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1066 Clacking Noise


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3 minutes ago, J-Mech said:

No, not usually.  Seen hundreds of them. Usually they are quiet, but lock the engine up when they get hot.  But a severely worn skirt will rattle at lower RPM, old man. 

Oh you guys....do you script this out with each other ahead of time? I think you guys are close in age.

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Use a 3' section of small rubber hose to listen to "point" locations.   put one end of the hose in your ear, hold the other end against various point on and around the motor.  Make sure to stay clear

I meant physically in age not mentally...

This engine had a defined knock in the upper end. This is what I found so it can happen. 

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To clarify it a bit. Certain noises in engines make different sounds. Lower engine bad rod or main make a persistent rapping knocking this sound is usually twice as fast as others making noise every revolution.

upper engine valve train is usually a clicking at 1/2 engine speed. Bad alt, water pump or anything on front make a faint knock. Just loosen belts and this goes away

any piston noise you can tell a scored or loose usually thuds a bit more, a wrist pin loose or striking is a knocking tapping sound.

all these sounds are close to the same. Just like a musician can hear high or low notes. Am experienced guy can hear and almost tell you exactly what is wrong.

i like to be at one with an engine. Get everything peaceful and quiet , let it talk to you in a zen experience. Maybe take my shoes off take a nap and let engine sing to me. That’s how us old guys learned.

seriously Harry Hogg in days of thunder was making sweet talk to the motor. She responded with a little weep of antifreeze letting him know the experienced motor wasn’t up to the job. If you can tell I learned most of my skills through tv shows.

seriously I would say you either have a bad  valve train but it sounds like piston

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Possibly a loose valve seat insert......I have heard those make an intermittent clack clack kind of a noise that would come and go depending on RPM and engine temp.

Just a suggestion

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41 minutes ago, DTM124 said:

How would I check this valve insert for movement?

If they move they usually fall out. And hammer on piston top. Take a wood broom handle, just wood and press you ear and against block. You will locate noise . Broken or sawed off doesn’t matter how long it will lead you to rattle

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42 minutes ago, NY1468 said:

This engine had a defined knock in the upper end. This is what I found so it can happen. D00D9F2C-81FE-4B4D-866A-75F2811EF0D6.thumb.jpeg.9896f97279139ebf33cbe60152972260.jpeg

If that block is what those piston came out of, I bet they did rattle.  They are so loose in the holes I don't know how it ran.  It wasn't from the scoring.  They are shot and got loose in the bore. 

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8 hours ago, J-Mech said:

If that block is what those piston came out of, I bet they did rattle.  They are so loose in the holes I don't know how it ran.  It wasn't from the scoring.  They are shot and got loose in the bore. 

This is a deutz air cooled engine with the cylinders pulled. I’m not sure how to respond to your comment....

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1 hour ago, NY1468 said:

This is a deutz air cooled engine with the cylinders pulled. I’m not sure how to respond to your comment....

No response necessary.  I can see why they rattled, and it wasn't because they were scored. 

Scoring actually makes the piston larger, similar to how knurling would make them larger.  Often times a scored piston will actually squeal because it is so tight.  But not rattle.  Those rattled because of how loose they were.  Looks like that engine ingested a lot of dirt at some point. I thought it looked like a Deutz engine. 

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31 minutes ago, dale560 said:

20CE1D41-425A-4920-B197-C61DA87379D7.png

5A09B2C0-52A3-4A39-A130-E6ECDA30A4D2.png

Great.  The popping noise still was not the scored piston.  Tight pistons do not rattle.  Either the wrist pin hole in the piston was wollowed out, piston broke, spark knock due to low compression, or after the piston scored, it wore itself loose in the hole.

I love it how sometimes you guys are so destined to be right, that you will ignore facts and use extreme happened one time in 500 situations to try and prove something.  I've seen 1 in 500 situations.  This isn't one of them.  I can see the pictures.  The piston wasn't rattling because it was scored.

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57 minutes ago, J-Mech said:

No response necessary.  I can see why they rattled, and it wasn't because they were scored. 

Scoring actually makes the piston larger, similar to how knurling would make them larger.  Often times a scored piston will actually squeal because it is so tight.  But not rattle.  Those rattled because of how loose they were.  Looks like that engine ingested a lot of dirt at some point. I thought it looked like a Deutz engine. 

image.thumb.jpg.48f3f72e12fa39ba08e17ada6fffd10a.jpgSo it didn’t rattle as you say, it had a defined knock in #1 cylinder which is a big difference. I’m not sure how by looking at one picture of a piston that obviously got hot you can say it ingested a bunch of dirt. Here is the other piston cleaned a little.  Doesn’t look to bad to me. You will find out “hopefully” that you aren’t alway right. 

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And I wasn’t saying that it was the actual problem either, just could be. None of us on here are going to be exactly right because we aren’t there. So the best thing any of us can do is give our option which is what it is. An option and you know what they say about those. 

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4 minutes ago, NY1468 said:

You will find out “hopefully” that you aren’t alway right. 

I am not always right. Diagnosing without seeing is difficult... But wasn't the scoring that made it rattle.  That I am certain. Worn in the bore makes it rattle, and scored pistons have other indicators. The OP should also have a misfire, or the engine generally would have seized or got real tight at some point.  Nothing indicates a scored piston in his description. 

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1 minute ago, J-Mech said:

I am not always right.  But wasn't the scoring that made it rattle.  That I am certain. Worn in the bore makes it rattle. 

Guess you don’t read things through either...

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5 minutes ago, NY1468 said:

And I wasn’t saying that it was the actual problem either, just could be. None of us on here are going to be exactly right because we aren’t there. So the best thing any of us can do is give our option which is what it is. An option and you know what they say about those. 

True.  Except the point is that scoring doesn't in and of itself cause a rattle. 

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1 minute ago, NY1468 said:

Guess you don’t read things through either...

?  You are making posts while I am typing.  I am unaware if I missed something. 

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Just now, J-Mech said:

?  You are making posts while I am typing.  I am unaware if I missed something. 

It didn’t rattle, defined knock on #1 cylinder. Bearing was ok. 

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4 minutes ago, NY1468 said:

It didn’t rattle, defined knock on #1 cylinder. Bearing was ok. 

Ok.  I'm done.  I'm not going to debate it any further.  It is useless.

You guys go ahead and help this guy out.  This isn't helping anyone.

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3 hours ago, NY1468 said:

This is a deutz air cooled engine with the cylinders pulled. I’m not sure how to respond to your comment....

I was gonna say . . . loose as that looks I was thinking the liners were AWOL.  

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