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Duey_C

Type A fuel system with UD-16 care and feeding notions.

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That is pretty resourceful!  I would never have thought of that, but I guess it would work.

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I like that conversion Mike! That's fantastic! An adjusto/timing bolt and a grease Zerk. I bet it works like a charm. A delight? Oh yes! Thank you! Hahaha!

Similar to an old Honda car distributor (running backwards/anti-clockwise) I first had on a model T engine in the 90's! Loosen the bolt with the washer welded on top, on a piece of pipe and a bent strap to hold the dizzy, retard the spark, start it, re-loosen and adjust the timing. Making do. : - )

A buddy comes out once in awhile and comments that my place is like a museum but says most of it starts and runs! : - ) Yep. More to come back and running here.

"had actually lost that first flush of youth"   Hahaha! Me too! Worn out but still going. Goll I laughed at your post! Made my day. : - )

Rawleigh, I sure would like to see that Cummins "mixer". Very cool.

I have a work mate that has a brush hog on a beautiful 766 or 786. I'll hint at that grease but he's a stubborn old bohemian so we'll see how that goes. : - )

In the rollers on an old Cat? That sounds like the right thing to use. : - )

Well I guess I have 10 more gallons of fuel for my mud bottomed fuel tank! I'll add some two cycle or marvel, oh about 5% or more and see how he behaves.

A little at a time.

Hey! Last evening, I was studying/putzing in the books and on the engine. Found the white painted water pump on this yellow under orange engine has a drool hole for the water end of the water pump fan shaft. I took a stick and invade the drool hole and what do I find? Nice soft Mobil grease! Very nice. : - )

I do need to positively charge the fan shaft assy with grease so I'm CERTAIN the fan end bearing of the shaft is getting fresh grease. I need to know.

The idler shaft/generator mount shaft has been pretty shy so far about letting grease out so perhaps he'll get the most attention after getting fresh grease out of both ends of the fan/ water pump shaft.

Injection pump scavenger intake air filter over on the intake manifold (have you found and serviced yours yet?) is on the short list. Not much mention I can find but remove it, take it apart, clean the screen and replace the filter. What? Oh. re-install the screen... Found this in the Galion manual but I swear I've seen it once in IH manuals. We'll see how clean it is.

Blah blah-put the filter housing back.

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I did take the injection pump, scavenger intake air filter apart tonight.

Two slabs of felt sandwiched between two steel "screens".

I get it now, replace the felt filters and clean the screens. It all looked pretty nice inside for 65 years and came off and apart really nice.

If I had tee'd a vacuum gauge in to test the draw thru the filters, I would not have registered a vacuum reading.

It tasted like gasoline. Virtually no vacuum sucking on the outlet fitting. I put it back together.

A little dark Kendall grease on the threads since my anti-seize is MIA. Back on it went.

 

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Duey:  Here are some not so great pictures of it.  The gauge on top shows suction on the oil intake filter, which is on the rear of the case.  There is another post filter on the inside of the case.  3 hoses total: used oil intake, fuel intake and mixed fuel outlet.  It is nicely built with a piggy back bronze pump.  I have never seen another though.

 

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Oh. That blender is VERY neat!

Is it that Cummins knew a little oil helped and enticed their customers to mix it up a bit?

On wheels and ready to go to work.

Thanks Rawleigh!

If you ever take some WD-40 on a rag and clean that housing, show us a pic would you? :-)

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K.  I think it was just a way to save 5% on you fuel bills, since it was produced back in the day of good fuel.

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Ahh, yes, I get it now Rawleigh. :-) Thank you! :-)

Here's a notion for ya'all. How the heck do you spell y'all?

What voltage is the starting/generating on your International engine? This '53 motor grader has a 12 Volt (Mr Volta) so I'm good with 4 gauge cables.

Or am I?

It's been touched on here. Correct me if incorrect.  : - )

I've so much maligned the 6 volt system myself until I tried it on another history piece. The model T Ford.

That used 90 year old starter flops that 4 cylinder over like a modern! OK, not that fast but wow!

IF your starting is 6 Volt and it cranks over like TOO many other 6 volt pieces still living, too darned slow, try some bigger cables!

These Internationals still go don't they? Yep. : - ) Urrr urrr urrr urrr urrr urrr. Too many urrr's, fix what's wrong! : - )

This UD-16 is a urrr urrr , slap the choke cable knob to open, urrr, tob a teeble tob a teeble and then vroom. I'm still over choking it.

2/0 not 2 gauge (NOT 4 gauge!) but Two/Aught gauge should be used if you have 6 Volt starting on your 6 Volt International! Please.

Less Voltage= more current.   EDIT. I should've typed lower not less. : - )

Friday night, I put a helper ground cable on (2 gauge for this 12 Volt system-I don't even like saying the word SYSTEM anymore. My dad had a good "crew" when he was alive and building. Nowadays we are supposed to have a TEAM and all things are a SYSTEM. F that.).

Ehh Hem. The ground cable should help the starter. I made a cable to go between a starter bolt and the ground on the heel plate of this Galion motor grader that has the braided negative ground mounted on a 3/8" bolt on that heel plate.

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On ‎7‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 5:54 PM, Duey_C said:

 

Here's a notion for ya'all. How the heck do you spell y'all?

 

Friday night, I put a helper ground cable on (2 gauge for this 12 Volt system-I don't even like saying the word SYSTEM anymore. My dad had a good "crew" when he was alive and building. Nowadays we are supposed to have a TEAM and all things are a SYSTEM. F that.).

 

Ahh......Duey_C..... I can see...or read, actually.....,that I don't believe you are one of those , gentle, new age  blokes, are you ???????............and with your rabid condemnation  of  years  of human evolution..to the degree  where  would we be  without the  inspired  efforts of the TEAM leader...to  outline the SYSTEMS of the days endeavours.......which happily  wastes two hours of otherwise  productive time......but we can all relax  and listen, spell bound, to the soporific fecal matter flowing  from TEAM   leaders  head......

I had all that crap working in Australia    (Mining  industry ).......now I am finishing my days    operating an excavator  in the logging industry, here in NZ......and this PC/BS just drives  me nuts:wacko::wacko:.......it is so counter productive......and the ''working  man " is treated like he is still seven years old....sigh....I could go on...but......in short ..."I absolutely agree with you "......with emphasis on the  "F  that " ......

"Y'all".....spent a lot of time in the great US, over the years.......that term / expression...call it what you will.....always amused me :)

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Hahaha! That was pretty good Mike! :-) I hate to admit I had to read it twice tho. You made my very good day into a great day!

Almost 5 years ago I was fired from a place that was turning that way. 5S, watchers, timers, team leaders, complain boards (turn in your neighbor) and morning huddles. :-p

They hated tribal knowledge and very independent me. But now my employee owned stock $$$ is coming in so I'm happy as a lark! So the dope did me a huge favor!

Us "misfits" congregate up the road at an older, backwards compatible competitor. We can tell our supervisor "F you!" and we all have a good laugh over it. :lol:

We have a great crew!

I work side by side with the man I worked side by side with down the road. He got canned too. : - ) We always say to each other (EDIT) 60 plus years airline GSE experience.

Hahaha! I never even use y'all or even "yous guys". But I do say things like "uff da" and "you betcha"!

:)

That reminds me of on topic things. I'm going to go crank over the UD-16 and see if I can get any oil pressure before giving it gas and spark.

It might knock less at starting.

 

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"and the ''working  man " is treated like he is still seven years old....sigh"    Oh so true. Kinda sad.

Can we say 1984 is coming? See the movie or read it by George Orwell. Yikes.

Where we are now, we're appreciated and left alone unless we need something and I walk to the pickup happy after 4-6 hours. :)

Ehh hem. Back to the UD-16. I'd like a couple more of these engines.

I did try the cranking over test without gas or spark. :)

By gum, I think it helps! I must try it tomorrow (Hehehe, double blind test?) but the lever was moved to starting mode, the button was pushed to crank it over 10, 20 or 30 times.

I didn't count. No pressure on the gauge but I swear the main shaft didn't knock so bad for the moments it usually does just after starting.

I stopped, turned the gas on, waited just a bit ( I have the darned bowl so clean now I can hardly tell if there's gas moving), switched on the 12 volt F-6 mag-distributor and lit it up.

Aha. I'm not over choking with 2 compressions. It didn't take so had to do it again.

He runs so nice. Flopped the lever to Diesel, and flipped the switches off. Happy.    Then worked on the 28 Twin City.

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So, I pored over a TD-24 today.

I can hardly call the engine (buried in that crawler) a UD-24 engine, as to the lack of any Unit Diesel mounts. Different from my little motor grader.

Everything is open and within arms reach on the Galion motor grader.

Wanna play with the A type scavenger on a TD-24?

Grab a low stool, perch on the track and bend down...

Fascinating. Big engine. Big crawler.

I wanted to pull/push Tee handle (for starting) and clutch lever but kept myself from even getting in the operators seat to do same...

I wished for a step ladder to get up there too. Knees.

Bull.

I wanted to find a gas can, put some in, pull the Tee handle, find that starter switch, figure out the Diesel throttle and get some vrooms/dabble, dabble!, dabble!!!!

I would've been as nimble as a 40 year old IF. But. Not mine.

The TD-24 has a  gas primer. Wha? What for? For starting? Cold weather perhaps? A few flops and this little16 is coming to life even quite cold.

KoO might have different/same observations. :-)

Decided it was best I don't have a large crawler like THAT  near my place. Too much bog under the driveway before the hill. We'd sink. And muck up the driveway.

Goll, what a big crawler. Been too long since its last parade tho.

If it could've it would've been hard. ;-) Duh.

Still want it. Where's the cable operated blade? Prob'ly laying about.

":Hey Bob, what's the story on the TD-24???" Kinda thing.

IH gas start Diesels, shwing.

 

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Duey, 

I had a 118 Gallon a few years back. It was a pretty decent grader and in real good shape. It ran like a top, had good power. I had rewired the whole thing so the original lights and turn signals worked, had a cab fan that worked, heater and blower fan worked, and I wired in a 3 speed switch for the heater fan. It had all of the original gauges, which were in very good shape. After the rewire, they all worked, even the fuel gauge. My 118 had the UD554 engine in it though. I had to send the water pump out to be rebuilt, had to have new seals made for it since it was an obsolete design from what they tell me. I also installed a ceramic button clutch that I had custom built for it. Tragically, less than 10 hours after the clutch job, it started putting antifreeze into one of the cylinders, and the warmer it got, the worse it would get. I didn't have the time or money to put into a head at the time, so I knocked it in the head. Sold all 6 tires and wheels, the rebuilt water pump and gauge cluster to one fellow, sold the engine minus the injection pump and clutch to another guy for parts. Hauled the remaining 28,700 pounds to the scrapyard @275$/ton. Felt bad, but that's how it ended for it. Wish I'd have repowered it now, it would have been so easy. If you ever need an injection pump, or an essentially new clutch for yours, let me know, I still have mine from my 118 setting on the shelf.

 

Ross

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Sorry your motor-grader ended its life that way Ross.

Waiting for the transmission on mine to say NO. Until then, on we go, dear Galion and try to make sense of the manual. So I am a trifle  conservative with mine.

I shouldn't be. Go out and run!

He'll get his run time soon! I've snow to move! By the time he's warmed up and limber, it's time to let him sit down as his work is done.

Holy cats! I should jump on your parts Ross!!

Been in a off topic old tractor HAZE since my last post. :-) Twin City tractors. Mmmm. :-)

Last startings of this UD16 were very promising for the upcoming! After it gets cold and then warms a bit, that is. Need to clean up the Hill and the driveway.

We'll see. : - )

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Guys I have a question and wish for your thoughts.

Have the Galion out and this sweet old UD-16 is bucking me finally.

Remember: In the moment I forgot to check to see by loosening the pipe thread fuel cap if that would help check IF the breather on the tank is plugged with ice.

Put more fuel in after it slowly died as I was losing power and governor (there's 10 gallons in maybe a 30 or 40 gallon tank-I measured and calculated last summer but forget). Got him parked out of the way. Not enough fuel? Can't be. The gauge said no fuel pressure. Drove and got 10 more gallons (heard nothing as I opened the fuel cap), put 10 in and rechecked bleeders. Pressure good and ran nice for 20-25 minutes. I was idling down this hill blading snow.

Did I just answer my own question? Or have you fellas seen other things that can get wishy-washy in the fuel system and surprise us?

New filters, a new delivery hose, good fuel (all since August) and he had been running real nice.

Thoughts?

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dont rule out an old hose sucking shut,or the vent cap(leave open)

then gel dirt in tank ...............rig a temp 10g tank up high (1.5h run)

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Aha! Points taken mmi!

Now it's warmer out, the tank breather is prob'ly ready to allow air into the fuel tank. I have to pull it fully apart and inspect it yet. :-)

The frost-boils down on the road are ready now so I must stop monkeying with my old tractors and get back to the Galion so I can smooth the road out.

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The frost boils were not ready. Now they are and the driveway needs it.
Ignore those old Twin City tractors and what-not for a bit.
This is only for Galion motor graders. Your fuel tank breather may differ greatly. Keep it clean. If it’s old check it. : - ) I’d never looked in here before.
I attacked the Galion motor grader’s fuel tank breather just now and found:
1 The stuffing for the breather. The mesh is quite nice and clean.
2 The inside below where the mesh is. Twas plugged with moisture in March.
3 NOW the breather’s base looks better... Dental tools. : - )
It’s a two holer again. Should’ve lightly greased it inside for the next 66 years to keep the rust in check.
4 The stuffing/mesh going back in.
Carry on. This UD-16 will be happier now. : - )

EDIT: Scratch that. Ran for about an hour and back to no fuel pressure.

Next stop, inside the tank. Either get a full length glove to reach down into the tank to feel the outlet or drain and wash it out...

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Good fuel flow from the tank! Not sludge/mud from the tank. Tank needs to be cleaned out tho.

Miffed. Fuel pressure low and then up. Bled the filter housings. Good! Headed up The Hill backwards. Ready for gas cycle just in case. He made it just fine. Then fuel pressure started to wain but ran great, settling him into his spot and some idle time.

Miffed. I'll try another set of fuel filters. Did that muck from the filter housings soften?

All fuel pumped by the primary pump isn't going into the injector pump sump but I DO have a leaky seal on the primary pump's shaft. OK. Been that way for a long time.

On the "to do" list. I was hoping not but OK. What's another 50 bucks. : - )

Miffed.

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Found it. A Galion fuel tank issue, not an IH engine issue... That UD-16 is a happy/reliable fella.

1 The fuel strainer in the tank. Top 2/3rd's is for incoming fuel from the spout from the truck or can, bottom 1/3 is for outgoing fuel. There's a shoulder below the filler neck to hold the strainer in place. It kind of works.

2 The view inside the Galion fuel tank. Man oh man did the last gallon of fuel RUN out of the line into the barrel after I pulled the strainer out! And I thought the flow was pretty good!

The bottom of the tank strainer nestles on/in two places in the bottom of the tank.

See the stub nipple in the middle of the larger hole surrounded by crud?

Note the Galion return pipe from the pump in the upper portion of the pic? All the way to the top of the tank. The rusty wall is a baffle.

3 Well now. Ain't no fuel gonna flow thru that reliably. Yuck. I'll wash him off in a couple days and see IF he's serviceable. The 2/3rd's-1/3 separator disc doesn't show up in that pic.

4 Bottom of the fuel tank strainer. Yuck. The hole,in the middle for the outlet, the larger edge is stuffed into the tank bottom.

Looking back,  I know the fuel pump (not the injector pump) moves a LOT of fuel and should've realized... A darned good evening with my sweetheart.

Tests coming.

: - )

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We can see from the 4th pic the two rings where the fuel levels SAT for years. Partly my own fault but I COULD blame it on the wimpy winters we’ve had for several years here in MN. Didn’t need to use him for too many years. Part of the problem along with even more time than I’ve been alive and the strainer not serviced...
Pic 6 Purple cleaner has done me well for brass before and he’s “You’re soaking in it.” Remember Madge from the Palmolive commercials? And looking good! The 2 “fuel level rings” are about gone but need to get back out to the shop tonight to scrub him down some more with the Purple Cleaner.
Side note: Poof! It is completely gone but I’ll babble this. Please be certain you service your fuel tank (whatever brand you may have) in shorter intervals than every 66 years.

Yes, I cleaned up a Paw Patrol pail that was in the yard for the Purple stuff.

 

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Naw, I ain't done.

Hopefully, the finish line with this ol' boy and back to daring The Hill. Haha. Next for this motor grader are some broken/not working grease zerks and other little things but that's outside the scope of this thread unless it's UD engine is related. Hehe. When I tackle the water pump shaft and bearings and generator drive  unit bearings on this UD-16, you'll know.  : - )

I found the Galion tank inlet strainer lower portion looked good from the brass outside but plugged inside on the perforated steel liner under the brass mesh. The perforated steel liner is one piece, top to bottom and rolled together. The brass screen was soldered on the lower section for the inlet fuel below the separator plate. Cool part. What a bugger to clean.

He's 95% clean now. 2 day session. Ready for a LOT of years.

7 The image thru the lower brass/steel screens are the trees in the background. Couldn't see that before. He was plugged.

Maw SAW it first but I made it happen with patience. Glad she saw it.  Made me VERY happy!

8 The pile of crud out of the lower portion of the tank strainer. It isn't exactly rust nor is it soft crud. Quite tough crud once its dry I'll bet. "Super Clean cleaner degreaser" did it's bit for me again to let me finish with the pressure washer, patience, tapping on my palm  and these nodules rattled out until quite clean.

9  Took the upper portion to the  bench grinder's wire wheel for the rust. Yes, that end needed help too. Are there fellas that don't have a wire wheel on their bench grinder?

You Cccrazy without the wire wheel. : - )    Pic taken in a small sea of Twin City and other parts but he's clean and ready to go. : - )

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Yep, the clean strainer was ready to go back in but the fuel tank wasn’t ready for it.
I do not know how the strainer was held tightly in place originally as the parts book doesn’t say spit about any gaskets or shims to keep the strainer in place in a friction fit between the filler neck on top and the sump in the bottom of the tank without tipping over which is what it did when I put it back in place...
Was the crud/goop that came out the sump something at one time? Possibly a piece of rubber?
I made four 1/16“ cork gaskets to raise the strainer up and removed two shims/gaskets from the filler neck to lower it to hold the strainer. I need to re-check that the strainer’s in place right above the short outlet stub in the bottom yet. The shims/gaskets I made should’ve perhaps been fashioned for under the filler neck’s lower surface that rests on top of the strainer to hold it down or machined a shouldered part for under the filler neck.

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😊

Thanks Ross. I do hope it's useful.

There is SO much good maintenance/repair info here! When I was working on just this fuel system last summer, it took me two weeks to find all I needed.

More To Come from this fella, I'm afraid. Never ending. And my head is firmly lost in another brand of tractor right now too. The UD-16 patiently waits for me but winter is coming.

Recheck inlet/outlet stainer in the tank, refill the fuel, add old fuel and 5%??? two cycle oil to improve fuel lubricity. Diesel fuel harber's(sp) rust and that fact angers me a bit.

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2 hours ago, Duey_C said:

😊

Thanks Ross. I do hope it's useful.

There is SO much good maintenance/repair info here! When I was working on just this fuel system last summer, it took me two weeks to find all I needed.

More To Come from this fella, I'm afraid. Never ending. And my head is firmly lost in another brand of tractor right now too. The UD-16 patiently waits for me but winter is coming.

Recheck inlet/outlet stainer in the tank, refill the fuel, add old fuel and 5%??? two cycle oil to improve fuel lubricity. Diesel fuel harber's(sp) rust and that fact angers me a bit.

I used to have a dodge pickup with a Cummins in her, the guy I picked it up from  gave me like 4 cases of the 2 1/2 gallon chainsaw mix oil with it. Told me to make sure I pour one in every full tank of fuel I got just for that same reason.

There is so much to say about why they changed diesel fuel but I don’t want to side track all this great information here. 🙂

Ross

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