superih

5488 All-Wheel Drive Hand Pump

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What are you guys doing with these hand pumps, the All-Wheel Drive pump 127273191 is no longer available, only the 2wd version 1263446C91 for $1660, which will make my steering slower.

Are you rebuilding or is there a good aftermarket source?

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Try these guys, just tell them what you have and see what they say..... BJ Hydraulic (269)623-6743. Or LJ fluid power (269)623-4150. The dealers around here take all kinds of pumps and motors to them. Delton MI is the town I think. Good luck!!

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Does the square front axle 2wd use the same hand pump?  Maybe able to find one of those?

 

Matt

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I was told the hand pump for mfd was same as late model 5488.  I bought flow divider valve from CIH after the 5488 2wd (hd axle )steering got very stiff.  Had the old valve rebuilt.  Then same thing happened to 5088.  Mechanic put the rebuilt valve into the 50.  Both 2wd tractors want to drift left about one rev of steering wheel every minute.   Really annoying.  The 54mfd does not.  Had hand pump rebuilt on the 54 2wd to correct drift...no change.  Was also told by CIH mechanic the hand pumps rebuild simply replaces orings.  I wonder about that. Never looked at part # for hand pumps on hd axle vs standard but there is difference on divider valve.

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On 2/5/2018 at 9:43 PM, Thesd5488 said:

Late 2 wd is same  be easy to convert go a common hand pump

How would you go about this?

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When the hand pump on our square axle 5488 went bad a few years ago I googled the part number and found a company that was building a direct replacement and I'm pretty sure it was under $500.

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5 hours ago, superih said:

How would you go about this?

They just bolt on find one with close specs might have to get lines made but shouldn’t be to hard

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The pumps are different.  A square axle and mfd axle use a 7gpm pump.  The 2wd ih axle uses a 5gpm.  I have a square axle on my 3688.   It wonders all over the road and takes more revolutions to turn it.  The hd square axle has s much bigger cylinder. 

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The 5 gallon only runs about 70% of the 7 so that's why you get steering wheel creep and more revs.  

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A little update.

Midwest Steering can still get these hand pumps new, they actually have them in stock, just call them and give them the IH part number, they also make aftermarket replacements for less than half the cost of the original.

They can also supply larger displacement pumps so that the tractor turns faster, my tractor is currently 4.5 steering turns from lock to lock.  In comparison my 856 is 3.25 turns lock to lock, much better to drive.

However, it seams that all of the MFWD tractors including the new Magnums use 4 to 5 turns to go lock to lock.  Any one know why?

My 5488 supplies the hand pump with 9 gpm at 2500psi, got lots of oil so why shouldn't I step up a couple sizes to get this closer to 3.5 turns? 

I believe I should still be able to calibrate my EZ Steer with a quicker turning tractor

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After talking with Midwest Steering and a few other knowledgeable guys it sounds like the OEM has been making the steering slower on tractors over the years just due to safety of driving them down the road, slower steering so that the tractor will not react too quickly for inexperienced operators.

A few tractors for reference;

  • IH 856- 3.25 turns
  • IH 5488 all wheel drive- 4.5 turns
  • CaseIH Magnum 8940 MFWD- 4 turns
  • CaseIH MX 285 MFWD- 6 turns
  • JD 4020- 5 turns

The stock hand pump 1272731C91 is a Hydraguide HGA14122, all the math supports 4.5 turns lock to lock, still available for $2000.00. 

I ended up going the next size larger pump that will get me down to 3.75 turns.  Midwest Steering makes an aftermarket replacement HGA16P for $714.00, bolts right up just the ports  are not in a diamond pattern like the original, they are in a square pattern which will be fine being that all connections are hoses.

 

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3 hours ago, superih said:

After talking with Midwest Steering and a few other knowledgeable guys it sounds like the OEM has been making the steering slower on tractors over the years just due to safety of driving them down the road, slower steering so that the tractor will not react too quickly for inexperienced operators.

A few tractors for reference;

  • IH 856- 3.25 turns
  • IH 5488 all wheel drive- 4.5 turns
  • CaseIH Magnum 8940 MFWD- 4 turns
  • CaseIH MX 285 MFWD- 6 turns
  • JD 4020- 5 turns

The stock hand pump 1272731C91 is a Hydraguide HGA14122, all the math supports 4.5 turns lock to lock, still available for $2000.00. 

I ended up going the next size larger pump that will get me down to 3.75 turns.  Midwest Steering makes an aftermarket replacement HGA16P for $714.00, bolts right up just the ports  are not in a diamond pattern like the original, they are in a square pattern which will be fine being that all connections are hoses.

 

Please tell us how that works out for you!

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A little back story;

While I had my 5488 apart this winter, my original hand pump was leaking and it also wondered the road a little bit so I was going to buy a new one but CaseIH did not offer them any more.  So we pulled it off and resealed the bottom gearotor section and the input shaft.  After putting it back on and running it the tractor steered terribly hard, like harder than my SM-TA with a loader on it and no power steering.  I had a couple of different IH mechanics tell me that it will take time to break back in so I ran it this spring in the field, never even tried to get better, my back and shoulders would be in knots after a day of running it.

Then, I found Midwest Steering, these guys are awesome, even if you do not want to replace your hand pump just send it to these guys and they can rebuild it.  I ended up getting their HGA16P put on this weekend, the steering is back to being effortless, turns from lock to lock in 3.75 turns (was over 4.5 turns) and no leaks.  It bolted right up like they said it would, I put new Parker fittings on the pump before install and replace the steering column nylon bushings which really tightened everything back up.

Old vs new;

IMG_20180610_151220549_HDR.jpg

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1 hour ago, superih said:

A little back story;

While I had my 5488 apart this winter, my original hand pump was leaking and it also wondered the road a little bit so I was going to buy a new one but CaseIH did not offer them any more.  So we pulled it off and resealed the bottom gearotor section and the input shaft.  After putting it back on and running it the tractor steered terribly hard, like harder than my SM-TA with a loader on it and no power steering.  I had a couple of different IH mechanics tell me that it will take time to break back in so I ran it this spring in the field, never even tried to get better, my back and shoulders would be in knots after a day of running it.

Then, I found Midwest Steering, these guys are awesome, even if you do not want to replace your hand pump just send it to these guys and they can rebuild it.  I ended up getting their HGA16P put on this weekend, the steering is back to being effortless, turns from lock to lock in 3.75 turns (was over 4.5 turns) and no leaks.  It bolted right up like they said it would, I put new Parker fittings on the pump before install and replace the steering column nylon bushings which really tightened everything back up.

Old vs new;

IMG_20180610_151220549_HDR.jpg

Do you have a number?

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On 2/24/2018 at 6:14 PM, SD6788 said:

The pumps are different.  A square axle and mfd axle use a 7gpm pump.  The 2wd ih axle uses a 5gpm.  I have a square axle on my 3688.   It wonders all over the road and takes more revolutions to turn it.  The hd square axle has s much bigger cylinder. 

 

On 2/24/2018 at 6:20 PM, SD6788 said:

The 5 gallon only runs about 70% of the 7 so that's why you get steering wheel creep and more revs.  

Just to clarify this so that people aren't mislead;

The 2wd tractors used a flow divider (located under the cab) orificed to maintain 5 gpm to the hand pump, the valve will supply more oil if needed, after the hand pump oil is sent to supply other functions of the tractor.

The All-Wheel Drive tractors used a flow divider orificed to maintain 7 gpm to the hand pump however, these later tractors had a hydraulic system that routed oil differently than the early tractors, I believe that is why more oil was supplied.

Hand pumps are sized by oil displacement per revolution, the stock IH# 1272731C91 which is a Hydraguide HGA14122 displaces 10.4 cubic inches of oil per revolution, so 4.5 turns of the wheel from lock to lock only uses 0.2 gallons, at 7gpm you theoretically have enough oil to turn the front wheels from lock to lock in 0.029 minutes which is 1.68 seconds.  Its not the available flow that controls the steering speed, its the displacement of the hand pump.

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10 minutes ago, IHC5488 said:

Do you have a number?

Part number?  It was in the post, HGA16P

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1 hour ago, superih said:

Part number?  It was in the post, HGA16P

Sorry,. For Midwest Steering.

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