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Replaced Alternator on 1066


russ_alabama

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My 1066 alternator, a 10si deco with built in regulator, had been overcharging now and then, then finally all the time...  so in the interest of time I just ordered the alternator from the link below.  New and looked like a good deal.  Figured I'd change the reg in the old one in winter and have it on the shelf.  The new one isn't charging, with the batt voltage at 12.8v, amp gauge (that's a known good one) sitting at dead straight up, turn on lights and shows discharge on gauge.  This is at any rpm, btw, and not just at idle.  This tractor still has the power resistor under the plate in front of the floorboard.  All that was fine, then my overcharging, and then the replacement.  So this alternator I bought has a third terminal... It's got the 10si two blade connector like my old alternator, but with an added blade in parallel with one of the two in a row.  I didn't connect anything to the third terminal.  Then it has the correct post mount for the big wire.  What's the third terminal and can I do something with it to get charging, or do I just have the wrong alternator for my harness?  They list it for my tractor as the 70A replacement, to go up on current.  I want to put on LED lights to run with a Hoelsher grapple at night on the loader, and run a fasse valve that'll pull current, to get the extra remote... Current was adding up, so I figured I'd up the current.  Any ideas are appreciated.  Thanks, Russ... 

 

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/Farmall-1066_Alternator_ADR0133.html

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Just a thought...Some Delco's use a plastic pin to hold the brushes up when assembling. I have seen this pin left in rebuilds, if so, they won't work. The pin sticks out the back side, you just pull it out.

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be sure the metal terminals did not push out the back side of the plastic plug when you installed it, check that you have power to all three wires with the key on, (the one mark #1 on the back of the alt. should be a lower voltage and show a dim light with a test light) , the belt is tight. if all the above check out, take the alt. to a box store and have them test it, you may have gotten a bad unit  

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My 1460 combine has a 3 terminal alternator, they have a relay for charging in line so I think you have wrong alternator. 

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Third pin is tach like already said but it shouldn't make any difference on your tractor. It just doesn't get hooked up

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The third terminal is for a tach on some applications, but IH always used it to operate a relay    for the warning light in the combines.  It has no purpose on a 1066 but it also makes absolutely no difference, so don't worry about it.   You have to determine if you have , of course full battery power on the main charging heavy wire,  battery power to the wire that hooks to number two on alt at all times as that is the sense lead for the voltage regulator.  Just a rusty or loose connection on number two can and will cause an over charge or a no charge condition.  Then, number one comes from ign switch, to resistor under column and should have power only when switch is turned on.  When unhooked from alternator, a test lamp will light fairly bright, depending on  the resistance value of the resistor, but will be very dim when hooked up to alternator.   If you have all that and no charge, you can be sure alternator is problem.  

 

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Pete23  I could not have said it any better.  Check out the wiring harness on the tractor, if you do not have the proper voltage at the 3 terminals like Pete said you found your problem.

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Thanks guys!  I'll troubleshoot based on your good info first chance in the morning. Getting much needed rain and the 1066 didn't make it from the shed to the shop ahead of the storm.  Good to know what the third terminal was.  I kept the orientation of the dual plug the same as before, but I didn't think of corrosion or poor connection.  Could be the reg in the old alternator was ok, if that's the case.  

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If I remember right, all the tach terminal alternators had swing arm brushes for combines and dirty conditions. They were a bit of an upgrade from the standard brushes,

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This one came from Triple  R  Tactors.  

(A fellow forum member). It's a 100 amp with a trash guard.

Great people to deal with.

5925072d45734_Image5-23-17at11_05PM.jpg.d9d042fe9107a4e56e88beb47e63a8b8.jpg

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The other end of the #2 terminal wire is connected to the battery cable starter solenoid stud crimped into the same connector as the power lead to the alternator. No or low voltage on the wire will cause the alternator to overcharge. The original Delco regulator would not allow the alternator to start to charge if there was no voltage at the #2 terminal. Problems with that wire could explain the problems you are having with both alternators.

A U shaped clip missing on the brush holder will keep the regulator from grounding resulting in a no charge condition. (Experience can be a good teacher.) If you look in the small D shaped hole in the back of the alternator there is a small tab about 1/2" inside. Grounding that tab to the case will bypass the regulator should cause the alternator to go to full charge.

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On 5/21/2017 at 7:27 PM, Diesel Doctor said:

If I remember right, all the tach terminal alternators had swing arm brushes for combines and dirty conditions. They were a bit of an upgrade from the standard brushes,

that's what i have... probably should have just replaced the reg in the other one, or just got a standard output... but i was adding up more lights for night work and running the fasse valve current on top of that, and thought it wouldn't hurt to go up in current.  from earlier posts, i bet i could have been fighting dirty connectors or poor tension sockets, causing ramp up in charge based on poor report of the load voltage at the battery (from the solenoid connection)... been covered up all week at home and work both, but should be a rainy day sunday, where i can get it in the shop... need it running to get round bale hay out of the field (where its the fastest tractor i have, in terms of speed you can stand across the field)... and its a good one to leave the bush hog on for the hour here or there you get to clip pasture weeds... 

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15 minutes ago, Owen Aaland said:

The other end of the #2 terminal wire is connected to the battery cable starter solenoid stud crimped into the same connector as the power lead to the alternator. No or low voltage on the wire will cause the alternator to overcharge. The original Delco regulator would not allow the alternator to start to charge if there was no voltage at the #2 terminal. Problems with that wire could explain the problems you are having with both alternators.

A U shaped clip missing on the brush holder will keep the regulator from grounding resulting in a no charge condition. (Experience can be a good teacher.) If you look in the small D shaped hole in the back of the alternator there is a small tab about 1/2" inside. Grounding that tab to the case will bypass the regulator should cause the alternator to go to full charge.

this sounds a lot like my issue... that overcharging would come along every now and then and then go away... so it never qualified as the top of the long list of things that's just got to get done (insurance with the job keeps me from just farming, but blessed to have the job)... finally, when you'd get RPMs above idle by much, bam, full output of the alternator on the amp gauge... agm battery in that one (whether that was a good idea or not), and to get through crushing a load of feed (in a NH mixer) you'd have a pretty hot battery (that'll be a test on that battery, from what i hear).  no clip in the brush holder, tho'.  interesting on the ground-the-#2-terminal-tab test... makes sense... sense voltage stays low, reg goes wide open.  everything's easy when you know how... problem is knowing how... :) ... that's why i come here.  tremendous resource to have you fellows on here to ask questions of.  very appreciated.  hoping to work on it sunday morning when i get rained out of bush hogging.  if i could have been off work tomorrow, i'd have got another 20acres of round bale hay cut/raked/baled.  having to work around 3-day weekends with what time i have to take off from work.  three more cuttings for the first cutting to get that done.  

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On 5/23/2017 at 11:08 PM, lorenzo said:

This one came from Triple  R  Tactors.  

(A fellow forum member). It's a 100 amp with a trash guard.

Great people to deal with.

that's the one i have too... got it from yesteryear's... I'll check on Triple R Tractors for parts too... didn't know about them... got the 1066, a 544, and an old SM to keep up... the SM needs many things... maybe some work will get done on it this winter, i hope... 

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Pete23 describes it perfectly but I thought a simple generic diagram would help:

10si basic.jpg

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2 hours ago, New Englander said:

Pete23 describes it perfectly but I thought a simple generic diagram would help:

10si basic.jpg

both help a lot, pete23's description and this diagram.  all of it makes sense, B is the charge source, R turns on the field, F is the sense of the "load" voltage to see if it needs more charge... so, then, based on pete and owen's descriptions, that F wire actually goes back past the ammeter and to the battery cable(s) connection at the starter solenoid, right?  if so, i'm fixed on my debugging, alternator-verifying, connection-fixing, or re-wiring approach sun morning (rainy day, to put me in the shop working, supposedly).  i can see why some go ahead and replace the resistor with a diode also.  I don't leave a key on many times...  its like where i hit my head on the short corn-crib door at the barn... has to happen about once every two years to put me in a pattern of not doing it.  

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Left the key on myself, went on a trip and my wife needed to mow; she wasn't happy about the dead batteries.

What I should do is put an alarm system like I had on my boats. Low oil pressure or high water temp and the alarm will get your attention. You can't wait to shut the key off once the engine stops.

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1 hour ago, New Englander said:

Left the key on myself, went on a trip and my wife needed to mow; she wasn't happy about the dead batteries.

What I should do is put an alarm system like I had on my boats. Low oil pressure or high water temp and the alarm will get your attention. You can't wait to shut the key off once the engine stops.

pretty handy to have a wife that mows when you're on trips... my orange colored zero turn mower came stock with a car-horn wired to a sensor that's making contact at about 1/32" lower oil level than the low mark on the stick... i ain't undoing it... only uses a quart/100hrs, so i was milking it to the oil change when the horn went off a long ways from the shop... went ahead and changed oil where it was... i add some now instead... 

 

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3 hours ago, russ_alabama said:

pretty handy to have a wife that mows when you're on trips... my orange colored zero turn mower came stock with a car-horn wired to a sensor that's making contact at about 1/32" lower oil level than the low mark on the stick... i ain't undoing it... only uses a quart/100hrs, so i was milking it to the oil change when the horn went off a long ways from the shop... went ahead and changed oil where it was... i add some now instead... 

 

Scag zero turn? There doesn't seem to be a place for a low oil level sensor on the Kawasaki engine in mine.

Wife mows with a huge bat-wing finishing mower and is fond of doing it. She says it's mindless but rewarding at the same time. I can't argue with that. Her only complaint is that it's an open station tractor and a little uncomfortable in August or in the spring when the wind come off the 40 degree ocean. She'll also mow with the ZT but is less fond of that.

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16 minutes ago, New Englander said:

Scag zero turn? There doesn't seem to be a place for a low oil level sensor on the Kawasaki engine in mine.

Wife mows with a huge bat-wing finishing mower and is fond of doing it. She says it's mindless but rewarding at the same time. I can't argue with that. Her only complaint is that it's an open station tractor and a little uncomfortable in August or in the spring when the wind come off the 40 degree ocean. She'll also mow with the ZT but is less fond of that.

Kubota, smallest diesel when I got it, 21hp... Zd221... scag's probably a step up, but I've liked this one... I was a devoted cub cadet guy, and had about six of them... but this is fast and I don't work on it like I did each of the older cubs that I bought worn out to start with... My bud that has a ferris has the most impressive speed with mowing performance, and his Kawasaki engine and the ferris suspension on all four wheels is tons faster than my kubota...

But my cousin came home with a 582 cub cadet that really showed what cub was in the good years... Beautiful machine... My last cub was a 3225, with a roller deck that was wonderful for not scalping... 

Man, you probably have a great wife for many reasons, but loving to finish mow is certainly a good reason too...

Mid summer here in Alabama can be a humid mug of heat... I still like mowing tho...  Nothing better than the operation of equipment... 

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Busy weekend, but i got a chance to follow up on the alternator.  The new one, versus the "overcharging old one" (quotes explained in a moment) showed about 12v, at the battery, and at the F-2 connector.  Turn on the lights, less voltage, ammeter shows neg charge, and the F-2 reads the voltage that the battery reads.  I used a clamp on DC-ammeter and it shows what the tractor's ammeter shows.  I put on the old alternator and cleaned a bit on the connector contacts, and its showing a correct amount of charge, and the battery shows about 14V or so with that alternator... normally at this point i've been able to run up the RPM and the overcharge would occur.  Didn't this time.  So, like was pointed out earlier, probably wiring/connector issue.  Would have been better if I'd debugged versus replacement, but live and learn.  

So... I take both alternators to O'Reilly's and they put them on the tester.  New alternator shows 11.56 "B+" voltage and the old one shows 14.86.  So, the tester failed the new one and passed the old one.  Ironically, you could hear the bearing(s) in the old one.  Ha.  So, I emailed the source of the new one and we'll see how that goes.  

Anyway, appreciate the help and the insights, fellows.  That was a good lesson.  I'm going to go ahead and replace the female connectors at the alternator.  

The 1066 came to the rescue yesterday when i got my goose neck loaded with 160 80lb bales of alfalfa hung up on a ditch with rain clouds coming up.  3-point goose neck hitch on it can deal with a loaded trailer, and was able to drop the neck lower than the truck bed would do (to clear the dove tail from the ditch it was hung up on).  We're spraying preservative on the alfalfa and its amazing how green and lush the bales look a 2-3wks after i'd loaded the trailers (just now throwing the bales up in the barn loft).  Even a year later, they look mighty preserved.  

Thanks again... 

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Just to mention... the vendor for the alternator asked for details on the non-working diagnosis to give to their supplier, and i told that... they came back next morning (today) and said the supplier would ship a return label and another alternator was on the way.  so, so far so good.  

Russ... 

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