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forage harvestor prices?


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33 minutes ago, pt756 said:

was at a wedding today, talked to a former custom operator. said a farmer just bought a new claas chopper, 12 row head, tracks. one million dollars,

With tracks....yep.  its nut imho.  But with the gov printing $ like monopoly $...a buck dont buy much.  Why you think in 10y pickups went from 40k to 70k?

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Yup that is about right

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@ChrisNY did you ever look at the 970? 

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How in god's name could you ever pay off a 1 mil machine like that?  On top of that  it will sit more months of the year than it runs. Cant be cheap insuring something with a value pushing 1 mil either. 

But, its prob more like this and most high dollar items......run the crap out of it, put nothing into it, and dump it when warranty is out. 

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6 minutes ago, Cdfarabaugh said:

How in god's name could you ever pay off a 1 mil machine like that?  On top of that  it will sit more months of the year than it runs. Cant be cheap insuring something with a value pushing 1 mil either. 

But, its prob more like this and most high dollar items......run the crap out of it, put nothing into it, and dump it when warranty is out. 

My guess is that these choppers pay off as "easily" as a new combine. I am told that the charge rate per cutterhead hour is $1 per horsepower so a 990 hp machine is just shy of a grand per hour of use 

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13 minutes ago, Cdfarabaugh said:

How in god's name could you ever pay off a 1 mil machine like that?  On top of that  it will sit more months of the year than it runs. Cant be cheap insuring something with a value pushing 1 mil either. 

But, its prob more like this and most high dollar items......run the crap out of it, put nothing into it, and dump it when warranty is out. 

Lease agreement.

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36 minutes ago, bitty said:

My guess is that these choppers pay off as "easily" as a new combine. I am told that the charge rate per cutterhead hour is $1 per horsepower so a 990 hp machine is just shy of a grand per hour of use 

How many acres or tons can be chopped in an hour?  Im guessing the $1 per hp does not include trucks or carts.  It would take a lot of operators and support equipment to keep up with a machine like that.  If I was paying the bill i wouldn't want the machine sitting there waiting for a cart or truck to come back unless that it was only cutter head hours charged.

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8 minutes ago, hobbyfarm said:

How many acres or tons can be chopped in an hour?  Im guessing the $1 per hp does not include trucks or carts.  It would take a lot of operators and support equipment to keep up with a machine like that.  If I was paying the bill i wouldn't want the machine sitting there waiting for a cart or truck to come back unless that it was only cutter head hours charged.

You share my thoughts, the capacity of some if this stuff makes keeping it away the hard part.  

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4 minutes ago, hobbyfarm said:

How many acres or tons can be chopped in an hour?  Im guessing the $1 per hp does not include trucks or carts.  It would take a lot of operators and support equipment to keep up with a machine like that.  If I was paying the bill i wouldn't want the machine sitting there waiting for a cart or truck to come back unless that it was only cutter head hours charged.

I am guessing that it's possible to chop 400 tons an hour? If properly used it would require 8+ carts hauling it from the chopper , all additional costs . Cutterhead hour is the most honest way to charge. 

By comparison our chopper was 2 years old and it had 1400 cutterhead hours on it when we got it. It's 438 hp but back then it was about 250-300 per hour cost for a machine like that. We can keep an average of 3 1/2 carts busy

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11 hours ago, TroyDairy said:

Why you think in 10y pickups went from 40k to 70k?

More cup holders???🙄😉😁

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10 minutes ago, sandhiller said:

More cup holders???🙄😉😁

Actually the wifes new 2020 Chevy 2500 has less cupholders than my 2010 Chevy 3500. Kind of sucks. Smaller cupholders to boot. Only part of this post I could contribute to. I do miss running beside a chopper though.

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1 hour ago, sandhiller said:

More cup holders???🙄😉😁

 

1 hour ago, WishIhada1466 said:

Actually the wifes new 2020 Chevy 2500 has less cupholders than my 2010 Chevy 3500. Kind of sucks. Smaller cupholders to boot. Only part of this post I could contribute to. I do miss running beside a chopper though.


Probably the largest reason, cheap money.   Low interest money has made more expensive items just a few more payments away, and if you add a few a years, you can buy a truck that’s 80k and all you need is a 7 year loan.  So why not market a bigger, better, more powerful, more everything product

 

 

and the custom chopper, the more tons they chop the more money they make,  the more business they keep, customers need the crops off when they are at a premium, not hen the chopper can make it

 

someone once explained that there is a point when it’s better business to get bigger, and increase the cash flow

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another operator was there who now has 3 new hollands going, leaves 2 of them right at a 4000 cow dairy he said, I ssaid drove by your place recently, about 10 trailers, he said ordered 2 more will have 15, I think those new Meyers semi trailers are about 80k and the straight trailers are around 60 k, biggest problem both guys said is trying to get help. the one guy has cut way back as he has around 2000 cows of his own, what I see  happening is us smaller guys will get priced out of all of this slowly but surely, if it wasn't for all the Mennonite shops that have sprung up around here making a lot of aftermarket parts for machinery, we needed a roller for one of those 166 new Holland inverters, 1400 dollars at dealer, local weld shop is going to start making them, hopefully for 250 dollars a piece,

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Just makes me appreciate our little two row JD 3950 pull type even more. 

I like milking cows but definitely not as much as some people do

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When it comes to price per ton of forage chopped these newer big choppers are as good as any. The capacity if harnessed correctly is unreal. As I like to say you have to keep the spout busy, in other words if you have enough carts to haul it away from the spout that's where you get the best return on investment

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40 minutes ago, bitty said:

When it comes to price per ton of forage chopped these newer big choppers are as good as any. The capacity if harnessed correctly is unreal. As I like to say you have to keep the spout busy, in other words if you have enough carts to haul it away from the spout that's where you get the best return on investment

It takes more than carts. It starts with fields big enough for such a machine. Then you need the carts or trucks. Plus you need the packing ability. And all that is worthless if you cannot put skilled drivers in the seats. The complexity of some of these operations is amazing.

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Yesterdays wis. State journal classified ad....

20200830_124449.jpg

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I talked about this in another thread. I got the chance to run a chopper when I was on the farm. My goal was to keep everybody moving, planning out how to take a field off so I didn't have a line up of empty trucks waiting to be filled. We ran two straight trucks and two semis, the straights did the opening, splitting, other technical areas such as low spots hills and short rows. The semis got the longer runs in the middle of the field. Before I got to a field I would have a plan figured out on how to take it off, sometimes that meant blowing a line right across the middle just to open it up and then outline it after i would get everyone moving. It helped that I knew all of the fields, I couldn't imagine being a hired contractor who has never seen the field before

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Every new model released has to be an improvement over the previous.....& get a bit more done per hour. So everything gets a little bigger and more expensive, competition between manufacturers forces everyone to play the game.

The devaluation of currency doesn't help, a dollar never seems to get more valuable. 

But the big thing is how pricing has been adjusted to the payment installments. Raise the price to the point that few will buy outright, and then raise the price to the edge of what the customer is willing to pay monthly... I see it all the time, people buy an $70,000 pickup, but then tell me it's only $1000 a month. They don't think the least about that total outlay, just how the payment fits their budget.

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We are going to start chopping corn soon.  5000 cows.  2 John Deere 7750 8 row head 1 Claas 980 12 row head.  We have 8 ten wheelers 20 to 22 foot boxes and one tractor with a 40 foot Meyers trailer.  Hire 6 to 8 sometimes 10 tractor trailers.  5 articulated tractor with blades and another one just packing.  O-3 miles 3 tractor trailers works per chopper just over 3 miles need 4 or your waiting.  Some long hauls 8 9 miles one chopper can keep 6 trucks busy.  Those 7750’s have 2500-3000 engine hours.  They get gone through every year.  Class has 1000 hours second season on it.  One blade tractor has 2500 hours others have 8-12k hours.  Trucks are all from 90’s to early 2000’.  Somedays it can be a challenge to keep all that moving.  That Claas was in the 750k range a couple years ago with a 7750 traded against it.  It had a few demo hours on it. 

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Fwiw

Our chopper guy has 2 960 Claas with 8r heads and juuust got a used 970 (from FL) with 10r  (from MN) last week.  We are billed head hours.  He loves to challenge himself to keep everything moving and 0 breakdowns.  The new to him 970 has 1300 hrs.  He says he would never buy new...just ridiculous in his mind.  He runs them to 5-6k hours then sells.  Has went to 8800 before even with 0 reliabilty issues.  He has at least 20 customers in a 4 hour swath along the I5 corridor.  He handles our country and next S.  His guy does next co S to the Columbia River.  We will be billed $435 per hour for corn(i assume its not going up) .  We are billed $395 for grass.  0 way I could justify the purchase.  Along with repairs, fuel, labor, insurance, and surprise major failures.  We could get a fair priced 6850 JD and do ourselves.  They are good rigs and under 100k for who deal now.  But...same thing.  1 rock from a $20000 bill.  And we do corn in 2.5 days.  250 to 280 acres....so i only need help for them days.  Helping some friends with a 6850 they took 5.  Family up road are retired dairy family who chops silage for 2 other guys and are all Firemen or Cops.  They had a nice Claas 940...2nd cutitng this season a malfunction (operator error imho) allowed a piece of metal to slip by the detector.  Over $20k in parts was destroyed.  They traded it....they are not quite that mechanically involved to do that big of a job.  Trade was quicker and easier.  

An yes...i miss the 8930 and NH900 3r but i dont miss 6 long days chopping.  Wed do 20ac per day...now 20ac is 2.5 hrs.

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I have some buddies, 3 bros, that milk 450 hd. They consider themselves to be a small dairy. They are on top off everything dairy wise and are continuously bettering themselves and do a very fine job. Very high production, AI for 50 yrs, incredible calving interval, & etc. I have done their custom baling for 44 yrs & 20 yrs ago when they  went from 150 hd to 450 they also hire me to mow when the big chopper is coming. At that point, 20 yrs ago, they sold there 3 row pull type and hired the custom chopper. Used the same fellow till maybe 3 yrs ago then changed chopper guys for many reasons I won't get into. The current chopper works for a 4000 ? cow dairy, a 400 ish cow dairy, and my buddies 450 cow dairy. The chopper guy had 4 big Clauses in 2019 capable of what is called "shredlage", some of you dairy fellows correct me if I'm incorrect. In 2020 2 clauses were replaced by 2 deere, 1 down from biggest that I believe are rebadged clauses. 3 of the 4 choppers are employed on the big dairy and when # 4 is not running on the 2 small dairies it is at the large one as well. I run a NH 316 and my buddies have a JD 956. we cut 350-400 acers on a 28 day scheduale to chop. They used merge themselves but had trouble keeping up. The chopper guy has BIG mergers, a couple oxbo & a Kuhn. My buddies tell me they figure they are $ ahead to hire the merging done by the chopper crew due to the high abilities of the merger operator which reduces chopper hrs which equates to chopper $. As there own employees are lacking in that area. My buddies do there own pushing & packing as well as using 1 of their semis with dump and a 26 ft tri-axle straight truck. Chopper is over $1000/hr  + additional charges for more semis that are brought in by the chopper guy. The last I knew the chopper was by the hr in hay and by the ton in corn. 

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