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Around here it's the dang solar farms. A lot of Mercury in the panels. We haven't had a large hailstorm since they installed them. 

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Had a view of the hills in the distance was no man made structures in that view it was nice.

But then they put several wind mills on the ridge spoiled the view.

Do we relay want to look out over the horizon and see these things in every direction? I think not.   

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19 minutes ago, ohio farmer said:

Live in an area with about 250 towers. 3 or 4 different wind companies that built on farms very close together, looks like one big farm.

we have 5 on our farm that we farm under, and we live right in the middle of all the towers.

Have to say that they don’t bother us at all.

The talk about killing birds is all bs. Farm right up around the 5 on our farm and I do not see dead birds on the ground around the towers. Also never saw eagles in our neighborhood before the towers but see them all the time lately.

a proposed wind farm that would have been built in south half of our county, was shot down by neighborhood that was very against it.

US and world population continues to grow and that means more demand for energy, electricity. I don’t think mining more coal to meet the demand is the answer. Need other options. No body wants nuclear, so we only have a few options left. Wind is one.

The towers in our neighborhood cost 4.5 million each. They are 3 megawatts and we were told they would each provide power for about 300 homes annually. Average electric bill per home, I guess around $200 per month or$2400. Per year x 300 homes = $720000 gross revenue per year.

Towers are supposed to have 20- 25 year life out of generator and equipment.  $720000 x 20 years =

$ 14,400,000.00

looks to me like they pay for themselves in less than 10 years.

Ive heard all the arguments against them, most dont hold water. The most honest reason that people protest against them, is they just don’t want them in their neighborhood, don’t like the looks of them.

Use travel up 127 to US 30 over to Ft Wayne seen all the towers up there looked like they farmed right up to them. When I stopped once and turn engine off they didn't seen to loud to me {have lost some hearing over the years} LOL.

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21 hours ago, BOBSIH856 said:

I thought the super duper Tesla battery array was supposed to cure the rolling blackouts?

Remember that quote "Inebriated with the exuberance of his own verbosity"?

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That battery in the Australian power scene.

About when it was installed the biggest power user (an aluminium smelter) pointed out that all the then battery back-up would run their plant for about 8 minutes.

With a current vote buying extra about 2 bill or so on household batteries that is up to about 15 minutes - if that happens.

"

Amid hundreds of graphs, charts and tables in the latest World Energy Outlook (WEO) released last week by the International Energy Agency, there is one fundamental piece of information that you have to work out for yourself: the percentage of total global primary energy demand provided by wind and solar. The answer is 1.1 per cent. The policy mountains have laboured and brought forth not just a mouse, but — as the report reluctantly acknowledges — an enormously disruptive mouse.

 

The International Energy Agency (IEA) has in recent years become an increasingly schizophrenic organization. As both a source of energy information and a shill for the UN’s climate-focused sustainable development agenda, it has to talk up the “transition to a low-carbon future” while simultaneously reporting that it’s not happening. But it will!"  (My bold)

Link at http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/index.php/2018/11/22/we-dont-need-no-stinking-giant-fans-9/

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11 hours ago, ohio farmer said:

Live in an area with about 250 towers. 3 or 4 different wind companies that built on farms very close together, looks like one big farm.

we have 5 on our farm that we farm under, and we live right in the middle of all the towers.

Have to say that they don’t bother us at all.

The talk about killing birds is all bs. Farm right up around the 5 on our farm and I do not see dead birds on the ground around the towers. Also never saw eagles in our neighborhood before the towers but see them all the time lately.

a proposed wind farm that would have been built in south half of our county, was shot down by neighborhood that was very against it.

US and world population continues to grow and that means more demand for energy, electricity. I don’t think mining more coal to meet the demand is the answer. Need other options. No body wants nuclear, so we only have a few options left. Wind is one.

The towers in our neighborhood cost 4.5 million each. They are 3 megawatts and we were told they would each provide power for about 300 homes annually. Average electric bill per home, I guess around $200 per month or$2400. Per year x 300 homes = $720000 gross revenue per year.

Towers are supposed to have 20- 25 year life out of generator and equipment.  $720000 x 20 years =

$ 14,400,000.00

looks to me like they pay for themselves in less than 10 years.

Ive heard all the arguments against them, most dont hold water. The most honest reason that people protest against them, is they just don’t want them in their neighborhood, don’t like the looks of them.

you have a few mistakes in your figuring in how they pay for their self.  First there is a lot of other cost in getting the power to a home that you didn't figure in to the pay back back. Like substations, transmission lines, and right aways for those. There has to be some form of back up power when the wind is not blowing. Then you have labor cost ( which is a large share of you light bill) then add  billing cost and maintenance cost on the substations and transmission  lines. (repair trucks are not free) Now you have to figure in a percent of write off of un paid bills due to low income or just non payers. Also you didn't add any maintenance cost on the windmill, or payments to landowner for kilowatts of electricity produced.. I can go on with more cost you didn't figure. When you figure everything in NO WAY do they pay for their self in their life time. The government subsidy paid to the wind farm is the only way they pay out to the investors. If the wind farms didn't get the subsidy your light bill would be a lot more than it is. Your paying a lot more than you thing for lights than you think with your taxes. (government subsidy to wind farm )

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20 hours ago, bitty said:

It's a pretty hefty subsidy, it was one million per windmill for the one bunch of them here 

I don't know what the subsidy is per windmill but it has to be a large amount. If you figure what the kilowatts of electricity they produce sells for, Then add in the cost to build them and maintenance cost along with other cost. They don't pay for their self. 

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I just can't imagine all these companies investing billions of dollars into this project and not making a profit ! Would the investors stand for it? I think not ! I see hundreds of these coming into the Port Terminal in Duluth every year by ship from over seas ! We have none in our area yet and when we travel and see some we marvel at them! Whether it's wind generators, high voltage lines, pipe lines or what else, everyone says NOT IN MY BACK YARD ! Yet they all want more power, cleaner air and water at the lowest possible cost. We have the same issues here but it's mining copper, nickel, gold, platinum and who knows what else. If we all want these things we have to put up with some changes.

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The companies are into green because our dear Gov is pouring money into it like sand into a rat hole. A local construction company was going to build a new shop to work on their equipment. I asked one of the owners about the solar panels being installed on the roof. He said they would not be putting them on if it weren't for all the government incentives.

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Question. What is everyone's take on Solar Farms? With them there's no farming around them like there is with wind turbines. 

Someone is supposedly putting one in on the outskirts of the town im near me right along I-94. They have cleared some scrub ground and are going to use some ground that was originally slated for a modular home park that went bust about 16 or 17 years ago. There is one field that they are taking that had been hay until this year then someone planted corn on it. Corn didn't look to hot. 

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3 hours ago, augercreek said:

I just can't imagine all these companies investing billions of dollars into this project and not making a profit ! Would the investors stand for it? I think not ! I see hundreds of these coming into the Port Terminal in Duluth every year by ship from over seas ! We have none in our area yet and when we travel and see some we marvel at them! Whether it's wind generators, high voltage lines, pipe lines or what else, everyone says NOT IN MY BACK YARD ! Yet they all want more power, cleaner air and water at the lowest possible cost. We have the same issues here but it's mining copper, nickel, gold, platinum and who knows what else. If we all want these things we have to put up with some changes.

The reason companies get into wind farms is because of Goverment subsidy and Tax breaks.  With out those they would not be built.  Compare US electric rates to other countries electric rates. We have cheap rates. But that will change when the tax breaks and subsidies stop. 

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15 hours ago, ohio farmer said:

Live in an area with about 250 towers. 3 or 4 different wind companies that built on farms very close together, looks like one big farm.

we have 5 on our farm that we farm under, and we live right in the middle of all the towers.

Have to say that they don’t bother us at all.

The talk about killing birds is all bs. Farm right up around the 5 on our farm and I do not see dead birds on the ground around the towers. Also never saw eagles in our neighborhood before the towers but see them all the time lately.

a proposed wind farm that would have been built in south half of our county, was shot down by neighborhood that was very against it.

US and world population continues to grow and that means more demand for energy, electricity. I don’t think mining more coal to meet the demand is the answer. Need other options. No body wants nuclear, so we only have a few options left. Wind is one.

The towers in our neighborhood cost 4.5 million each. They are 3 megawatts and we were told they would each provide power for about 300 homes annually. Average electric bill per home, I guess around $200 per month or$2400. Per year x 300 homes = $720000 gross revenue per year.

Towers are supposed to have 20- 25 year life out of generator and equipment.  $720000 x 20 years =

$ 14,400,000.00

looks to me like they pay for themselves in less than 10 years.

Ive heard all the arguments against them, most dont hold water. The most honest reason that people protest against them, is they just don’t want them in their neighborhood, don’t like the looks of them.

Good post, most who are agains wind powert have a political agenda and don't know the facts about wind power.As far as subside Big oil started receive a subsidies in 1916 and and still gets them today. Coal, solar and wind power receive a subsidy but its a fraction of what big oil gets.

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4 hours ago, Reichow7120 said:

Question. What is everyone's take on Solar Farms? With them there's no farming around them like there is with wind turbines. 

Someone is supposedly putting one in on the outskirts of the town im near me right along I-94. They have cleared some scrub ground and are going to use some ground that was originally slated for a modular home park that went bust about 16 or 17 years ago. There is one field that they are taking that had been hay until this year then someone planted corn on it. Corn didn't look to hot. 

I think solar is the way for alternative energy.

If solar is on every roof that is pointed in the right direction that off sets its energy use.

I believe the carbon foot print is less for manufacturing and upkeep on solar.

Do not want to see forest cut down to put up solar farms but I think there are plenty of areas to set them up with out doing that. 

Some Urban renewal projects could get some of that government money for solar and kill two birds with one stone.

 Knock down a crack house and put in a solar array     

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3C3EEE9D-BEF1-4DE8-A904-22720D0E23DE.jpeg.30538847d5c750f7098df8e63585a695.jpeg

Those darn things are causing problems at the North Pole also .

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5 hours ago, supermpuller said:

Good post, most who are agains wind powert have a political agenda and don't know the facts about wind power.As far as subside Big oil started receive a subsidies in 1916 and and still gets them today. Coal, solar and wind power receive a subsidy but its a fraction of what big oil gets.

They have a windmill at the in-laws hunting cabin. My wife's uncle who was one of the founding members of the club said after seeing them in use that he was very confident that they only made $ because of the million subsidy per tower. If it was just wind and solar panels powering up an area there would be a lot of power outages and brownouts. Without a generate on demand type backup (coal/natural gas/etc)  to fill in when the others are sitting idle it would be 100% usesless to power a city and or businesses. 

Another way they are paying for the "green" energy is through the box you can check on your electric bill. This shuffles the money towards this type of energy . I am fairly certain that in certain areas a bunch of people check the box

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2 hours ago, jeeper61 said:

I think solar is the way for alternative energy.

If solar is on every roof that is pointed in the right direction that off sets its energy use.

I believe the carbon foot print is less for manufacturing and upkeep on solar.

Do not want to see forest cut down to put up solar farms but I think there are plenty of areas to set them up with out doing that. 

Some Urban renewal projects could get some of that government money for solar and kill two birds with one stone.

 Knock down a crack house and put in a solar array     

My house is solar I believe solar, all alternative energy really works on small scale such as a remote house or cabin where a battery can store a couple days needs. But no battery can run electric heat...

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21 hours ago, supermpuller said:

Good post, most who are agains wind powert have a political agenda and don't know the facts about wind power.As far as subside Big oil started receive a subsidies in 1916 and and still gets them today. Coal, solar and wind power receive a subsidy but its a fraction of what big oil gets.

I'm not against wind power. and yes I know a lot about them. I did A lot of research before I signed the contract on the towers going up on my farm. and doing more research before the next ones go up. They no way will ever pencil out with out the government subsidy and tax breaks. They are not a reliable source of power To many days they don't produce electricity. The ones on my farm do not turn many days so the do not produce. ( I know what they produce as I get some of my payment off what they produce) So we still have to have other reliable source of power. So nothing has been gained from having wind farms. 

We have to stop subsidy all these types of projects. Just because other types of power gets subsidy does not mean we have to give wind farms them. That sounds like little kids taking (john did it so I get to do it) The subsidy game has to stop some place. 

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20 hours ago, jeeper61 said:

I think solar is the way for alternative energy.

If solar is on every roof that is pointed in the right direction that off sets its energy use.

I believe the carbon foot print is less for manufacturing and upkeep on solar.

Do not want to see forest cut down to put up solar farms but I think there are plenty of areas to set them up with out doing that. 

Some Urban renewal projects could get some of that government money for solar and kill two birds with one stone.

 Knock down a crack house and put in a solar array     

Only thing I have to say about solar power.  NIGHT TIME  You know, that part of the day, about 12 hours this time of year when it is DARK. Do you solar guys ever turn on a light at night? Or use hot water? Or power any part of your heat source? Grid tied solar can reduce demand during peak day light hours but does nothing after the sun goes down. Oil, coal, gas, nuclear plants can not be easily turned on and off. It takes time to build up steam. So, they have to be sized to carry all the load, all the time.  At best, solar delays the building of needed power plants and ultimately jeopardizes the whole power supply plan. The missing part is electricity storage. No one is talking about batteries that can run the grid for 12 hours while recharging in another 12.  Small scale on a house to house basis with a purpose built off grid system can work with a few trade offs in lifestyle, but solar for the main grid as we know it, NOT.

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We had a big push to sign up about 2012 , but declined , the neighbor signed but I don’t remember to much about it. I did send my brother to visit some wind farms. He said they are noisemakers. 

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On 11/24/2018 at 7:24 PM, ohio farmer said:

The talk about killing birds is all bs. Farm right up around the 5 on our farm and I do not see dead birds on the ground around the towers. Also never saw eagles in our neighborhood before the towers but see them all the time lately.

 

Wind turbines kill hundreds of thousands of bird in the US alone. Wind energy producers have been given a 30 permit to take eagles via incidental collisions. EPA and Industry Analysts put the number of eagles killed per year in the US between 300-500. Overall the EPA estimates between 150,000 to 300,000 birds die a year in the US via wind turbine strike. They hit cars too, just pointing out that they do kill a LOT of birds including birds that neither you nor I would be pardoned for. Kind of like dams, there's really no free lunch. I'm more put off by the carbon fiber that many use in their blades as much as anything else.

I think in the desert solar makes sense. On the plains wind may make sense. If you have coal, that makes sense, gas... well you get the idea. And while all the green folk shout for an end to coal, they double down on phones, tablets, online cloud servers (that just happen to be computers that are located elsewhere) and all the energy to power them. Oh don't forget about electric cars and electric semi. Rather than reducing consumption they want to use more power. Conflicting goals if you ask me. I think slowing our pace down would do more to ease up on the environment than anything else and probably have the largest increase in personal health we could hope for.

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