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IH 435/445 Balers

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What are the general pros/cons for the IH model 435/445 balers with #10 thrower? What is a fair price for one of these balers if in good condition?

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Didn't the 445 have the deering knotters, that would be a big plus over the mccormick knotters.

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The 435 and 445 I believe were made until 1988. Not sure of the change date but later ones had Deering knotters and earlier ones had the "All Twine" knotters. The old McCormick and All Twine cut one string and rely on the force of the bale moving through the chamber to pull the knot off the billhook. The Deering style has a stripper to pull the knot off , That one difference alone made me feel why the IH balers would often poorly tie. The knot was OK except that the "bows" in the IH knot would get torn or pulled out coming off the hook.Then the bale exploded on its way out the throwerūüė¨. Too bad really as they can choke back some hay, my 46 ¬†always did best when the windrow was as wide as the pickup. ¬†The #10 and #15 throwers imo are great, adjust them a bit to tight and they will launch a bale out of the county! I've seen them fetch up to $2000.00 but only for ones in very well maintained shape. 750 to 1000 is pretty typical.

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The change to Deering knotters must've come after end of production. We had one of the last 435's made and it still had the All Twine knotter.

 

Only the 425 model and its predecessors had the Deering knotter. 

The only balers I would own in the future are New Holland, or Deere. 

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15 hours ago, Matt Kirsch said:

The only balers I would own in the future are New Holland, or Deere. 

Used to say the same thing, until I had to stack acouple wagons behind a 336........................They make nice bales, but compared to a NH they are ungodly slow.  I think we could have spit them out the back as fast with our old Super 77 NH.   Always wanted to try an inline..................Neighbor got one, same thing, makes awesome bales............in low gear.

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Still faster than stopping every six bales to throw half of them back off the wagon because the %$#@ baler wouldn't tie.

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have a alltwine 430 been in family since new   put thousands of bales with it  keep it adjusted and serviced are a good baler   makes nice tight bales   will miss first bale every time then maybe 1 in 1500  most problem is groove wore in breastplate witch ih used to sell wear plates to repair

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6 hours ago, Matt Kirsch said:

Still faster than stopping every six bales to throw half of them back off the wagon because the %$#@ baler wouldn't tie.

Didn't have that issue with a NH.............A well adjusted NH will make nice bales, although we just unloaded 600+ I bought out of the field made by a 570 NH, and those bales were horrible, not sure who was working on that, but they better re-think their career choice.  

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7 hours ago, Matt Kirsch said:

Still faster than stopping every six bales to throw half of them back off the wagon because the %$#@ baler wouldn't tie.

We've never had that type of trouble with our NH 311 and that baler has been on the farm damn near as long as I have. 

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10 hours ago, Reichow7120 said:

We've never had that type of trouble with our NH 311 and that baler has been on the farm damn near as long as I have. 

311 was IMO, was one of the best, if not the best small square ever built...................They got the plunger strokes matched to the component parts so everything held together well, and all that allowed it decent capacity.

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The only thing I like a Deere small baler over a New Holland is the current bale thrower system. I'd rather have a platform thrower than a belt thrower. Our 311 has a 75 platform thrower which is basically a John Deere thrower in New Holland colors. 

Learned one thing about them throwers this past year. New Holland doesn't carry parts for the 75 thrower anymore. However a Deere thrower of the same vintage is the same so parts are interchangeable. 

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12 hours ago, TP from Central PA said:

Didn't have that issue with a NH.............A well adjusted NH will make nice bales, although we just unloaded 600+ I bought out of the field made by a 570 NH, and those bales were horrible, not sure who was working on that, but they better re-think their career choice.  

Exactly. That's why NH is my first choice in small square balers.

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13 minutes ago, Matt Kirsch said:

Exactly. That's why NH is my first choice in small square balers.

Was there something lost in translation here? We thought you had problems with New Holland. Now I think you are talking about old IH balers. Am I correct? 

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I have a 46 IH I’d love to get tying properly. Other than that it works great will make nice shaped bales eats decent sized windrows. I’ve messed with it had other people adjust same thing. Borrowed neighbor New Holland mid 70’s vintage it never missed a bale but it was slow and the bales were not as nice 

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4 hours ago, Reichow7120 said:

Was there something lost in translation here? We thought you had problems with New Holland. Now I think you are talking about old IH balers. Am I correct? 

Apparently so. I was alluding to the fact that waiting for a Deere 336 to spit out a whole bale is more productive than having to throw half the bales that come out of an IH baler off the wagon because they're not tied.

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8 minutes ago, Matt Kirsch said:

Apparently so. I was alluding to the fact that waiting for a Deere 336 to spit out a whole bale is more productive than having to throw half the bales that come out of an IH baler off the wagon because they're not tied.

It's not a pleasant job,  but official bale checker/twine tier person who sits on the twine box eating dust and chaff on bad knotter days gets you up to about 99+% good tied bales.   When I loaded racks I always checked all the knots on the bales in the chute even on NH balers  Now if the girl driving the tractor on the baler was in a bikini we'd probably miss a couple bales every load with an IH baler.

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Pan kicker......they made most of the best TIG welders in the valley keeping the pans from cracking up.  I have no issues with a belt thrower.

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20 minutes ago, TP from Central PA said:

Pan kicker......they made most of the best TIG welders in the valley keeping the pans from cracking up.  I have no issues with a belt thrower.

After Dad and Grandpa's dealings with a belt thrower on the baler before, Dad wouldn't take one if you paid him. Plus we've never had to weld on our thrower yet and it's 30 years old. 

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Kickers I think are which of 2 evils you prefer we’ve had both now we use Kuhn’s accumulators which still isn’t a Swiss Army knife but works for us

1. ¬†pan kicker hard on bale chamber had two¬†Deere‚Äôs crack and welded back light bales much easier on than old timers 60+ pounders. ¬†¬†belt thrower¬†needs fed fairly fast to keep from burning strings off ¬†(unfortunately had issues there also don‚Äôt use plastic stringūüė°)¬†

2. Pan kicker under pressure dangerous to work on have done it when in a hurry not best practice   Belt has belts to keep maintained not hard just wear item 

3. BOTH make a mess of bale not tied or sloppy

4. I think belt takes more power to run especially when bale goes through where pan pump is constantly pumping and pan is loaded when bale trips 

basically like everything else there is good and bad in each no matter what brand/color you prefer  

 

 

 

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Were the 435-445 balers made by New Idea after IH sold the hay equipment to them? CaseIH parts site shows 2 different knotters and manufactured to 1988.

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2 hours ago, Reichow7120 said:

After Dad and Grandpa's dealings with a belt thrower on the baler before, Dad wouldn't take one if you paid him. Plus we've never had to weld on our thrower yet and it's 30 years old. 

Must be on fairly flat land then.

Only people I ever watched burn twine off were people who didn't understand how to rake and or feed the baler.  

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On 7/16/2018 at 4:30 PM, hippy5488 said:

have a alltwine 430 been in family since new   put thousands of bales with it  keep it adjusted and serviced are a good baler   makes nice tight bales   will miss first bale every time then maybe 1 in 1500  most problem is groove wore in breastplate witch ih used to sell wear plates to repair

We put those in dads 2 owner 440 and it tied as well as any baler. . A copy of ih twine knotter hand book is a good investment. The problem is most people adj what doesn’t need adjusting. I think of knotter s as  almost like a carburetor everyone is an expert but few actually know how they work. I think most of the difference between a old 46 and early 430 is swinging twine knife vs stationary. The friend that bought dads 440 new baled a lot with it and we made a few but it has sat now for 15 years in the shed.

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