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450 going through a lot of oil


ThatRickGuy
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Took the pile of parts down to Pakes a couple of weeks ago. Just chatted with them and it sounds like the price is going up ☹️. The head has cracks from the water jacket into the valve seats. Luckily they were just doing some machining for a gent building a 282 pulling engine and swapped a gas head out for the lp head. So there going to see if he wants to sell his old core. 

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17 hours ago, ThatRickGuy said:

Luckily they were just doing some machining for a gent building a 282 pulling engine and swapped a gas head out for the lp head.

But you have a 281 4 cylinder engine.  A 282 is a 6 cylinder diesel.  Not available in gas.  Typo? 

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On 3/23/2021 at 7:28 AM, J-Mech said:

But you have a 281 4 cylinder engine.  A 282 is a 6 cylinder diesel.  Not available in gas.  Typo? 

i passed it off as a typo also, as i have seen people refer to the 4 cyl as a 282 also.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Maybe when they did the “valve job”, they didnt clean up the grinding compound. I acquired a supposedly rebuilt Herc JXD. Fortunately I suspected something and took it apart. Their idea of rebuilding was to pull the head and hone the cylinders with lots and lots, and lots more compound. Found it running down the inside of the block and into the oil pan. There was about a quart of compound in there. That wouldn’t have run for long. Maybe it would have looked like yours.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Finally heard back from the machine shop on the block. It needs the works, but the biggest problem -

The parent bores are out of round by 3 thousandths. Enough that the sleeves will likely crack. They can rebore the block no problem, but then I need new oversized sleeves. I haven't been able to find anyone with .005 or .010 over sleeves, so reached out to a machine shop that does a lot of custom sleeve work. $270 per sleeve and it's a 5+ week backlog. :(

 

sooo, anyone have a lead on a good 281c block or oversized sleeves?

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On 5/12/2021 at 11:30 AM, ThatRickGuy said:

Score! One of the shop's other customers has a block from an M that has already been pressure tested and was going to get bored for a pulling tractor. He's willing to block swap with us. :)

Check with LA sleeve on a oversize OD sleeve price. Don't know what model the M block is  so there's a chance the block could get thin if bored for 4.125 ID sleeves.  Repair sleeves can also be installed in the C-281 block. Puller wants that block so he can go bigger with bore than the M.  Unless they are boring the bores out and welding others in. Some 450 tractors after a certain serial number came with 12 volts.

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Thanks for the la sleeves reference, I'll call them if the block comes up short. The super-M had the 264 block, which as I understand it is identical to the 281 block only with a smaller parent bore. At the moment, it's the free option, so I'll see how the machining goes. If it isn't going to work out, I'll see what la has available.

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4 hours ago, ThatRickGuy said:

Thanks for the la sleeves reference, I'll call them if the block comes up short. The super-M had the 264 block, which as I understand it is identical to the 281 block only with a smaller parent bore. At the moment, it's the free option, so I'll see how the machining goes. If it isn't going to work out, I'll see what la has available.

C-264 and C-281 have the same parent bore and originally just used heavy wall sleeves for a SM and thin wall in the C-281. Most were rebuilt with thin wall sleeves. Parent bore originally in M blocks is real close to the same size as the sleeve ID in 281 blocks or thin wall sleeves in a 264.

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  • 3 weeks later...

With needing custom sleeves (my one bore was gouged from previous work) my 450 cost north of 1500 per hole with a new propane head , used crankshaft, all machine work and assembly. I started with an antifreeze leak , ended up completely rebuilding it. I had a cracked crankshaft, head had been repaired at 3 places and was a super M head instead of a 450 head . My only thing now is that I have to run 110 octane so I don't run it much

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  • 1 month later...

Picked up the engine yesterday. 

Swapped blocks, bought a gas head off a guy they had just built for with an LP head. The shop ordered the wrist pin bushings and .010 under crank bearings. Pistons assembled, cam bearings in, journal and rod bearings in and blue printed, new sleeves in and honed. The full list of work and parts is 2 pages long. Total bill came out to $2744. Without having to replace the head or swap the block, would have been just shy of $2k. Now I just need the time to get it all put together!

Planning on putting a keystone turbo on it to take advantage of that 6.5:1 compression as long as it's all apart. I'll get it running NA first though, seat the rings, head gasket, and get the valve lash dialed in. 

To add to the fun though, our "spare" tractor, a Farmall 544 snapped it's cam shaft after 1 lap around the field cutting hay. I don't have room for 2 split tractors in the shed, so that one got a ride down to the local ag mechanics and will hopefully be back in operation next week. 

No photo description available.

-Rick

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/27/2021 at 8:57 PM, ThatRickGuy said:

Pro-tip for yall. Marry a woman who was an air frame mechanic in the Navy, she'll make the prettiest lock wire you've ever seen!
No photo description available.

Thank her for her service ! 

Looks good

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  • 3 weeks later...

Finally not 100 degrees in the barn. Managed to get the bottom half of the engine mostly together. I had a chance to get side by side shots of the new rings and sleeves (0.018" gap) and the old (~3/8"). It's amazing this engine was still holding 110 psi compression cold, but it explains why we had enough blow by to make my wife look like a coal miner when she came in from the field.

 

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