The dealer where I get this is 90 miles away so I can't/don't just hop/skip to get some when I need some which brings me to my question....  as a general rule of thumb, how many 5-gallon buckets of extra fluid do you tend to keep on hand?  Those who use a barrel need not reply as a barrel is not going to work sitting in my garage nor elsewhere at this moment in time.

 

 

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Your tractor is at the very least in the early stages of TA failure. As stated earlier the tractor has a mechanical sprague clutch that drives the low side of the TA. No hydraulic pressure is required to move the tractor. If the tractor is for sure in a range and a gear, and stops moving at any point, this sprague clutch has failed. The tractor may continue to move in low, but it is primarily by a set of hydraulic holdback clutches which will move the tractor around under light loads, but will not hold up under heavy pulls.

You can often run these tractors for a VERY long time without replacing the TA. Farmers in my experience tend to drive them until they won't move anymore before spending the $$$ to replace the TA, rather than replace them at the first sign of trouble. It may well outlive you if all you're doing is mowing. Just leave the TA ahead most of the time, try not to use the TA unless absolutely necessary, and expect the tractor to stop moving when you pull the TA back. If it keeps pulling, thank whatever deity you worship and keep on keepin' on. HOWEVER if it stops don't throw the lever ahead in a panic. Push the clutch, shift down, THEN throw the lever back ahead before letting out the clutch.

This kind of applies to your original issue/question as well... It's fine now. Do you panic, tear it all down, spend thousands of dollars on a new TA, hydraulic pumps, MCV rebuild, clutch, etc NOW, or do you run it until it stops for good, THEN fix it? That's the question you have to answer. It could quit on you tomorrow or it could go another 10 years.

It's not going to be a quick easy turn of a screw fix. This is going to be major surgery. Probably over your head both in mechanical ability and shop facilities. The tractor needs to be split into three pieces to do the TA.

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A bit of an update and a changing angle of question.

Got home from work and spent 20 minutes looking at this.  What I did NOT bother to say previously above (because it was irrelevant) is that I had checked the oil probably time prior to last time being used, found it a bit low and topped it off, maybe 1 1/2 gallons.  Those moronic comments from those who jump to conclusions don't always know the whole story however, I don't want to point fingers to Sparky.  Be it as it may, I can always (and usually do) ignore him however, I do find him having a good nugget every now & then and I did find his burning dumpster funny so thought I'd give him some extra fire to play with....  as a side note, that's the kind of fire I've started here and though the picture doesn't show it was probably 150'x40x20.  It was a big one and, I had two going side by side but that's an entire story.....sheriff & all....  at 3:00 A.M.)

So that said, went out to poke around and viola...  I noticed I have a leak.  A pretty steady leak.  One that would now (gasp) explain how I got so low on fluid....

What I noticed was when the tractor was running, oil was just oozing at a good pace down the REAR tube that I believe goes to the clutch assist (??).  It's the tube on the right, closer to foot.  I stuck camera in there to look up and it appears to me that everything else seems to be dry....  suggesting it might be a loose connection.

I got my wrench and it wouldn't tighten.  So, I thought I'll just take the panel off....  removed the four bolts and it's not moving.

So, is the outer "panel" actually part of something else or as I noticed, do I need to remove the battery to get at a bolt on TOP to get it to release?  (it appears to be welded at a 90 degree angle with a piece of metal that goes under the battery AND, this piece of metal seems to have original paint on the weld suggesting it's part of the assembly.

I won't really get a chance to dig into this until this weekend.  Thought I'd see if this adds any thoughts.  I'm hoping I just blew an O-ring (??)

 

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On 10/6/2020 at 12:20 PM, 1566IH said:

100$ a 5 gallon in NW Wisco... Someones getting hosed...

Got to thinking about New Holland....  there is a dealer 25 miles away.  I think their fluid is called Master-Tran

My understanding (confirmed by them) that it's Hytran in a different container.

I think he said something like $97 for 5-gallons AND a much shorter drive!!

He went on to say that they have (insert another brand) that they keep stocked up, that they don't sell a lot of the Master Tran.....  as it's more expensive.  

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1 hour ago, snoshoe said:

Cracked flare on tube. No need to remove anything else

 

Thanks, I went out again and started it to look under and indeed, it seems to be oozing out from around the nut somewhere though on the glance, couldn't see exactly where.  I'll take it apart later.

That said, I looked the part up on their website and presuming it's nothing more than that, it looks like it's not made anymore?  It's item #16 and seems to be missing from their parts lineup, which I can understand.

 

https://www.mycnhistore.com/us/en/caseih/na/tractors/agricultural/over-100-hp/international-66-series-diesel-tractor/drive-train/drive-train-hydraulic-powered-clutch-control-tractors-without-custom-cab/cn/B35F2542-8FBF-E111-9FCE-005056875BD6

Looks like I might get to make my first flare fitting.  Already have the tube bender, just need the flare tool.

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When you get the tube out. Slide the nut and sleeve back. You should find a crack part way around tube right at base of flare. Cut that off square and straighten a couple bends slightly. You should be able to reflare the tube you have. Get the bends so there is no strain on tube when tightened. I expect someone to tell you that you need to double flare the tube. Not so. With only regulated pressure and that sleeve. Thats not where they fail. As you will see when you get it apart. The biggest things are not to strain the tube when you install and to make sure booster and bracket are tight and don't move in use.

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I suppose I should put those bolts back before I do any tubing!  I don't have a flair making tool....  may I presume any would work?  I see them in the $30+ range at box store up to $100+

 

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 Having replaced a few of these lines myself, one of them just this summer, I will agree with those guys that the line is still available, not that you could not probably fix that one. It is larger than any flare I have tried to make myself, but for sure it could be done. You could also remove the fittings on each end and run to any hydraulic hose shop and they could make you a hydraulic hose,  Quick and ugly that would fix your leak until you could locate the line or fix yours in a more visually appealing manner. I’ll also,agree with them that there is nothing in your picture that makes me think there is anything else leaking, you have a best case scenario going on right there, which is good. Be careful when you line those  back up and yes like you said , they need to be put back in before you start the tractor and push the clutch pedal with the grease fitting on its pivot.

My leak was worse, but only on the first start up of the year. I dismissed it last spring after it shot out a gallon and then never lost a drop rest of the summer. Same thing this spring. The clutch assist seal rebuild kit, fixed it this time. (Pic was before fixing, as the kit comes with new rubber boots for the cylinder ends). 

Looking at it closer, the leaking line on yours is bent, that could have caused the crack. Typically the crack just comes from over tightening. Either that, or the line in my picture is bent.

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Called dealer that is 90 miles away.  He said he didn't have access anymore as it has no part number showing (I asked him for it after he saw picture)

Did I get a young-one who didn't want to lift a finger and try or, was it bona-fide not available?  I'll never know his situation.

However, I've got a friend who's got a machine shop nearby....  I'm going to bet he's got the tools to flare this after cutting end off.  

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14 hours ago, stronger800 said:

You could also remove the fittings on each end and run to any hydraulic hose shop and they could make you a hydraulic hose,  Quick and ugly that would fix your leak until you could locate the line or fix yours in a more visually appealing manner.

This tractor is really nothing more than a glorified lawn mower so I'm not concerned too much about visually appealing.  I hadn't thought of a hose instead of a hard line.  My innate tendency is to keeping things "correct".  I don't really care for what I'd call cob jobs....  I found the OTHER hard line on a website and it was $100.  If that's the case for the line I need, I'm more than happy to convert it to a hose and move on with life!!

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