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oldtanker

Clean energy?

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14 hours ago, cedar farm said:

One of the farm magazines I get had an article on the blades. If I remember correct Wyoming agree'd to allow 400 or so of them to be buried in their state . Think of the fuel/manpower used in transportation and disposal. They are not recyclable. I hope they call before they dig. Might hit some old buried nuclear fuel rods from years ago.

The dump at Sioux Falls, SD was accepting them but so many were coming in, they said, "STOP". Yes, they are fiberglass.

And when this raping of the government is over, the land under them will be lost forever.

How many sticks of Dynamite would it take to blow the hundreds of yards of concrete and re-bar out of the ground to get your land back?

Those round concrete circles will truly be monuments to mans stupidity. 

 

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2 hours ago, oldtanker said:

Where was fossil fuel or for that matter man when the climate changed enough to melt the ice that covered much of North America? Heck they say where I sit right now was under 3-5 miles of ice. The also say that long before man or fossil fuels that most of the earth was tropical. And I really doubt that dino farts cause either change. The climate changes. It's the the nature of earth.

Rick

 

carbon is either in the atmosphere, in the oceans, in the earth, or in the life on the surface.  Not destroyed or created,  just changing positions.

The question is.

Does changing the ratio of C in the 4 locations effect the climate or does changing the climate through some other means change the ratio of C in the 4 areas.

If we assume fossil fuel burning or man is not driving the climate to change then what is another possibility for the changes that we are seeing?   Things dont just happen in cycles "naturally" they happen because there are sets of rules that drive them.

 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, cjf711 said:

 

 

If we assume fossil fuel burning or man is not driving the climate to change then what is another possibility for the changes that we are seeing?   Things dont just happen in cycles "naturally" they happen because there are sets of rules that drive them.

 

 

 

 

Really? How do you know that this isn't natural cycles? They have been tracking weather and temperatures around the world less than 100 years. Here in the US just over 100 years. That means we know very little about natural cycles. When I was a kid at school they told us we were heading to another ice age. Then the ozone was dying. then global warming. Then climate change. FOLLOW THE MONEY! Or in the case the money, the "globalist" (one worlders) and the tree huggers. 

Heck, remember when the EPA claimed that many scientist believed in man made global warming/climate change? That many scientist is actually less than 80 world wide that the EPA cherry picked to make that claim. There were at the same time thousands of scientist who were saying "lets peer review this". The EPA and the minon "many scientist" refused to hand over the data for peer review. PEER REVIEW HAPPENS TO BE THE NORMAL WAY TO SUBSTANTIATE A SCIENTIFIC CLAIM.  

Rick 

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1 minute ago, oldtanker said:

Really? How do you know that this isn't natural cycles? They have been tracking weather and temperatures around the world less than 100 years. Here in the US just over 100 years. That means we know very little about natural cycles. When I was a kid at school they told us we were heading to another ice age. Then the ozone was dying. then global warming. Then climate change. FOLLOW THE MONEY! Or in the case the money, the "globalist" (one worlders) and the tree huggers. 

Heck, remember when the EPA claimed that many scientist believed in man made global warming/climate change? That many scientist is actually less than 80 world wide that the EPA cherry picked to make that claim. There were at the same time thousands of scientist who were saying "lets peer review this". The EPA and the minon "many scientist" refused to hand over the data for peer review. PEER REVIEW HAPPENS TO BE THE NORMAL WAY TO SUBSTANTIATE A SCIENTIFIC CLAIM.  

Rick 

natural cycles have rules, if shifting carbon is not a component driver of a changing climate what are some other ones?

volcanoes, asteroid impact, solar cycles, orbit changes, man,  all possible drivers 

I guess I dont know what you are saying by "natural cycle"  and following the money.   the climate is changing,  i dont think it takes much of a peer review to come to that conclusion?  What are some of the factors you propose that are driving the shift? 

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40 minutes ago, cjf711 said:

natural cycles have rules, if shifting carbon is not a component driver of a changing climate what are some other ones?

volcanoes, asteroid impact, solar cycles, orbit changes, man,  all possible drivers 

I guess I dont know what you are saying by "natural cycle"  and following the money.   the climate is changing,  i dont think it takes much of a peer review to come to that conclusion?  What are some of the factors you propose that are driving the shift? 

Most of the factors are natural causes. One of the bigger producers of methane in the world are an insect that occurs naturally. An insect that in developed areas man has been trying to kill doe decades. That is a natural factor as is a volcano, asteroid impact, orbit and solar cycles. 

Yes the climate changes. Here where I'm at was once an inland sea, then a tropical area, then was under the ice during the ice age. And no one was burning fossil fuels back then. So what cause those changes in the climate? I read somewhere an article by a scientist who stated that as best as he can conclude man MAY be responsible for as much as 2% of the carbon in our atmosphere. IN others words not enough to influence anything. 

Remember the Freon scare? It's eating a hole on the ozone? Now that was in the 80's. Well Freon is heavier than air. It takes Freon about 50 years to break down and ascend up to the ozone layer. So from the 80's minus 50 years. There was so little Freon being used in the 30's that it wasn't eating holes in the ozone. And what do we know about the ozone layer now? That there are holes in it naturally and they naturally get larger and smaller. Freon had nothing to do with it. Are you old enough to remember the 50's and early 60's? From the beginning of the tractor, car and trucks the gas engine was the most popular engine. In the 50's and early 60's almost all farm tractors were gas. Lot of smaller construction equipment  including some pay loaders, skip loaders, and road graders were gas. In the US almost all cars and pickups were gas. So were school buses and many medium duty trucks. Heck even some semi's were gas. Yet the experts at the EPA claimed that "many small children died in the 50's and early 60's due to diesel particulate matter". They did not have one medical report or autopsy to back that claim up. These are the people you chose to believe. Those are the people I call liars with an agenda. Now don't get me wrong. Getting rid of R4 was a good thing. Needed to happen as R4 is a nasty pollutant. Needed to get the lead out of gas too. What has Tier IV done except cost people money? And that's the average consumer. Companies pass on cost to customers. Look at the BIO thing. They are claiming that BIO fuel which has about the same BTO as gas is costing US consumers 5-6 billion a year in added cost to consumer goods.

Rick

 

 

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6 hours ago, oldtanker said:

Where was fossil fuel or for that matter man when the climate changed enough to melt the ice that covered much of North America? Heck they say where I sit right now was under 3-5 miles of ice. The also say that long before man or fossil fuels that most of the earth was tropical. And I really doubt that dino farts cause either change. The climate changes. It's the the nature of earth.

Rick

I know Rick but I was just trying to get the Climate change people to answer a question.But like always when they were hit with True facts they never have an answer. And if they truly believe that it’s happening why wouldn’t they give up what’s causing it. Example smoking causes cancer so I don’t smoke.

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7 minutes ago, Wi Ih said:

I know Rick but I was just trying to get the Climate change people to answer a question.But like always when they were hit with True facts they never have an answer.

OPPS sorry.

Rick

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i say we boil water and make steam 

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21 hours ago, searcyfarms said:

im not really sure the benefit of them they never pay for themselves and require a lot of maint from my understanding - i heard the local young fellas are using them for target practice trying to hit the spinning blades 😲

Sounds like something I would have done back in the day if it came across the farm it had better be a cow or moving fast.

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I have some about 10 miles north of me and another bunch about 4 miles east of me. I have heard around here that there is nothing in the contract about removal of the d@mn things when the contract is up but I can’t say for sure. 

 

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This is a google maps photo of a yard I drive by pretty regular about 10 or 12 miles away from my place. That’s over an 80 they are storing them on and the wheat field south of it is also full of them now. They bring them in on rail and truck. Definitely gives me something to cuss at

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23 hours ago, Wi Ih said:

So then fossil fuel are not the cause of climate change?

There's not one single thing. But some things are more prevalent than others.

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Don't know why they are not pushing solar harder................Alot of roof tops in "Merica".................I would love to have it on mine if they came up with a better system than a roof with panels over the roof.  We put solar lights in the barn and two panels on the roof line on the south side, mostly so I could leave them on all the time and not be uncle bumble F&%^ trying to find light switches at 1 am checking on cows calving.  They always work and cost nothing to run.  Going 5 years now with them.

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They are pushing solar. Their everywhere here. A few companies have gone broke with em. There was a site ouyside of zumbro falls that was basically abandoned when it was finished. Dont know if its being operated or not. Solars fine on a small scale but large scale its not working too well yet.

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Read some where (might have been on here) that Solar, when you get above Oklahoma it gets less effective.

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31 minutes ago, Wi Ih said:

Read some where (might have been on here) that Solar, when you get above Oklahoma it gets less effective.

That's what I have heard too.

They're trying to erect a solar farm on the North side of my town. 1000 some acres. They keep saying they are going to get started on it soon. I don't know if they got it though or not but a bunch of landowners were trying to get the solar company to put money into escrow to cleanup the stuff if they go broke or whenever they're done with the panels so the landowner isn't shouldered with the burden of cleaning it up. We've had papers show up in the mail wanting us to lease our land to a solar company and they got filed in the trash.

One thing I will say about the windmills is at least you can still work the ground around the windmill. Solar farm you can't do squat with that land with all that sitting on it.

 I get a kick out of people pushing solar around here. We are way North of the effective line around here. To top it off. This is Michigan. Those of you that have never been here from Mid November till Middle to the end of March. Its like living in a armpit. Its wet, cool or cold and cloudy almost all the time. Those Lakes that surround us produce clouds whenever cold air blows over the water ( Or lake effect snow if the wind is strong enough or cold enough). You can have months here where you might only see 12 to maybe 20% possible sunshine in a single month. Now before someone jumps on my case about they can still produce energy on a cloudy day. That may be. But how economical and efficient are they in these conditions and mind you, you have months of this to deal with. 

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Not to mention you cant store what they produce if demand is down thus they sit idle at times. Not to mention the land this crap takes up. Just ugly.

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I am not talking about putting up those stupid solar farms, there was company's working on solar "shingles" that replaced your roof, If they could get that going, they could put it on all my structures here.  Look at all the acreage covered by roofs in the USA doing zip other than shedding water.

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There is a big green energy push here. The leader for this green energy is by far and large solar power. Why? When one industry is the “golden child” of this so called green energy crisis it makes me suspicious about it. Who is benefiting the most from it. You know, the whole Who, What,When,Where, Why, How thing. Those were the fundamental questions of any good reporting. A lost art in today’s world.

By the way, in order to push the green energy agenda, we decommissioned our Nuclear plant, and stopped or reduced the amount of power from Hydro-Quebec. In my opinion two of the cleanest energy sources we could have. Electricity rates have, to put it in the words of a former president “ necessarily skyrocketed “

I’ll give you the decommissioning of our Nuclear plant, but why not replace it? We are simply going to replace that proven energy source for what? Yet, these same people who push for us to denuclearize are /were pushing for Iran to become a nuclear power. Genius. Pure Genius.

Something stinks here, and it’s not cow poop!

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38 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

I am not talking about putting up those stupid solar farms, there was company's working on solar "shingles" that replaced your roof, If they could get that going, they could put it on all my structures here.  Look at all the acreage covered by roofs in the USA doing zip other than shedding water.

https://www.tesla.com/solarroof

 

 

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6 minutes ago, cjf711 said:

How much? 25 year warranty, is Tesla going to be around in 25 years? I doubt it. 
 From what I’ve seen you either buy the solar panels(roof) and take the depreciation out over the life of the system, not factoring in any maintenance costs, or you pay for the electricity. It’s pretty much a wash. I haven’t seen any where or any body making money off solar except these companies with huge government subsidies. Cylindra ( spelling?California company that was O’s go to until the went bankrupt immediately after getting huge subsidies)for example 

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5 minutes ago, Ihfan4life said:

How much? 25 year warranty, is Tesla going to be around in 25 years? I doubt it. 
 From what I’ve seen you either buy the solar panels(roof) and take the depreciation out over the life of the system, not factoring in any maintenance costs, or you pay for the electricity. It’s pretty much a wash. I haven’t seen any where or any body making money off solar except these companies with huge government subsidies. Cylindra ( spelling?California company that was O’s go to until the went bankrupt immediately after getting huge subsidies)for example 

I did, but cost of power company was 60k to bring in solar was 12k...and no power bill all summer and gen gas in winter.

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IMO wind energy is just ruining the view and with all the other reasons every one has stated it should not be allowed.

It can't possibly be "carbon neutral" when you add up all that goes into manufacturing and maintenance.  

I have a place in rural Maine and until the last couple of years you could stand on one of the ridges and look in every direction and not see a man made structure.

But now there are 7 wind turbines on one of the ridges towards Bangor and see I sites going in closer to my location.

Thousands of years an unobstructed view and now I have to look at these that is not progress.   

 

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1 minute ago, jeeper61 said:

IMO wind energy is just ruining the view and with all the other reasons every one has stated it should not be allowed.

It can't possibly be "carbon neutral" when you add up all that goes into manufacturing and maintenance.  

I have a place in rural Maine and until the last couple of years you could stand on one of the ridges and look in every direction and not see a man made structure.

But now there are 7 wind turbines on one of the ridges towards Bangor and see sites going in closer to my location.

Thousands of years an unobstructed view and now I have to look at these that is not progress.   

 

I got a coal fired plant about 15 miles away that bothers my skyline too.  Id trade it for the windmills in terms of view obstruction.

everything is good until it goes in your back yard though.

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1 hour ago, cjf711 said:

I got a coal fired plant about 15 miles away that bothers my skyline too.  Id trade it for the windmills in terms of view obstruction.

everything is good until it goes in your back yard though.

One stack vs thousands wind mills in every direction? I'd take the stack.

Convert the plant to Natural gas and it will be a h@ll of a lot better for the planet than the wind mills.

The area I am talking about is wilderness, are we that disparate for clean energy that we are going to ruin some of pristine vistas  left on the planet?

It is all about the money from the government.

And now come the solar farms put up with the same money they cut down hundreds of acres of forest to put them up another crime against the planet.

    

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