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Hello Everyone,

I am wanting to get started in hay and wondering what equipment would be recommended to start? I plan on doing about 60 -80 acres and would like the ability to do either round bales or small squares. I was thinking that a 1066 or something similar would be a good tractor to use for the balers and the mower. I would probably use my M for raking but don't know for sure. What specific models would you buy to start with? I was looking at staying with New Holland products just for simplicity but let me know if that is a mistake. 

Thanks 

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For small squares I have a JD 336.  I love it. It makes perfect square bales every time.  Last year I went through the knotters, they had tied over a quarter million bales with no problems!

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2nd the 336 baler had 2 now have 338 same but high capacity parts readily available  more money but I have been looking at case ih/ Hesston inline baler for next upgrade 

mower case ih or new holland discbine same machines different decals

rake new holland 256 or 258   The 258 takes wider prefer dolly wheel to push rake away from tractor if tighter turning   We upgraded to Vermeer rr140 rotary rake like it better but a lot more money

tedder   Sitrex or titan industries basically same until last year updated wheels and axle on titan   17’ will cover 2 9’ mower swaths easily 19’ will do 2 13’ mower passes.

Side note if fields close eztrail bale baskets work good kinda bulky have a learning curve but simple     Better kuhns acculmator. Expensive require a loader but faster less labor if have facilities 

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An M isn't a very good raking tractor. Fourth gear is only five Mikes per hour.

 

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Third the JD 336 baler.  I like the pan thrower much better than my old NH 273 had and it's proven to be a reliable, tough machine.

I looked at the CIH/NH discbine when I upgraded from a haybine but the European equipment is much better quality construction.  I ended up going with the Krone 2800cri and the only complaint I have is it's very heavy, so tight turns will tear the grass up under the wheel that isn't turning as the mower is pulled around.  It's also possible to tip it up on end when it's raised if you take a turn too fast on a hillside (ask me how I know that...) but that can be avoided by not going too fast.  Specifically, the frame is made out of very heavy steel, the turtles have shear pins and will pop off the hubs before you tear up the gears, and the way the mower head moves back and up instead of just up when you hit a rock seems to handle the occasional rock or groundhog hole collision well.  My neighbor has a CIH discbine, not sure of the model, but next to my Krone it's built like a toy.

I have an older Taarup rake, which is the same as the modern Kubota rotary rakes (they apparently bought out the line from Kverneland).  I would think any rotary rake is better than an old rollover, I'm pretty happy with this one.  I had to modify it with a wider diameter lift cylinder to be able to rake with my older tractors (I have a few Case 430 and 530s).  Don't get a rotary rake that's too wide if you have bumpy or uneven ground else you'll bottom the tines out and that breaks the arms after a while.

I ted with an old Fahr four star unit, I'm looking at upgrading to a newer one with hydraulic fold soon and will likely get a Krone 5.52t (~19 feet wide, 4 stars, hyd fold).  Like the discbine, the Krone hardware is unbelievably well built.  That little 5.52 tedder weighs about 1500 pounds!

I have a mix match of different running gear from Case, Gehl, and NH under mostly steel racks.  Steel with a pressure treated floor has served me well.

My big tractors are an IH 1486 and White 2-70, I like the IH for mowing (POWER!!!) and the White for baling due to the 3 speed power shift.  The case 430 and 530s I  have are great for raking and tedding because they're so small and light (less compaction).  The diesel 530 can just barely handle the baler but I sure wouldn't take it on a hill!

That's my setup anyway, I hope the info helps and good luck!

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1 hour ago, randy hall said:

An M isn't a very good raking tractor. Fourth gear is only five Mikes per hour.

 

+1............Only good M is one with a 9 spd.  

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2 hours ago, TP from Central PA said:

+1............Only good M is one with a 9 spd.  

Why do you need to go so fast raking?  

He is only starting with 60 to 80 acres.  An M on the rake is fine.  If he was making 40 acres a day, day after day, then yes faster would be better.

I have raked countless acres on a super C with a side delivery rake.

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5 minutes ago, Mudfly said:

Why do you need to go so fast raking?  

He is only starting with 60 to 80 acres.  An M on the rake is fine.  If he was making 40 acres a day, day after day, then yes faster would be better.

I have raked countless acres on a super C with a side delivery rake.

Really? even on a 15 acre hay strip it felt like years rolling acouple windrows of grass hay together with a wheel rake crawling along a 5 per.   Here the dew gets on around 7 making the hay tough, limited time to rake if you have anything else to do during the day.  Never said it wouldn't work, I just like a Super M or 9 spd M a whole lot better.

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I always raked with the JD B.  I do believe that's even slower.   Rake too fast with a side delivery and you destroy the rake.   My concern would be just use a wide front tractor so you don't run over the swath.

606-1066 make excellent hay tractors unless you need a hydro for fast back/forward on a loader, etc.

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2 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

Really? even on a 15 acre hay strip it felt like years rolling acouple windrows of grass hay together with a wheel rake crawling along a 5 per.   Here the dew gets on around 7 making the hay tough, limited time to rake if you have anything else to do during the day.  Never said it wouldn't work, I just like a Super M or 9 spd M a whole lot better.

Northern MN - dew is on by 7 or earlier.  We also used an 8N to rake with.  I preferred the super C.  3rd gear is well shy of 5 mph.  

I know my grandparents put up 25,000 square bales one summer with an M on the square baler.  An H to rake and haul wagons, and a super C with a sickle mower.

  I concur that there are better taking tractors than an M, but let him get a year or two into it before spending too much money.

 

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eighty acres of hay is quite a bit of hay in my book. I only mow around twenty acres a day and it takes forever to rake it with my rotary rake going 9 or 10 miles per hour. I would certainly not recommend an old made for horses side delivery rake for eighty acres of hay. If I had to rake twenty acres with a side delivery rake 25% would be raked too wet about half OK and the rest too dry with leaves flying everywhere.

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Pfffft.  256/258 side delivery rakes, $1000-2000, behind an M, he'll be fine.  We did 30k bales for 30+ years with three 256's at 6-6.5 mph.  I now use larger rotary rakes but still don't exceed 6.5-7mph.  I don't like to wreck stuff. And I'm in NY, where at 7pm.....you aren't doing Anything in a field with dry hay.  

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We used to rake with a farmall h and 256 figured 5 acres an hour in forth 3/4-7/8 throttle pulled the 17’ Tedder same tractor settings figured 10 acres an hour  still use 4840 Deere and 13’ cih center pivot discbine at 10 acres an hour could go faster but we just cruise with it since it’s our highest production set up   Balong is our slow spot as we square bale 60-80% all cuttings which in good first cutting is only 1.5 to 2 acres an hour   200 bales +or- an hour is what we shoot for.   Using older tricycle pan seat tractors is impossible to do 80 acres just have chiropractor on speed dial after full days 

or I’m starting to get too old

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We rake with a John Deere 64 hay rake which is usually on the 460 and a 256 New Holland rake behind my 1948 H. Get along fine with them.

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we pulled 2 258 rakes hooked together for years going about 4mph.  We now use them singly to turn large windrows to get them to dry, and only go about 3-4 mph then, and we put up about 300 acres of hay each summer plus ditches and grass waterways.  Go too fast and it throws the hay too much.  If wanting to go square bales we use a JD baler, round bales we use 5 8480 case ih balers not the fastest but can be bought very cheap and are easy to use and repair if need be.

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 When I first started cutting hay I was using a farmall 656 gas with a 2000 loader and a big cab with a 461  New Holland haybine. Then I upgraded to a 966 and a 489 new Holland, after that I went to 7120 with the 5209 new idea disc mower 

 The raking tractor was a Farmall 350 with an international 15 rake then we upgraded to a 35 rake. 

 The baling tractor was a 574 gas row crop with of a international 47 baler. It was a decent baler, it never had tying problems the only thing was we wanted a wider pick up and a bale thrower so we upgraded to a new Holland 316 which has been a decent baler but it doesn’t always make nice bales of hay compared to the new Holland 311 baler 

In 2001 we bought a case IH 8312 disc-mower, we’re still cutting hay with it and the 7120. The 8312 was built by Heston and has to be one of the best mowers on the market!  The only major repair I’ve done to it was to replace the rollers about five or six years ago after the bottom one broke, I replace the rubber ones with two steel rollers, other than that it’s just been a few bearings and a few bolts and it cuts a pile of hay every year! I can cut with it up to 13 mph depending on how rough the field is and how heavy the crop is.  One farm I rent has 30 acres of hay in eight small fields it takes about six hours or so to cut, whereas if I have a 30 acre field that is half a mile long I can cut that down in less than two hours 

  I have a Kuhn 7802  six rotor Tedder and two double rotary rakes, one is a claas 650 twin that was bought new in 2003 and the other one is a Kuhn 7932  that’s been here since 2013.    The 650 twin I can rake with it at about 5 to 6 mph and 7932 I can do 6 to 7 mph, if I get both rakes going in a nice big field I can rake about 55 acres in less than two hours 

 When I bake small square bales I still have the 316  and I rent my cousins 316 and I can bale about 800 bales in three hours or so.

 Most of my Hay is baled in big squares with an MX 220 magnum and Taarup 6570 baler, that thing can eat hay! I normally make 3‘ x 3‘ x 8‘ bales but some customers want 5’ or 6’ bales, it can easily bail over 100-8’ bales per hour! 

 If I have enough help I can easily cover 30 to 50 acres of hay per day, if it’s just me it usually takes me a couple of days to cut, Ted, rake bale and pick up 30 acres which is about 150 to 250 big square bales.

 When it comes to picking up the big bales I have a truck and trailer, Hydro 186 with a 2350 loader, new Holland L180 skid steer and a case IH MX 100 maxxum with an L 300 loader that normally piles the hay in the domes and I also have two wagons for the fields that I can’t get in and out of with the truck and trailer 

 I am very happy with all of my haying equipment, if I was to upgrade my discmower I would probably go to a Kuhn, One of my buddies has one and he just loves it!   Someday I plan on trading the Claas rake in for another Kuhn.  Someday I would like to have another trailer to haul hay with too. Everything else I have is perfect for my needs. 

 Here is a few pictures of my hay equipment 

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23 hours ago, JessePeden said:

2nd the 336 baler had 2 now have 338 same but high capacity parts readily available  more money but I have been looking at case ih/ Hesston inline baler for next upgrade 

mower case ih or new holland discbine same machines different decals

rake new holland 256 or 258   The 258 takes wider prefer dolly wheel to push rake away from tractor if tighter turning   We upgraded to Vermeer rr140 rotary rake like it better but a lot more money

tedder   Sitrex or titan industries basically same until last year updated wheels and axle on titan   17’ will cover 2 9’ mower swaths easily 19’ will do 2 13’ mower passes.

Side note if fields close eztrail bale baskets work good kinda bulky have a learning curve but simple     Better kuhns acculmator. Expensive require a loader but faster less labor if have facilities 

CIH/NH only the same machine depending on when made.In my opinion I rather have a Hesston sycle/discbine mower then NH.Hesston made them for CIH untill NH merger and in my opinion far better then NH. JD makes a heck of a good small square baler too ,I prob buy one of them before a NH.But to each their own.

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On 12/30/2019 at 11:47 AM, chevenstein said:

Third the JD 336 baler.  I like the pan thrower much better than my old NH 273 had and it's proven to be a reliable, tough machine.

I looked at the CIH/NH discbine when I upgraded from a haybine but the European equipment is much better quality construction.  I ended up going with the Krone 2800cri and the only complaint I have is it's very heavy, so tight turns will tear the grass up under the wheel that isn't turning as the mower is pulled around.  It's also possible to tip it up on end when it's raised if you take a turn too fast on a hillside (ask me how I know that...) but that can be avoided by not going too fast.  Specifically, the frame is made out of very heavy steel, the turtles have shear pins and will pop off the hubs before you tear up the gears, and the way the mower head moves back and up instead of just up when you hit a rock seems to handle the occasional rock or groundhog hole collision well.  My neighbor has a CIH discbine, not sure of the model, but next to my Krone it's built like a toy.

I have an older Taarup rake, which is the same as the modern Kubota rotary rakes (they apparently bought out the line from Kverneland).  I would think any rotary rake is better than an old rollover, I'm pretty happy with this one.  I had to modify it with a wider diameter lift cylinder to be able to rake with my older tractors (I have a few Case 430 and 530s).  Don't get a rotary rake that's too wide if you have bumpy or uneven ground else you'll bottom the tines out and that breaks the arms after a while.

I ted with an old Fahr four star unit, I'm looking at upgrading to a newer one with hydraulic fold soon and will likely get a Krone 5.52t (~19 feet wide, 4 stars, hyd fold).  Like the discbine, the Krone hardware is unbelievably well built.  That little 5.52 tedder weighs about 1500 pounds!

I have a mix match of different running gear from Case, Gehl, and NH under mostly steel racks.  Steel with a pressure treated floor has served me well.

My big tractors are an IH 1486 and White 2-70, I like the IH for mowing (POWER!!!) and the White for baling due to the 3 speed power shift.  The case 430 and 530s I  have are great for raking and tedding because they're so small and light (less compaction).  The diesel 530 can just barely handle the baler but I sure wouldn't take it on a hill!

That's my setup anyway, I hope the info helps and good luck!

We also have a Krone mower conditioner, 2801cv impeller machine.  I’ve had mine on two wheels too...

Here a video of it working...

The Krone is an awesome mower conditioner.

 

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On 12/29/2019 at 10:29 PM, farmallh said:

Hello Everyone,

I am wanting to get started in hay and wondering what equipment would be recommended to start? I plan on doing about 60 -80 acres and would like the ability to do either round bales or small squares. I was thinking that a 1066 or something similar would be a good tractor to use for the balers and the mower. I would probably use my M for raking but don't know for sure. What specific models would you buy to start with? I was looking at staying with New Holland products just for simplicity but let me know if that is a mistake. 

Thanks 

In addition to the Krone I mentioned earlier, we have a New Holland 256 rake, New Holland 156 tedder and a John Deere 348 square baler with a pan kicker.  I’ll try to attach videos of those - but you can go to JHJ-Farm on you tube and find all of our videos, including other hay equipment we use.

80 acres is a lot of hay, especially for square bales and older equipment.  What is your market?

Good luck!

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I have had a CIH 8312 disc mower for many years, and also later bought a NH 1431 as a companion. if I was replacing them, I would buy a decent 8312 in a heartbeat. I would NEVER buy another 1431. the design of the NH cutterbar (pods with little driveshafts between) means that you have to drop the whole bar if anything goes wrong with a pod that isn't on one end or the other. the new NH design looks a lot better to me, but also much more $$$$.

the rakes are NH 256/258, the round baler is a NH848 chain baler, and the square baler is a NH 311. all good for the small amount of hay I make.

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Not sure op location and wether he is talking 80 ac per cutting or per season. Lot is gonna depend on whats available in his area and his budget. Hard to go wrong with a good 1066 i would think. Tho a hydro might be a bit nicer than a gear drive for making hay if one is to be found.

I mow with a 411 nh bisc mower which i think is around 10' cut in heavy windrows that can be a bit much for my jd 24t square baler.  So thinking about cap of mower versus cap of baler your looking at might be something to keep in mind. I rake with either 400 or 560 on and older sitrex 8 wheel rake. Dad always preached going slower raking with the basket rake we had to not knock leaves of the alfalfa. Can get by going a bit faster with a wheel rake plus your taking 2 windrows at a time for a big baler so that saves time right there.

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We use a long bar rake on a h and run it in 5th low throttle but it is flat here the only time I use 4th is around the area that has wash outs and erosion problems 

if you use 5th you have to watch your turns and watch that you don’t stall on inclines when running low throttle 

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Do you kinda have a budget set forth your thinking? If you are going to be making 60-80 total acres at least 3: times a year you will have to have not new, but decent equipment. On a budget I suppose a decent if you can find one, New Holland 499, 4 basket tedder, 2 bar rakes hooked tandem and even that will be slow raking with a H. Round baler with net wrap. String tied bales don't sell unless you give them away. 570 or 575 baler. If going kick baler you have wagons to buy or a accumulator and grapple unless you're luckier than anyone else and have plenty of help to stack on the wagon and unload. A decent disc mower will cut your mowing time in half very easily if you can afford one. A used rake like I have can be had for around 5000. My HT 154 by far probably isn't the best rake, but it's alot better than a bar rake. A 8' side delivery with a H in 4th gear is self induced punishment. I don't think you will be happy with that arrangement

KIMG0261.jpg

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We run 575's/bc5070's.....always have had red balers do that's all we know, but  for the money I'd almost suggest a green one.  Or, an older 276/315 baler. They sure go cheap, and work great. 

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On 12/30/2019 at 10:23 AM, randy hall said:

An M isn't a very good raking tractor. Fourth gear is only five Mikes per hour.

 

Agreed. But it's what hes got. 

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