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How people dont think! I will never understand


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A question for the older guys on here! Has it always been that the people in the working class dont think ahead? or plan? I work at a garbage transfer station as a excavtor operator 7 years now! For those who dont know they dump out the collection trucks and load on a semi to go to a land fill! Now we all heard for days that the cold was coming! Im in charge of the tipping floor i have one helper a excavator wheel loader and a yard truck! So my helper (a good learner) and i made sure everything was tip top shape for cold fuel treatment block heaters working air tanks drained ect! 40 degree wind chill everything fires up and we ran the past two days no problems! Now i do have a manger above me and he figured out quick when he started thier to just leave me alone everything on the tipping floor be taken care of! Now for the drivers and our under 30 years old educated maintenance crew! Well thier lack of experience in preparing for cold weather really showed! Trucks froze up fuel gelled air lines froze trucks not plugged in ect ect the site manager had his hands full trying to get all the monkeys straightened out! I had trouble keeping my mouth shut when are moron high school drop out maintenance manager told me I dont know what its like to work in the cold! I said yea your right! At 32 I will always appreciate growing up on a dairy farm and being taught how to think ahead and how to plan and prepare and have a back up plan on how to get it done! On a slim budget! How can people not think ahead or plan! And at this large company i swear poor thinking is a management qualification! The stupidity of adults blows my minds! My first job off the farm was a small company it was a good crew! When i started in the trash it opened my eyes to how stupid people can really be! 

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I am amazed at how many hired hands who have worked on many farms before you have to explain every morning to make sure that the spreader is not frozen BEFORE they attempt to load it 

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I was a maintenance manager for a large garbage company for a while.  At my company, the driver's were responsible for making sure their trucks were plugged in, air tanks drained yadda, yadda.... drivers don't care.  They might forget to plug the truck in, or forget to drain the tanks.  Wasn't their problem if the truck didn't start.  They just got to sit and drink coffee for a while while they waited for the block heater to work it's magic. (They still got in trouble, but at -10°, who cares right.) Maintenance did everything they could to make sure the trucks stayed on the road, but it was a hand in hand relationship with the driver.... except the driver's didn't care. But I'm not exactly the high school dropout maintenance manager like you talk about either, lol.  To answer your question, or respond to your post as to why the failure to plan: it's not really their problem.  They earn a check either way.  Nobody cares unless it affects their pay.  Oh, sure it would make their day go a lot better if they planned, but most of the driver's I knew at "the company" did well to think past about 4 hours, let alone the next day. 

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1 hour ago, bitty said:

I am amazed at how many hired hands who have worked on many farms before you have to explain every morning to make sure that the spreader is not frozen BEFORE they attempt to load it 

Also don't buy a loaded one at auction  :(

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What you guys are not seeing is that these people are thinking. No not the way you guys think.

Especially the ones getting paid while sit and do nothing waiting for the block heater to work. They are thinking of ways to beat the system, not how to actually get work done. These guys know that if they sit for 4 hours today with pay that the garbage will still be there tomorrow to pick up. It ain't going no where. Might even lead to a little overtime.  They learned that from their parents who learned it from their parents. Starts with little things like dad or om bragging about how they beat the tax man out of a few bucks here and there. The about how "they got over at work". If it's OK for mom and dad?

Now if a company can prove that an employee is deliberately doing or not doing something so they can sit around not doing anything while on the clock it's grounds for dismissal. Called theft of time. Actually a chargeable offense. Most companies never press charges electing simply to fire the employee in question. 

 

Rick

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2 hours ago, oldtanker said:

Most companies never press charges electing simply to fire the employee in question. 

You can't fire bottom rung working class hourly employee's nowadays.  That's a lawsuit! Only people that can be fired are salaried management.  Then you just claim "failure to complete the objectives for which they were hired".  That's all subjective, so they get away with it.  But in a big corporation you have to "coach" the hourlies to "make them better".  Oh, and you better document that too.  Has to go in their file.  And you better hope they are angry white males, or else you'll have another lawsuit on your hand for singling someone out due to ethnicity.

Corporate America sucks men.  It's a terrible place to work. 

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1 minute ago, J-Mech said:

You can't fire bottom rung working class hourly employee's nowadays.  That's a lawsuit! Only people that can be fired are salaried management.  Then you just claim "failure to complete the objectives for which they were hired".  That's all subjective, so they get away with it.  But in a big corporation you have to "coach" the hourlies to "make them better".  Oh, and you better document that too.  Has to go in their file.  And you better hope they are angry white males, or else you'll have another lawsuit on your hand for singling someone out due to ethnicity.

Corporate America sucks men.  It's a terrible place to work. 

When a company can prove theft of any type they can and will fire an employee. I've seen it twice sense I retired from the army. One is a woman (won't call her a lady) we know who was fire at WalMart for breaking stuff so she could sit on her butt. But they had video of that. Another place I worked at right after I retired a worker was sabotaging equipment on the line he worked on cause he'd be on the clock while we fixed it but he could sit for an hour or 2 outside smoking and getting paid. But when we had myself and 2 others witness him tampering and we were will if needed to go to court they fired him. But you are right! Gotta jump through hoops to fire someone.

Rick

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1 minute ago, oldtanker said:

When a company can prove theft of any type they can and will fire an employee. I've seen it twice sense I retired from the army. One is a woman (won't call her a lady) we know who was fire at WalMart for breaking stuff so she could sit on her butt. But they had video of that. Another place I worked at right after I retired a worker was sabotaging equipment on the line he worked on cause he'd be on the clock while we fixed it but he could sit for an hour or 2 outside smoking and getting paid. But when we had myself and 2 others witness him tampering and we were will if needed to go to court they fired him. But you are right! Gotta jump through hoops to fire someone.

Rick

Oh I agree there!  But catching someone stealing on camera is a lot easier thing to prove than it is to prove someone is just lazy and incompetent.  Just saying. 

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33 minutes ago, J-Mech said:

Oh I agree there!  But catching someone stealing on camera is a lot easier thing to prove than it is to prove someone is just lazy and incompetent.  Just saying. 

Very true!

Rick

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14 hours ago, Gleaner k2 said:

A question for the older guys on here! Has it always been that the people in the working class dont think ahead? or plan? I work at a garbage transfer station as a excavtor operator 7 years now! For those who dont know they dump out the collection trucks and load on a semi to go to a land fill! Now we all heard for days that the cold was coming! Im in charge of the tipping floor i have one helper a excavator wheel loader and a yard truck! So my helper (a good learner) and i made sure everything was tip top shape for cold fuel treatment block heaters working air tanks drained ect! 40 degree wind chill everything fires up and we ran the past two days no problems! Now i do have a manger above me and he figured out quick when he started thier to just leave me alone everything on the tipping floor be taken care of! Now for the drivers and our under 30 years old educated maintenance crew! Well thier lack of experience in preparing for cold weather really showed! Trucks froze up fuel gelled air lines froze trucks not plugged in ect ect the site manager had his hands full trying to get all the monkeys straightened out! I had trouble keeping my mouth shut when are moron high school drop out maintenance manager told me I dont know what its like to work in the cold! I said yea your right! At 32 I will always appreciate growing up on a dairy farm and being taught how to think ahead and how to plan and prepare and have a back up plan on how to get it done! On a slim budget! How can people not think ahead or plan! And at this large company i swear poor thinking is a management qualification! The stupidity of adults blows my minds! My first job off the farm was a small company it was a good crew! When i started in the trash it opened my eyes to how stupid people can really be! 

Having a written cold weather job description might help. It’s management responsibility to keep the business going. I would think that they day before that procedure should be put into effect with a managerial review with employees. 

It doesn’t mean these job descriptions are perfectly executed the for the  time but if they need to be rewritten after action report to management ,this did not work needed to change , rewrite ,sign off . 

Last comment I’ve said it before 80% of the problems in your business is management. 

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I'm not sure that a job description would be enough .Probably need a very detailed SOP with various scenarios covered .

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Seems everyone needs their hand held these days. I see it at the tire recycling plant in Des Moines, Iowa all the time. Last fall they put a sign in the window of the door of the main entrance reminding their truck drivers to PLUG IN YOUR TRUCKS. And they have a lot for loaded trailers and a lot for empty tralers. I can't count how many times we've seen their guys grab a empty and leave the lot with some of the wheels sliding cause the brake shoes are froze to the drums. And their shag drivers aren't any better. Just about three weeks ago they ruined two of my tires. It's obvious they just give it more throttle and more obvious, they don't care.

One of my friends says COMMON SENSE WILL NOT BE TOLERATED. Nuff said😱.

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4 hours ago, 560Dennis said:

 

Last comment I’ve said it before 80% of the problems in your business is management. 

While I agree there is some truth to that, it's unbelievable some of the things employees will do.   OSHA, fair labor, IDEM, Workers Comp, Insurance companies and the list goes on and on for oversights and regulations.   Our Safety consultant says there are over 40K OSHA codes!  The amount of energy expelled on the nonsense stuff really bogs down managers who probably could focus attention on doing great things if their hands weren't always tied up!  

 

I'm not complaining but in the last several years I have seen things from the other side. Unfortunately not all employees were brought up on a farm with common sense, and the drive to get things down efficiently and safely.   I've always just wanted to do a good job for whoever I've worked for, but that's not the case for enough of the workforce that OSHA has time to sit around and come up with 40K codes etc because of previous issues...  On multiple occasions just last year I had to ask "they did what?" due to someone doing something really stupid with no thought process to the consequences to not only themselves but to others as well. 

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On ‎1‎/‎31‎/‎2019 at 6:49 PM, bitty said:

I am amazed at how many hired hands who have worked on many farms before you have to explain every morning to make sure that the spreader is not frozen BEFORE they attempt to load it 

I bet if you made them unload it by hand once they would remember next time.

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3 hours ago, 1967806 said:

I bet if you made them unload it by hand once they would remember next time.

At 865 bushels I doubt any of them will stick around to see it get empty. I have been fortunate enough to catch them in time before a disater gets made by not thinking

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Unfortunately both sides are to blame. One of my pet pieves is how long it takes to get anything done anymore. Phone x office, they’re not in or out on hold 45 minutes. They will check in and get back to you. 2 weeks later never happens. No accountability anymore. My first construction job was a small company. If you didn’t work out you were fired, bottom line. If you didn’t plug the truck in you got your butt chewed out. If you were late you were docked and chewed out. Honestly I respected the man and did a good job and tried to be accountable and we never had an issue. I still talk to the guy today. Now where I work one guy can sit on his butt all day and get absolutely no grief while guys like me are given all the work to do. Boss’s don’t want to rock the boat. I put my head down and do it and guess what.... we all make the same money. But now I’m trailing off into different issues. Bottom line, I have a good work ethic and enjoy what I do. The management knows I’m good at it and once in a while I am rewarded for it. Mainly I get satisfaction from being good at what I do. I think everyone should be held more accountable for there actions than now. My .02

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On 1/31/2019 at 6:04 PM, Gleaner k2 said:

A question for the older guys on here! Has it always been that the people in the working class dont think ahead? or plan? I work at a garbage transfer station as a excavtor operator 7 years now! For those who dont know they dump out the collection trucks and load on a semi to go to a land fill! Now we all heard for days that the cold was coming! Im in charge of the tipping floor i have one helper a excavator wheel loader and a yard truck! So my helper (a good learner) and i made sure everything was tip top shape for cold fuel treatment block heaters working air tanks drained ect! 40 degree wind chill everything fires up and we ran the past two days no problems! Now i do have a manger above me and he figured out quick when he started thier to just leave me alone everything on the tipping floor be taken care of! Now for the drivers and our under 30 years old educated maintenance crew! Well thier lack of experience in preparing for cold weather really showed! Trucks froze up fuel gelled air lines froze trucks not plugged in ect ect the site manager had his hands full trying to get all the monkeys straightened out! I had trouble keeping my mouth shut when are moron high school drop out maintenance manager told me I dont know what its like to work in the cold! I said yea your right! At 32 I will always appreciate growing up on a dairy farm and being taught how to think ahead and how to plan and prepare and have a back up plan on how to get it done! On a slim budget! How can people not think ahead or plan! And at this large company i swear poor thinking is a management qualification! The stupidity of adults blows my minds! My first job off the farm was a small company it was a good crew! When i started in the trash it opened my eyes to how stupid people can really be! 

Your like I was in construction. It pi$$ed me off when the boss would try to micro manage me or my jobs. I always told him to give me the address and a bid sheet and plans and I’ll call you if I have a question. I’ll give you 2 weeks notice when we’re wrapping up the job so he can plan the next one accordingly. He learned to leave me alone and I’ll make him money. 

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Went to the Farm show in Des Moines last week, lost count of all the jelled up semis sitting along I35 and several putn along at 10 to 20 mph. Guess they didn't get the memo......

Best one was the tracks of semi sliding trailer tires on left rear from truck stop at Ellsworth onto I35. We laughed, wonder how far till we catch up to it......think it was 3 miles. He was pulled over and tires shredded on bottom. He should have jus kept going. I think there was enough rim left to make it to Ames....lol

Dumb, dumb dumb,  now he sat with Dot sitn behind him.  He prolly didn't want to do his walk around after the night at truck stop cause it was cold out. 

Sure would have been nicer to get brake unstuck in parking lot!

 

 

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On 2/1/2019 at 8:01 AM, J-Mech said:

Corporate America sucks men.  It's a terrible place to work. 

This is, or in my case, was,  so true.

Read Dilbert, as the old adage goes, there is lots of truth in humor.

And, from my personal experience, I saw how a company that had been managed by people who had started their careers by working in the field, became a company that has many, many tiers of 'management' (and the titles to go with them), with most of these people having almost no time working at the level of those they are managing,, and the resulting contempt for those that actually generate the revenue.

And this seems to have resulted in a 100 year old company that is basically riding on its name and past reputation, with dozens of other companies (many of whom were trained and gained their experience from the Flying H) now offering the same service, at a lower price.  Perhaps they cannot compete on the high-tech, very specialized types of jobs that a major company can, but those types of jobs are few and far between.

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The  opposite problem also starts to arise when you have to micromanage your less able staff so they do the job correctly the more able and motivated staff get pi$$€d off at  the Management  holding their hands and decide to do less.

But what can you do? Unless it hurts people in the pocket they will not take responsibility for their actions or lack of actions.

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On 1/31/2019 at 6:40 PM, 1480x3 said:

Also don't buy a loaded one at auction  :(

Sounds as if there could be one of life's lesson's you would like to share with us???? Please proceed or should we use our imagination?

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That spreader cost me 100 bucks a load to own, but I only owned it for 2 loads at least. It went to scrapper, but I do still have 4 decent 10x20 8 lug wheels that still have good air after 15 yrs. forgot about them , maybe ok deal after all       :D

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On ‎1‎/‎31‎/‎2019 at 6:49 PM, bitty said:

I am amazed at how many hired hands who have worked on many farms before you have to explain every morning to make sure that the spreader is not frozen BEFORE they attempt to load it 

I WAS TAUGHT THAT WHEN I WAS 12 YEARS OLD. CLIMBED INSIDE AND BREAK THE FLIGHTS LOSE.

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