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This lady is wanting to rent her house, she had the fire marshal in to inspect, he found the usual things, smoke alarms, stair lights, ground fault protection, etc and a list of other blinding hazards that need addressing.

1790 house first wired in the 40’s then another round in the 70’s and some stuff done in the late 90’s plus an indoor pool, the picture doesn’t include anything to do with the pool except a sub feed to that panel. 

She says I just want it to be safe🙄people have no clue what they are asking for.

The main house comprises over 60 circuits 😱an absurd volume with no rhyme or reason for their assignment. One opening here, 3 there, range hood and one of 6 bedroom receptacles on one circuit, the bathroom and basement sump pump on another .. it’s bizarre, I’ve seen some crap, I’ve seen scarier, but this is a nightmare, we’re adding a main panel elsewhere that will take all the sub panels and allow more room to clean up this mess, replacing both of these panels to allow for better quality, modern breakers and better accommodate arc fault and ground fault protection, generally clean up this effing mess and lay groundwork for a rewire next year. 

6475D700-5B49-498D-8635-3DB5372FCBD7.jpeg

5D233903-5E01-4792-B9FA-5FD5BBF0BC6B.jpeg

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That looks kinda daunting...

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13 minutes ago, NY1468 said:

That looks kinda daunting...

That's about how I feel about it, dad and I spent 5 hours today just identifying and labeling, not done yet, only thing labeled in the whole panel is "ovens" ...no kidding 

<_<

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Well .....  no booster cables Seth !!!! Cant be all that bad 🤨

 

                HP

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3 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

Yeah, but no wasps?

Just outside the door, vinyl siding and slate roof. Wasps we got, also overrun with milk snakes, they're boiling out of every cavity... No mice though 

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Looks about like my house panel. Sub panels in various places. Probably sub sub panels if I knew the truth. The only practical way to make our house safe is to have the fire preemptively. 

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7 minutes ago, Gearclash said:

Looks about like my house panel. Sub panels in various places. Probably sub sub panels if I knew the truth. The only practical way to make our house safe is to have the fire preemptively. 

Sub panels are great, save congestion, in large buildings save lots of wire, many good reasons for lots of sub panels, there's a right way and there's this way. 

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Sadly, I have seen much worse as I am sure you have as well. Nice of them to label the oven circuit for you. It is a PITA to sort all of that out. Have you seen the circuit identifier that will tell you what circuit breaker an outlet is connected to? As I recall, there is a transmitter at the panel that you connect a "probe" to each circuit and then go around with a wireless receiver that will tell you which breaker it is. It has a display that gives the circuit number. Seems like they were $1000-1200 so not easy to justify. 

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Good lord vt......ill pray for you!

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1 hour ago, vtfireman85 said:

This lady is wanting to rent her house, she had the fire marshal in to inspect, he found the usual things, smoke alarms, stair lights, ground fault protection, etc and a list of other blinding hazards that need addressing.

1790 house first wired in the 40’s then another round in the 70’s and some stuff done in the late 90’s plus an indoor pool, the picture doesn’t include anything to do with the pool except a sub feed to that panel. 

She says I just want it to be safe🙄people have no clue what they are asking for.

The main house comprises over 60 circuits 😱an absurd volume with no rhyme or reason for their assignment. One opening here, 3 there, range hood and one of 6 bedroom receptacles on one circuit, the bathroom and basement sump pump on another .. it’s bizarre, I’ve seen some crap, I’ve seen scarier, but this is a nightmare, we’re adding a main panel elsewhere that will take all the sub panels and allow more room to clean up this mess, replacing both of these panels to allow for better quality, modern breakers and better accommodate arc fault and ground fault protection, generally clean up this effing mess and lay groundwork for a rewire next year. 

6475D700-5B49-498D-8635-3DB5372FCBD7.jpeg

5D233903-5E01-4792-B9FA-5FD5BBF0BC6B.jpeg

Our house was built in 1968. When we moved in it had fuses instead of circuit breakers. The fuse box though was a work of art it should have been  framed for display. All the wires came down evenly spaced on outside then turned 90 degrees enter box. Each one stapled evenly and spaced and turned even out. New circuit box looks like this one. Inside new boxes are a instructions on how to run wires.

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That panel needs a dozen or so tandems in it! You get more circuits that way.......💡🙄

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8 hours ago, 12_Guy said:

Sadly, I have seen much worse as I am sure you have as well. Nice of them to label the oven circuit for you. It is a PITA to sort all of that out. Have you seen the circuit identifier that will tell you what circuit breaker an outlet is connected to? As I recall, there is a transmitter at the panel that you connect a "probe" to each circuit and then go around with a wireless receiver that will tell you which breaker it is. It has a display that gives the circuit number. Seems like they were $1000-1200 so not easy to justify. 

This one is a hideous mess, but not the scariest thing I've seen by far, trouble is there's too much big stuff leaving it and each and every person who had ever been here figured he was the last, you can't see it in the pic but there's a whole bunch of cables coming from the left side of the panel.  there has been lots of stuff added to this house but nothing removed, a lot of the black Amer-flex seems to go to feed BX circuits, so that's the scariest thing here. Also the house has been spray foam insulated before we ever arrived so that is somewhat complicating our world. 

Last week I was in a panel my grandfather had installed, he did good work, but he did things like put a n 12 circuit panels that were full to capacity the day they were installed, a lot of his customers were locals when he first got started on his own in 63', people from our town tended to be pretty frugal, either by choice or necessity, either way, a 20circuit panel was  an extra 15 or 20 dollars so no way it was worth the extra :angry:.in any event, this panel I was in had been put in an addition, and then fed the rest of the house, one of the old narrow QO with a tiny neutral bus above the main. Then a 4 pole 100a to feed the main house leaving 8 spaces for branch circuits. It all was fine until 02 (based on the wire mfr date) SOMEONE, and I suspect I know who, came in and added 9 more cables to this panel, adding 3 tandems and piggybacking the rest, as many as 3 #12 in each of the old T-hole neutral buss holes, stacked a couple under the main neutral lug along with 2 SEU aluminum  neutrals, fortunately gramp had been pretty generous with Nalox so they weren't all corroded. It was a mess, gotta come out next week, as it was what should have taken 20 mins took 4 hours just to get things energized.

I'd say a minimum of 50 percent of my day on average is spent just undoing the previous persons errors on old work projects, I'm sure other trades have the same issue, it would have been easier to do correctly than it was to screw it up, however some amateur was really proud of themselves for being creative, or just plain negligent. Using materials never intended to be used for a given purpose and doing crap that doesn't make sense. 

 

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10 hours ago, vtfireman85 said:

Just outside the door, vinyl siding and slate roof. Wasps we got, also overrun with milk snakes, they're boiling out of every cavity... No mice though 

Snakes? May as well burn it down and start over! 

 

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2 hours ago, vtfireman85 said:

Using materials never intended to be used for a given purpose and doing crap that doesn't make sense. 

I removed a j box cover once that seemed very flimsy.  Instead of Raco or Steel City it said "drip grind".

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And that folks is why we have an electrical code, 

 

 

dang, be safe

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10 minutes ago, AKwelder said:

And that folks is why we have an electrical code, 

 

 

dang, be safe

No residential endorsement in VT, unfortunately too many people see that as “no code” for residential. 

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She just wants it safe. So put the dead front on for her and make sure everything is grounded properly. 😄

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