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mader656

Well question?

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So I share access to a well it's 1400 feet away from where I need it on the neighbors place...but I have permission to drive down And fill a tank as needed, but it only pumps about 50 gallon before it runs dry....have been told by a couple sources well would pump 25 gpm for hours and not run out. Pump is good as i can run water back down,well head and runs forever...

Well is about 60 feet deep in a lower valley with a seasonal creek in it...ran till about a week ago, water table is high...

It took over a hour to fill a 265 gallon tank.

If I neck the pump down to quarter inch it would flow continuously I think....

The well sat with no use for about 4 years could it have sealed itself or something? Till this spring summer and I've pulled 350 gallon of is all....

Fixes?

 

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Lots of questions -

Turbine or submersible pump?

Well & screen diameter?

Screen length, type, and slot size if wire wound?

Static water level?

General water quality (hardness, iron, manganese, ect) if known?

Turbidity?  Is the water clear at startup or cloudy then clearing up w/ discharge?

Last pump pull and screen rehab?

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Might be plugging with crap. Rust TDS or just worn out. Measure how many minutes to fill a 5 gal can. I would think there is plenty of water down there

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1 hour ago, Atilathehun99 said:

Lots of questions -

Turbine or submersible pump?

Well & screen diameter?

Screen length, type, and slot size if wire wound?

Static water level?

General water quality (hardness, iron, manganese, ect) if known?

Turbidity?  Is the water clear at startup or cloudy then clearing up w/ discharge?

Last pump pull and screen rehab?

Submersible pump

Well caseing is 8 inch

The inlet for water is a band around the pump, around 2 inches in widths eighth in holes,.

Guess static to be 15 to 20 feet

Planning a test once i get well pumped out a while...

Initial water was rusty clear now even on startup

I pulled the pump screens on pump look clean...

My wondering is if the water just can't get into the well fast enough. If I cycle the water back in top it runs forever....

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1 hour ago, edwardporter1 said:

Might be plugging with crap. Rust TDS or just worn out. Measure how many minutes to fill a 5 gal can. I would think there is plenty of water down there

Fast till casing is pumped out.

After initial drawdown more than 5 minutes.

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1 hour ago, mader656 said:

Submersible pump

Well caseing is 8 inch

The inlet for water is a band around the pump, around 2 inches in widths eighth in holes,.

Guess static to be 15 to 20 feet

Planning a test once i get well pumped out a while...

Initial water was rusty clear now even on startup

I pulled the pump screens on pump look clean...

My wondering is if the water just can't get into the well fast enough. If I cycle the water back in top it runs forever....

First of all I understand it's not your well and as such may not know everything about it.  I don't know how things in Montana work but if it is like here there should be a well boring/installation log that should show a Specific Capacity when the well was installed.  From that it would be easy now to record drawdown versus pump discharge (current specific capacity).  If this shows a significant reduction from installation the problem is almost certainly screen plugging or reduction in hydraulic conductivity in the area just outside of the well screen.  The log will also indicate whether it was installed w/ a filter pack or natural pack.  It's more a roll of the dice to properly develop a well relying on natural pack as opposed to a designed filter pack.

At work we have a 12-inch pumping at similar rates that exhibits similar problems.  What we find is screen plugging due to the accumulation of bio-films that require rehabilitation including surging, acid and shock chlorine treatment.  In general low pumping frequencies and rates does not suggest that mineral incrustation of the well screen is the problem.  High  pumping w/ its associated increase in entrance velocities through the screen do create conditions where certain water qualities do promote incrustation. 

The screen you describe (I think) sounds like perhaps torch cut, milled, or bridge screens.  In general these are less able to be tailored to characteristics of the specific aquifer.  They yield limited number of large openings to the pump.  In those instances it doesn't take much plugging issues to significantly reduce the amount of water available to the pump.

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I bought a property here in Wyoming ajacent to my ranch. Had a well on it. Undeveloped .noone knew about it. Had driller blow it out with his big compressor. Cleaned it out determined 2 gpm but great clean potable water. I got a solar pump on it that has given me no troubles. Trying to sell the property but idiot realtor doesnt seem to mention well and power one pole away. Good water is gold here. You might try blowing the well out to free up the crap againest the screens. I will pose the question on monday to my driller when he comes back to fix my well $$$

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34 minutes ago, edwardporter1 said:

I bought a property here in Wyoming ajacent to my ranch. Had a well on it. Undeveloped .noone knew about it. Had driller blow it out with his big compressor. Cleaned it out determined 2 gpm but great clean potable water. I got a solar pump on it that has given me no troubles. Trying to sell the property but idiot realtor doesnt seem to mention well and power one pole away. Good water is gold here. You might try blowing the well out to free up the crap againest the screens. I will pose the question on monday to my driller when he comes back to fix my well $$$

As an aside when I was in Wyoming a couple months ago I and stopped at a ranch about 15 miles south of Ten Sleep and was bull shittin w/ the rancher.  The topic of water came up and he said their well tested at about 3,500 gpm and roughly 100 psi.  I WAS TOTALLY AMAZED!  We have some super wells but the best of them are only doing about 1,500 gpm.

His wife then mentioned to him that he needed to check out the pressure regulator that it must be out of whack because their shower was almost taking her skin off 😄

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2 hours ago, mader656 said:

 

I pulled the pump screens on pump look clean...

My wondering is if the water just can't get into the well fast enough. If I cycle the water back in top it runs forever....

Screens on the pump are different than the well screen.  The pump can be clear but not the well screen.

Good recycling through the pump definitively shows it's a well/screen problem.

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22 minutes ago, Atilathehun99 said:

As an aside when I was in Wyoming a couple months ago I and stopped at a ranch about 15 miles south of Ten Sleep and was bull shittin w/ the rancher.  The topic of water came up and he said their well tested at about 3,500 gpm and roughly 100 psi.  I WAS TOTALLY AMAZED!  We have some super wells but the best of them are only doing about 1,500 gpm.

His wife then mentioned to him that he needed to check out the pressure regulator that it must be out of whack because their shower was almost taking her skin off 😄

Lot of good water in the Ten Sleep formations but it get real dry 10 miles west. My neighbor has a well below us 800gpm. My well at barn 10gpm

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Couple thoughts:

How far down is the pump?  Can it be set lower without getting it too close to the bottom.  Can you pull the pump measure hose and send a weight on a string down to get actual depth vs pump depth?  

Is it possible this is just a low flowing well?  

What about getting a poly tank with a float that could be trickle filled?  This would be ok for non potable water.  You would need some sort of clorination to keep algae out.

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1 hour ago, Atilathehun99 said:

Screens on the pump are different than the well screen.  The pump can be clear but not the well screen.

Good recycling through the pump definitively shows it's a well/screen problem.

So hire a pro at this point?

Or anyway to do it your self.

 

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Rent a compressor. Pull pump shove hose down but it might screw thingd up and it idn't  yours and you might get thirsty.  Consult a socalled expert or leave it alone

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8 hours ago, mader656 said:

So hire a pro at this point?

Or anyway to do it your self.

 

On a well that large it's kind of difficult to do too much of benefit on one's own.  What's really needed is a service rig that can surge and swab.  Plus guys that know the area and do this work daily.

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Thanks for the help going to,attempt to get records and go talk to neighbors co-user of well

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Have a shallow well for the yard drilled in 1980 with a re-drill permit from a old steel casing well is 6 inch PVC casing with perforated but very shallow only 25 ft deep. A few years ago it didn't want to pump much so i pulled the jet and hoses and took my 243 with a few 100 grain hollow point bullets and "shot" the well as they call it. I wore ear plugs and goggles and yes the gun was dirty when done but it did a LOT of good and no troubles since 

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5 hours ago, hagan said:

Have a shallow well for the yard drilled in 1980 with a re-drill permit from a old steel casing well is 6 inch PVC casing with perforated but very shallow only 25 ft deep. A few years ago it didn't want to pump much so i pulled the jet and hoses and took my 243 with a few 100 grain hollow point bullets and "shot" the well as they call it. I wore ear plugs and goggles and yes the gun was dirty when done but it did a LOT of good and no troubles since 

Now that should of been on video. 

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On 8/12/2018 at 2:10 AM, Atilathehun99 said:

s wife then mentioned to him that he needed to check out the pressure regulator that it must be out of whack because their shower was almost taking her skin off 😄

I take it he was not too familiar with the shower 😂😂

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On 8/12/2018 at 2:28 PM, Missouri Mule said:

Now that should of been on video. 

You know... come to think of it runner could probably help you out there. 

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If you have a well 25-35 feet deep Drop a couple of crawdads in well they will keep stream open.

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I have heard tell of pulling the pump and dumping 50 lbs of dry ice down it. Seems the turbulence of that stuff hitting the water boils out sediment from the cracks and passages and opens things up, might work, might not but it wouldn’t cost a lot to try. 

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