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SuperWD9

Tractors that weren’t made but should have been.

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24 minutes ago, bitty said:

We had a glorified quad range (24-speed actually) in 8960 . The thing I absolutely hated about that if you're backing up you have to shift it up through first gear to get to neutral...... I don't think they could ever put in neutral at a stupider place even if they spend a whole lot of time to figure out where it could be worse

Our 8960 had the 12 speed powershift and nobody liked it because you had to start in 1st every time you stopped and they were jerky. The next tractor (9400) had the 24 speed and all three of us preferred it over the powershift until Deere came with their own 18 speed. 

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41 minutes ago, Big Bud guy said:

Our 8960 had the 12 speed powershift and nobody liked it because you had to start in 1st every time you stopped and they were jerky. The next tractor (9400) had the 24 speed and all three of us preferred it over the powershift until Deere came with their own 18 speed. 

My brother preferred the 8960 over the 9170 with the 12 speed PS for the same reason. I however would have to smash my hand with a 12 lb sledge hammer twice to be mad enough to spend much time in the 8960. 

Keep in mind that we had a 16' blade on it for pushing silage so all you do is shift all day

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23 hours ago, sandhiller said:

I don't know what this is or if it even existed, but I kinda want one. 

da22afaa3b48229c1f5aed94bdaf9872.jpg

Reminds me alot of the Class zerion tractor in ways

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9 hours ago, iowaboy1965 said:

The 100 series was a facelift with some improvements in hydraulics ect freshend up the line enough to generate some sales.  In YOUR area and say from Kansas Dakotas Colorado and west  im guessing in 1958 a 706/806 size tractor would have been a hit. But in from say Iowa on east there were a lot of smaller farms and guys who been thru the depresion and were not gonna spend money on some big fancy tractor and the equippment to go with when the old M was paid for and big enough to meet their needs, they might buy a 560 but an 806 might have been too big a step for many in 58. Gotta remember there were some old guys having retirement sales in the early 70s that still had Ms as their big tractor. I bought a 3 bottom plow 15 or 20 years ago from an old fellow who ran 2 M's and a 37 ih disc and the plow till he retired. Dont recall what year he quit but had to be late 70s at least. One friend told about his wifes grandpa still farming with horses into the late 60s iirc. Unusual in iowa at that time but there were a few hold outs. Easy to look back 50 plus years and say what should have been but things were a bit diff then. 58 may or may not have been a bit too early for the 806. 

I understand what you're saying. Agreed '58 would probably be early for the 7 & 806 maybe if the introduction of the 06's was put back even 3 years from when they were originally introduced that would maybe be alright. If that were so IH and JD would have introduced 6 cylinder tractors the same year which could have been interesting to see how the market played out then. Keep in mind I was not bashing the 300/400 & 350/450 tractors.

To be honest I like this thread it makes me think about the designs and its interesting to see what others have to say 

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40 minutes ago, bitty said:

My brother preferred the 8960 over the 9170 with the 12 speed PS for the same reason. I however would have to smash my hand with a 12 lb sledge hammer twice to be mad enough to spend much time in the 8960. 

Keep in mind that we had a 16' blade on it for pushing silage so all you do is shift all day

Honestly neither transmission sounds appealing to me in that kind of job.  That's why when we had to back fill our pivot pipeline trench I used our Steiger with the Allison.  No clutching and no herky jerkyness

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Heavy duty bi-directional tractor with choice of transmissions (power shift).

66-86 series tractors with factory integrated mfwd that would turn sharp and be engaged/disengaged on the go, powershift transmission, slightly longer wheelbase and enough 3 point hitch capacity to handle a 6 row peanut digger/shaker/inverter.

Super70 series with powershift, front frames strong enough for tanks ,15,000lb 3pt hitch and 300+ hp.

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I'll try this one more time!  😎  IH could have had the world's highest hp row crop tractor, the Farmall 660 (a bolt together tractor) 1958-63? using the 560 and 660 tractors.  For the most part they share the same parts book.  For all practical purposes they are the same chassis except the 660 has planetary reductions on the back axle.  There are some differences.  The 660 radiator is taller.?  The hood sides are taller.  The fuel tank has a 1"+? spacer (riser) under it.  I don't have one or I could look. 😂  To make a Farmall 660, start with an International 660.  Remove the rear fenders, seat, transmission cover, brake pedals, steering gear assembly, TA lever, hydraulic valves, PTO lever, front axle and bolster from the 660.  Transfer these components from the Farmall 560 to the International 660. They are Bolt On.  If you want fast hitch, transfer that also.  If you want, you can bolt all these 660 components onto the Farmall 560.  Which will then make it an International 560.  You will now have a Farmall 660 (row crop). 85 HP ? It will have all the problems of an International 660.  Someone with a 660 will have to check this out.  I have a 560 but no 660.  

Note:  The steering wheel will be about 1+in? higher than a Farmall 560? use spacers under  seat if necessary and under the hydraulic valve assembly? to keep hood level?  IH would have had to stamp new emblems for the hood sides.  And of course, they would have had to print a new brochure. For row widths other than 30", need to cast new spacers for back wheels.?        (Probably need to beef up Fast Hitch , and attaching points).                   

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You are probably right Fred.  I never thought there was much basic difference between the 560 and 660 other than a turned up pump with the engine turning a few more rpms??

Have a good friend who he and his dad had two 660s--------those were two "snake-bit" tractors from the start.

They finally traded the 660s for a couple of 4010s.  The dealer put them in an auction where a jockey bought them.  My friend was at the auction and watched the tractors sell.  As he was leaving-----the buyer was loading them onto a semi flatbed off of an implement dealer's tilt bed (lots of overhang).

Yep--------the truck tipped and the 660 hit the ground with a bang------breaking the tractor into.   Luckily no one was hurt.   He just walked away shaking his head--------thinking that it must have been destiny and how glad it was no longer his tractor to repair.

They have been green ever since trading for the 4010s.

 

DD

 

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What were you guys doing with 560's and 660's? there were dozens of them around here that got worked like a stolen mule and never had a problem. Our 660 pulled 22' if deep tillage cultivator with mounted harrows, 30 feet of discer with packers, and 44' of cable-hitch IH rod weeder for years with no problems .

My idea of a shoulda built is a WD14, TD14 engine on a wheel tractor.

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59 minutes ago, R Pope said:

What were you guys doing with 560's and 660's? there were dozens of them around here that got worked like a stolen mule and never had a problem. Our 660 pulled 22' if deep tillage cultivator with mounted harrows, 30 feet of discer with packers, and 44' of cable-hitch IH rod weeder for years with no problems .

My idea of a shoulda built is a WD14, TD14 engine on a wheel tractor.

You have some really light soil.  It took our TD 14A to pull those size of implements on our farm.  Also, the 560/660 problems only occurred during the first year.  After that they should have been fine.

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I would like to see a fully syncro, at least  five speed manual transmission with a TA in any International from the M on up.

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Eston gumbo is definitely not "light soil". Sceptre Clay, some of the heaviest stuff around.

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Nothing but a conversation piece now but what if these would have come out 65 years ago???538996446_M4wd.jpg.5e8a4291c849303a6d1b1da9f0d8c59e.jpgc69504f7262495937fd221f920b4dd7b--farmall-tractors-old-tractors.jpg.6125ee9ee8ab193d75ff0a1384b6a1fc.jpg

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2 hours ago, sandhiller said:

Nothing but a conversation piece now but what if these would have come out 65 years ago???538996446_M4wd.jpg.5e8a4291c849303a6d1b1da9f0d8c59e.jpgc69504f7262495937fd221f920b4dd7b--farmall-tractors-old-tractors.jpg.6125ee9ee8ab193d75ff0a1384b6a1fc.jpg

That articulated WD9 is interesting.  Would like to know more about it.

i was going to add a smaller size articulated tractor for use in deep snow and mud.  I was going to suggest 2 M sized rear ends with TD-14 engine.

It would have been great in the woods (early skidded) or used for spreading manure in the winter, etc.

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On 2/8/2019 at 9:23 PM, TractormanMike.mb said:

I always wondered if a hydro 2+2 would have been practical or reliable

I came real close to finding out once. We had leased a couple of hydro 100s to a large dairy farmer. He replaced them with a 3588. After using it on his chopper. He really wanted a hydro version. The plan was to use hydro 186 and a 3588 split at bell housings and swap. The biggest stumbling block looked to be putting in a reverse idler to drive the front wheels. We had researched parts and it looked doable. The project did not go through because he was going to have to buy the 2+2 instead of lease. The hybred gear drive we were going sell.

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2 hours ago, snoshoe said:

I came real close to finding out once. We had leased a couple of hydro 100s to a large dairy farmer. He replaced them with a 3588. After using it on his chopper. He really wanted a hydro version. The plan was to use hydro 186 and a 3588 split at bell housings and swap. The biggest stumbling block looked to be putting in a reverse idler to drive the front wheels. We had researched parts and it looked doable. The project did not go through because he was going to have to buy the 2+2 instead of lease. The hybred gear drive we were going sell.

That would have been a fun project and I'm surprised that nobody has done it yet. I think that if you used the 3388 as a base it wouldn't overpower the hydro like the two bigger ones would. I think for jobs like pulling a chopper or a potato harvester it would be unbeatable. Maybe someday when I find a money tree I'll break a branch off and build one.

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11 minutes ago, TractormanMike.mb said:

That would have been a fun project and I'm surprised that nobody has done it yet. I think that if you used the 3388 as a base it wouldn't overpower the hydro like the two bigger ones would. I think for jobs like pulling a chopper or a potato harvester it would be unbeatable. Maybe someday when I find a money tree I'll break a branch off and build one.

The idea here was to get the pto power and mudability of the 35 with the speed control of the hydro. We built several chopper tractors here in dairy country from 966 and 986s. We could buy all parts from IH cheaper than an mw kit. Including air cleaner and muffler. For the 966 we used 1066 parts. For the 986 we used 1486 parts. Set either one at 150 hp. Warned owner not to pull any implement the 9 wouldn't pull without turbo. One owner sold his to next door neighbor without warning. Took out differential 2cnd day chiseling. Never heard of another failure. They really appreciated those tractors on the chopper

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8 hours ago, sandhiller said:

c69504f7262495937fd221f920b4dd7b--farmall-tractors-old-tractors.jpg.6125ee9ee8ab193d75ff0a1384b6a1fc.jpg

This was somewhat reality around here.  Both my great uncle and landlord farmed with tandem WD-9s.  They weren't the only ones either.  Not sure but it almost looks like a different engine in that tractor.  Doesn't look like a 4 cylinder.

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8 hours ago, Big Bud guy said:

This was somewhat reality around here.  Both my great uncle and landlord farmed with tandem WD-9s.  They weren't the only ones either.  Not sure but it almost looks like a different engine in that tractor.  Doesn't look like a 4 cylinder.

 A lot of double 820 830s to years ago. A guy in Fargo area had a triple 830 with sound guard cab.

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2 hours ago, dale560 said:

 A lot of double 820 830s to years ago. A guy in Fargo area had a triple 830 with sound guard cab.

That guy is well known in the JD world.  He had this challenge were he tries to farm with nothing but 2 cylinders.  That tractor is not the first one he made but probaby the nicest.  He also had a 720 paired with a D and then an 820 paired with a D.  My opinion is he cheated soon as he started putting tractors together.

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On 2/10/2019 at 5:30 PM, TP from Central PA said:

The thing I didn't like about the Quads is stopping(or you should) between ranges, and the gear steps if you look at it on a chart does not make a ton of sense.  

16 speeds sound good on paper, but close to half of them are borderline useless.......they could just have put A1, B2, C3 and D4 in there and called it a day......

Al

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If he put three 830’s together wouldn’t it be a 6 cylinder? Lol

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10 minutes ago, jass1660 said:

If he put three 830’s together wouldn’t it be a 6 cylinder? Lol

One of the 2 cylinder jokes around here was the 8X0 series was JD's first 6 cylinder tractor.  Catch is only two of them counted. 

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6 hours ago, Super A said:

16 speeds sound good on paper, but close to half of them are borderline useless.......they could just have put A1, B2, C3 and D4 in there and called it a day......

Al

Better add A3, A4, B1, and B3 too.  Those are some of the gears we used.  

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