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d-407 valve adjust


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Wow , I was gone on vacation and just got back , I see nothing has changed much , 60 comments on a simple valve adjustment , holy balls ūüė≥ J Mech your something , you must love to just ague with your s

This is the differences that some are referring to.

Well, I at least hope anyone who is seeking an answer here is able to sort through and find that answer, in the midst of the rest of the chest-beating

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It's the same as any 6 cylinder inline engine.  Specs vary, procedure is the same. 

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16 minutes ago, hippy5488 said:

valve adj procedure is not the same on all 6 cyl engines. 361,407,310 and358 are the same. 312,360,414,429,436 and 466 are a different

Firing order is the same.  Procedure is the same.  They are all a 1-5-3-6-2-4 firing order. 

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I did not say that the valve lash setting was the same.  I said the procedure was the same.  I do not need to look anything up.  I've worked on hundreds of engines. Any inline 6 cylinder engine with a firing order of 1-5-3-6-2-4, gas or diesel will use the same procedure. 

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2 minutes ago, hippy5488 said:

you are right lash is different and the valves you set on 1 tdc are different

The valves you set on #1 TDC would be the same.  Then you turn one revolution and do the remaining. 

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1 minute ago, J-Mech said:

The valves you set on #1 TDC would be the same.  Then you turn one revolution and do the remaining. 

Nope.  

If they would all be the same why are not all engines set 1-2-3-6-7-10 and then turn it and do 4-5-8-9-11-12? 

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Guys.  Are you all listening? If it is a 6 cylinder in line engine with a firing order of 1-5-3-6-2-4, then the valves you set when on #1 TDC are the same.  Guys.... come on.  Don't make me prove this with book pictures. The only reason the number may be different  (if you numbered the rockers 1-12) is because on gas engines for instance, they double up the valves.  So you have two exhaust valves next to each other instead of alternating. But it is the same.  If you can't wrap your head around that, I don't think pictures will help. 

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J mech is right tdc 1 you do 124 intake 135 exhaust turn it once do the rest 356 intake 246 exhaust. Most 6 cylinders are like this. Except 6-71 detroit I still can't find the intake valves

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A D361 and D407 have intake and valve positions reversed from the 400 series engines.  Therefore  the short cut method of adjusting six valves at a time may be different, I think they are but I am not going to look.  I always set each cylinder separate on all engines with mate cylinder being in overlap position.

With the grind on the cam shaft lobe there is a slight difference in the clearance you will come up with on some engines so to be safe I set them all in order.   

I did some checking years ago both methods and on some engines the difference on the IH engines was nearly not  detectable  on some of the models but on others you could be a couple thousands off one  way or the other.  In particular on the gas engines as the ramp on cam lobe starts  pretty close to the base of the came heel . IH even had a bulletin about the ramp way , way back in the day of the Green Diamond engines cautioning about this but then changed their tune in later years.  Different engineers I would say. 

You would never want to use a one turn method on a engine with a modified cam grind  as the only safe way to adjust them was directly on the heel of the camshaft. 

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3 hours ago, J-Mech said:

Guys.  Are you all listening? If it is a 6 cylinder in line engine with a firing order of 1-5-3-6-2-4, then the valves you set when on #1 TDC are the same.  Guys.... come on.  Don't make me prove this with book pictures. The only reason the number may be different  (if you numbered the rockers 1-12) is because on gas engines for instance, they double up the valves.  So you have two exhaust valves next to each other instead of alternating. But it is the same.  If you can't wrap your head around that, I don't think pictures will help. 

Dont try doing an engine that has a camshaft to utilize in cylinder EGR without following the procedure you'll get burned

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51 minutes ago, Cdfarabaugh said:

Dont try doing an engine that has a camshaft to utilize in cylinder EGR without following the procedure you'll get burned

That is quite a bit different than what this thread is about. 

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2 hours ago, J-Mech said:

That is quite a bit different than what this thread is about. 

Just pointing out not every 153624 6 cylinder engine is the same.  

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11 minutes ago, Cdfarabaugh said:

Just pointing out not every 153624 6 cylinder engine is the same.  

When you get into the 855 Cummins N14 there are about 5 different methods to adj valves. The best way as is Pete says to do companion cyl but that is a more skill needed. Best way to do it is as book says. 

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19 minutes ago, dale560 said:

When you get into the 855 Cummins N14 there are about 5 different methods to adj valves. The best way as is Pete says to do companion cyl but that is a more skill needed. Best way to do it is as book says. 

You're right, Dale. Let's see....Inner Base Circle, Outer Base Circle, Step Timing Control, Top Stop, Dial Indicator Method, Torque Wrench Method...think that covers most of them. Pretty much have to do them via companion cylinders(set #1 valves when #6 valves are on overlap, etc.)

Then when you deal with Iveco/FPT/Cursor engines on today's CNH tractors/combines, you get to deal with a different firing order....1-4-2-6-3-5. 

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30 minutes ago, SDman said:

You're right, Dale. Let's see....Inner Base Circle, Outer Base Circle, Step Timing Control, Top Stop, Dial Indicator Method, Torque Wrench Method...think that covers most of them. Pretty much have to do them via companion cylinders(set #1 valves when #6 valves are on overlap, etc.)

Then when you deal with Iveco/FPT/Cursor engines on today's CNH tractors/combines, you get to deal with a different firing order....1-4-2-6-3-5. 

Just the big engines or even the 9 liter  That the 8.3 evolved into use that firing order.

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1 hour ago, Cdfarabaugh said:

Just pointing out not every 153624 6 cylinder engine is the same.  

I'm sorry I didn't put an asterisks with the exceptions.¬† There are ALWAYS exceptions.....ūüôĄ

 

"I" before "E"

......... except after "C"

............... or when sounding like "A" as in "neighbor" and "weigh"

 

And on weekends, and holidays, and only in May, and you're always wrong no matter what you say!!!!!

~Brian Regan

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8 hours ago, Super A_sepa said:

Nope.  

If they would all be the same why are not all engines set 1-2-3-6-7-10 and then turn it and do 4-5-8-9-11-12? 

Then you get engines like John Deere with paired intake and you set different valves on 1 and 6. Classic example of valve set was 350 small block Chevy. Book said which valves to adjust on 1 and 6 but a quick short cut was to adjust valves with intake off when doing head work. You set 12 valves that lifters were down in bore then turned engine did the other 4. Then don’t forget to turn engine again to put dist in place on one or put it in on 6 without turning

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10 minutes ago, dale560 said:

Just the big engines or even the 9 liter  That the 8.3 evolved into use that firing order.

The Cursor 9L used in today's Magnums/combines/sprayers didn't evolve from the Cummins 8.3L used in the old Magnums. This is just one more example of CNH's confusion on their products.

The 8.3L CDC/Cummins engine originally used in the classic Magnums first evolved into the CAPS engines, which were available in both 8.3L and 9L(technically 8.9L, but Cummins/CNH both referred to the bigger CAPS engine as a 9L). After that, that engine evolved into the HPCR(High-Pressure Common rail...or some places in CaseIH refer to it as a "Pegasus" engine), again, in 8.3L and 9L sizes.

The FPT/Iveco/Cursor 9L(technically 8.7L) evolved from an earlier 7.8L Cursor engine that was called the Cursor 8. New Holland used that engine in some earlier CR combines, otherwise CNH didn't use the Cursor 8 in many applications.

Yes, any FPT/Iveco/CNH engine larger than a Cursor 8 has the 1-4-2-6-3-5 firing order....all the way up through the Cursor 16L offered in the 9250 combine.

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