tony in ca.

Started My 806 L.P. restoration

623 posts in this topic

On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2017 at 10:04 PM, BOBSIH856 said:

Good to hear you found the issue. AS for metal particles not being in the filter you will probably find most in the bottom of the oil pan and in the oil passages in the rod, crank and block. Only pieces that would end up in filter are the pieces that are small enough to get through the oil pump pick up screen and through the pump. I'm assuming you are going to to a complete overhaul again on the engine?

Yep ! Starting from scratch.  I believe this time they will put short block together for us. lol.

       At this point I am leaning to bore out  as big as sound and have pistons made . To me that's making lemon aid of bitter lemons.;)

     Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am on my lap-top and I think I can post from here , I am at the coast . My P.C. at home is in bad need of expertise to get it acting right again.:lol::lol: 

   This was Therapy Thursday 6/29/17

     Finally got all the pieces back from painter & coater and the time to get Quick hitches together .

      We  did one as Cat #3 for the 68 & other was set up as Cat #2 for the 56.

       I much prefer the looks of the Cat #3 so, I may re-configure the one into cat #3 just a matter of crossing drop arms. 

       The linkage works well , Surprise. lol.

            Few pic's,   BTW ,Last pic, My Carpenter Rod here to fix lot of little stuff ,including the night light 0n shop . His gonads are much bigger and heavier then mine. I was shaking on Fork lift, watching him and he was talking and carrying on while up there. The ladder has a Certification , The forklift is certified, However, there is no sticker on the pallet , or light pole , or on Rod himself , or the pavement below as soft landing material. :o

              Tony

IMG_4728.JPG

IMG_4727.JPG

IMG_4726.JPG

IMG_4715.JPG

IMG_4723.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have done that a bunch of time, never comfortable with it. At least not as bad as this 😀

forkliftfail4.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

       HOLY SMOKES !  Now that is improvising !

              Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Couple pic's of the linkage apparatus.

  We had to do quite a bit of repairs , re- makes ,most of the pins & all the hitch pins ,and machining on holes.  I exhausted all my leads there is no parts available.

  If you go back to page 19 - 21 there are pictures of the linkage before repairs  and further along pics of the machine work.

        Tony

IMG_4712.JPG

IMG_4713.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎6‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 3:10 PM, Owen Aaland said:

Unless you are seeing scoring in the area where the piston rings travel but rather on the piston skirts I think you will find that there was not enough clearance between the skirt and sleeve. The pistons we get today seem to need the clearance set to the larger end of the specs rather than tighter.

That Appears to be the problem here.

    Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tony,

ive enjoyed following the restoration. The attention to detail, highly competent "helpers", etc. are just a marvel to follow on here. All the well wishes and helpful advice are a testament to the type of folks on this forum. I only have one remaining tractor and she's in her work clothes but seeing some of your projects makes me want to dress her back up. Maybe someday I'll get that done and post pics of her pulling a restored McCormick 140 wagon.

good luck the rest of the way.  Can't wait to see her finished!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, johnny_red said:

Tony,

ive enjoyed following the restoration. The attention to detail, highly competent "helpers", etc. are just a marvel to follow on here. All the well wishes and helpful advice are a testament to the type of folks on this forum. I only have one remaining tractor and she's in her work clothes but seeing some of your projects makes me want to dress her back up. Maybe someday I'll get that done and post pics of her pulling a restored McCormick 140 wagon.

good luck the rest of the way.  Can't wait to see her finished!

 

    Thank You , Your' very kind.

       I do hope you get yours up and running ,does not need to shine from paint , it can shine from your pride of it and its life character.

             I post detail in hopes if when I am gone perhaps someone can be helped or motivated by them . I also like the Questions & differing opinions because as time goes on and younger people try to find answers, perhaps they can get some prospective from it.

       Best to you ,

        Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tony

im wondering if the alloy they used to make your pistons does not have the same thermal expansion properties as originals. 

Would be interesting to take one of the old originals and one of the aftermarkets and heat them to 1,000° and see if the new ones expand more. 

The clearances IH used for their OEM parts may not be sufficient for these aftermarket pistons. 

Gotta be disappointing to see all those shavings in a new engine but I guess at least you found the problem and can move forward.  

Good luck 

Dennis

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  Yes ! We needed to know !  Closure , I think they call it.!

    For any of you doing a rebuild be aware Reliance appears to be inconsistent . Not just me saying that , Have had other very knowledgeable I.H. mechanics mention it .

      they say its a metal issue along with tolerances .  Just saying , I'm certainly no expert.

      65806 , Yes, it was like a kick in the gut at first , Now its just become another project to" GET-ER-DONE !"

        My wife keeps reminding me ," ITS A HOBBY"  I keep reminding myself , I don't need it to be ready in morning to cultivate ! ;)

               However! Now that I am retiredB), sort of , Have not had time to feel retired.:( I am on fixed income:o , cannot afford to pay for each project twice. :lol::lol::(     Maybe its my Guardian Angel's way of letting me know that there is to many in the shed already ,time to slow down.

         Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Too many."  What is this condition you speak of?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, tony in ca. said:

  Maybe its my Guardian Angel's way of letting me know that there is to many in the shed already ,time to slow down.

         Tony

I believe the Angel is gently whispering in your ear to contact Richard regarding delivery of the Gold 1456 to Kansas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the event the Goldie is out of the question, I would happily complete the 806 project as well at the International pick up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

being this is a known defect   is the MFG at all interested...?...blocking your calls.....

had the shop done assembly would they (MFG/SHOP)have warranteed ?

will they on the repair or....we know it is china^%$# ....SOL this time also...?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎7‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 3:58 PM, mmi said:

being this is a known defect   is the MFG at all interested...?...blocking your calls.....

had the shop done assembly would they (MFG/SHOP)have warranteed ?

will they on the repair or....we know it is china^%$# ....SOL this time also...?

  At this point I am not  making any waves .  I want answers first, then we'll see where that takes us.

     Will let you know as we progress .  Machine shop did all of machining and provided the kits & parts , but we usually build up the engine. It certainly would of been better had they done it all. Next go around they will. 

        Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tony I just caught up on this project....thanks for recording this for us to read, hope this assembly goes better.... Sure nice to look at though....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After talking with you at RPRU I had a lot of time to think on the way home.

It had a heck of a time with an 806 LP many years ago. This one needed a zipper on the head as it would cut an exhaust valve like an acetylene torch hit it. These were the best LP exhaust valves that IH made and it was also hard on the stellite seats. Grind one batch of feed and it would take a valve out. It was always the same cylinder but I cannot remember which one. The timing was right and I moved on before it was cured.

This tractor came up to a couple of old LP men before your issues here. They both agreed that cutting a valve is due to a lean mixture. LP is also a dry fuel with little to no lubrication in it like the old gas that contained lead. After forgetting about my 806 LP, your issues brought my troubles with one back to mind. I loved the pyrometer and years later, would have liked to put it on that LP to see what the temp was inside those cylinders. Would need to weld in a bung to do so.

You were down on power when you ran yours on the dyno. That could be due to a lean mixture. I haven't followed close enough to see if the regulator was rebuilt and the mixer/carb. I assume it was. The mixture is adjustable on the carb/mixer. Maybe just increasing the fuel will bring your power up and maybe stabilize cylinder temps.

I am not saying this is your issue. It is what I ran into and COULD be worth looking at when you get yours running again.  Good luck with the project and keep us up on what you find.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Diesel Doc , 

thanks for your thoughts ! Sure sounds plasuable . I will say this engine's valve train was very wore out . 

I did have regulator & carb , mixer rebuild by Welters Farm Supply , they are a MM supplier but they are experts on Ensign

lp equipment and have done four for me . At this point I rule out nothing and all will be taken into consideration

thanks for your thoughts , I'll keep you posted .

tony

 

At 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there such a thing as setting it up to run fat on fuel until it broken in this time around? I have never seen an lp setup first hand and have no idea what adjustments there are, but one would think like Doc said a little more opening on the fuel screw sure wouldn't hurt...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And Tony,

I'm so jealous of those beautiful quick hitches... god they look amazing! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/8/2017 at 7:11 PM, Diesel Doctor said:

After talking with you at RPRU I had a lot of time to think on the way home.

It had a heck of a time with an 806 LP many years ago. This one needed a zipper on the head as it would cut an exhaust valve like an acetylene torch hit it. These were the best LP exhaust valves that IH made and it was also hard on the stellite seats. Grind one batch of feed and it would take a valve out. It was always the same cylinder but I cannot remember which one. The timing was right and I moved on before it was cured.

This tractor came up to a couple of old LP men before your issues here. They both agreed that cutting a valve is due to a lean mixture. LP is also a dry fuel with little to no lubrication in it like the old gas that contained lead. After forgetting about my 806 LP, your issues brought my troubles with one back to mind. I loved the pyrometer and years later, would have liked to put it on that LP to see what the temp was inside those cylinders. Would need to weld in a bung to do so.

You were down on power when you ran yours on the dyno. That could be due to a lean mixture. I haven't followed close enough to see if the regulator was rebuilt and the mixer/carb. I assume it was. The mixture is adjustable on the carb/mixer. Maybe just increasing the fuel will bring your power up and maybe stabilize cylinder temps.

I am not saying this is your issue. It is what I ran into and COULD be worth looking at when you get yours running again.  Good luck with the project and keep us up on what you find.

It would be interesting to know what the individual exhaust/cylinder temps are and compare to a known unit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎7‎/‎18‎/‎2017 at 6:44 AM, Outgrew the offset said:

Is there such a thing as setting it up to run fat on fuel until it broken in this time around? I have never seen an lp setup first hand and have no idea what adjustments there are, but one would think like Doc said a little more opening on the fuel screw sure wouldn't hurt...

When running on propane either a too rich or too lean mixture will slow down the burn in the cylinders. On the trucks I worked on it was not unusual to see the exhaust manifolds and pipes start to glow red if the mixture was off and they sat and idled.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

    Update;

      Machine shop says crank out and being machined.

         Block sleeves are going to be bored here shortly & custom made pistons ordered.

        Subject to change depending on how much needs to be bored .

           Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now