Nelson W.

282D engine trouble in a 706 Farmall

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Hi to all,

Thanks for all the advise. I'm now pretty sure that the idler gear is the gear that is jumping up and down. I looked at it again today while I was at Dad's farm. My guess is that the idler bolt is broken and letting the gear move up and down. I plan to pull the front of the tractor off and look at the idler gear.  It will have to wait until after hog killing time but I will let you know the result when I find out. Until then, I would like to know if there is a bearing of some kind between the idler gear and the idler shaft? I can see that there is no roller or needle bearing between them but is there a bearing like a rod bearing in there?

Thanks,

Nelson

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Trying to make it run with this type of condition will lead to injection pump seizure. That won't make you very happy lol!

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Thanks Louie,

I may need to replace the bushing after all the gear and shaft has been through. I'll let you folks know what happens when I get it pulled apart.

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330 to 380 PSI from the IH spec book. You need to look at the timing as you can get someone  messing with the trimming screws and you won't ever get enough money to pay for burnt pistons and the likes. All the knocking you describe points you in that direction.

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Well folks, I'm back. I pulled the front end off and moved it out of the way. Then pulled the engine front cover and what do you think I found? Well I'll tell you. The bolt that holds the IP to crank idler gear (see the diagram from Louie above) came out and was just bouncing around as the crank was turning. When I took the front cover off, the idler gear assembly just fell out. There is a locating pin (see pic from Louie) that was broken and laying in the bottom of the cover. The bolt had just backed out and the gear was just flopping up and down as it pleased. The bearing on the inside of the idler is trashed but we think we can get a new one. The idler hub looks OK but the locating pin is broken. We have drilled that out and may be able to make another pin that will work. As for the bearing, well it trashed. If anyone knows where I can get A newer gear and hub, please let me know.

Thanks to all.

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Nelson, those parts, item 9&8 gear with bushing (278 263 R1) and the shaft, item 6 (367 580 R11) are in stock at FP Smith, Fairfield, CA www.fpsmitheq.com, 707 864-1122. You can check parts stock on their website with part numbers. Their site shows in stock new and used. 

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Thanks Louie,

Once again you have saved me. I talked to Hoober International just a few hours ago and they said the gear and bushing were no longer available. I did find the gear used but I don't know what shape the bushing is in. My gear looks OK but without a new bushing I won't be able to use it. I'll call your guy in CA and see what he has. Thanks again!!

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Hi All,

I got a good used gear and hub with an good pin and good bushing. I installed it and timed the crank gear to the cam and the idler to crank and idler to pump gear. We set the pimp marks to TDC and it still wont run right. We have had to advance the pump gear as far as it will go and moved the pump as far advanced (away from the engine) as far as it will go and it still doesn't run very well. It's better but still blows white smoke and has very little power. Does anyone have any idea as to what I have done wrong? Any advice would be helpful. I'm about to give up but Dad really wants this tractor to run right. 

 

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Well, I just got back home from looking at it again. I set the crank timing marks to 3 BTDC and then adjusted the marks in the pump window to line up exactly by using the adjustment on the front of the pump. I runs now as it should. Didn't want to let down my 78 year father who loves these 706's. He now has 3 working 706 tractors. Thanks to everyone for your help.

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Just a quick note on sleeves being pushed out. Normal. Make  a set of short bolts and  flat washers that will trap the sleeve only and tighten to 15 inch pounds as you do not want to damage the  sleeve. 

If someone fooled with the trimmer screw you will get an erratic running  hard starting engine.

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I will argue on the loose sleeves.

Many did it but it is not right.

To transfer the heat from the sleeve to the block, they need to be tight to each other. Air in between is an insulator, stops the heat transfer and scores pistons. Oversize sleeves are available to cure this. If plowing or other heavy work, could score a piston. Normal light work will probably not be an issue. Dad had a 460D, same design, that all six sleeves and pistons would go up and down without the head and it was in three times for scored pistons. The right, tight, sleeves finally cured it.

Battery, battery cables and starter condition also can slow starting. A diesel has to spin so fast to start right. May be worth a look after you get over the sticker shock of these problems.

You are one lucky guy. I had a guy ruin three pumps with the same idler gear issue. I finally talked him into my putting the fourth, brand new pump on. I found the problem and saved #4. It only takes a few thousandths to seize a Roosa Master up. Like I say, YOU ARE LUCKY!

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sadly, many people put a pump on, seize it, and then assume it was the pump at fault. Put another on, and dog gone it, another bad pump! Then another! All the while, it is the gear train. I have seen that happen before! Taking the front of the engine apart is much more work than just pulling the "bad" pumps lol! 4 cyl JD engines seem to like to do this too. 

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INJPUMPED was right on.

The first pump died for no reason.

I overhauled it and when it seized, I was an idiot and knew nothing about pumps.

Pump shop did the next and when that seized, they too were idiots and knew nothing.

Owner ordered a brand new Roosa Master through IH parts as everyone knew nothing about pumps and were idiots.

I planted the seed that the new one could seize unless someone found out why it was doing this. Told him to bring into shop.

The owner left but must have thought about what I said as it came to the shop on the truck.

The bearings had went out of the idler that drove the pump. This pulled the bolt and threads out of the block. I had new bearings in the idler and the plate off the front of the block. Owner took the plate and idler and disappeared. His tractor. He soon was back. He had local blacksmith weld the idler to the backing plate and said put it together. I told him if the pump locked up, he was on his own. To this day, it is probably still running. The things that are done and people get away with, and some don't?  There comes a time to stop, think and work out what has happened and to determine, why!

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