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Michael Halsall

International 444 differences.

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Hi guys,

just a general question about the Inter. 444 Utility tractor.

How different was the 444 built at Louisville in the US to the 444 built in Britain (at Doncaster??) ?

I believe that there were technical differences between the two different versions.

The US built 444 used the C-153 engine as its gasoline option and the British one used the BC-144 engine as its petrol option.

Both used the British built BD-154 diesel engine.

I believe that there were differences in the front axle and some minor components too.

The British 444 was a straight replacement for the 434; the US 444 was an update on the 424

I believe that both versions were sold in Canada at one stage.

Regards from Michael Halsall Australia

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Hi guys,

just a general question about the Inter. 444 Utility tractor.

How different was the 444 built at Louisville in the US to the 444 built in Britain (at Doncaster??) ?

I believe that there were technical differences between the two different versions.

The US built 444 used the C-153 engine as its gasoline option and the British one used the BC-144 engine as its petrol option.

Both used the British built BD-154 diesel engine.

I believe that there were differences in the front axle and some minor components too.

The British 444 was a straight replacement for the 434; the US 444 was an update on the 424

I believe that both versions were sold in Canada at one stage.

Regards from Michael Halsall Australia

if those tractors had any hydraulic fittings on them, were they JIC (bull nose)........like i guess the US built ones, or British standard pipe

i know the doncaster built worldwide series and later models had JIC and UNOring fittings on them, but often wondered about the ones before (lol......i make hyd hoses for a living).........

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Hi guys,

just a general question about the Inter. 444 Utility tractor.

How different was the 444 built at Louisville in the US to the 444 built in Britain (at Doncaster??) ?

I believe that there were technical differences between the two different versions.

The US built 444 used the C-153 engine as its gasoline option and the British one used the BC-144 engine as its petrol option.

Both used the British built BD-154 diesel engine.

I believe that there were differences in the front axle and some minor components too.

The British 444 was a straight replacement for the 434; the US 444 was an update on the 424

I believe that both versions were sold in Canada at one stage.

Regards from Michael Halsall Australia

if those tractors had any hydraulic fittings on them, were they JIC (bull nose)........like i guess the US built ones, or British standard pipe

i know the doncaster built worldwide series and later models had JIC and UNOring fittings on them, but often wondered about the ones before (lol......i make hyd hoses for a living).........

In the UK the early ones had a single Dowty screw up hyd fitting for tipping trailers etc, later ones were fitted with a 1/2 inch quick release coupling, double acting ones were an optional extra

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The US 364 is the same as the UK 444.

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The British 444 was built in the 1977 period. The US 444 was built in the 1968 to 1971 period. As such the comparison is between the US 444 and the British 434. The only 434 components in the US 444 were the diesel engine, transmission, rear end and hydraulic 3 point hitch. The sheet metal, front bolster, instruments, gas engine, air cleaner, steering, rear fenders rear wheels were all different. The British 434 and 444 were sold in Canada. The only version of the US 444 sold in Canada was the 2444 industrial in small quantity. The 2424 was also sold in small quantity. I have only seen one 2444 and 2 of 2424 ever in southern Ontario.

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The US 364 is the same as the UK 444.

Thank you for that information.

I have been unable to find much out about the 364

I always thought it must have been an American equivalent of the British 354 (BC-144 / BD-144)

Regards from Michael H

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The British 444 was a straight replacement for the 434; the US 444 was an update on the 424

I believe that both versions were sold in Canada at one stage.

Regards from Michael Halsall Australia

if those tractors had any hydraulic fittings on them, were they JIC (bull nose)........like i guess the US built ones, or British standard pipe

i know the doncaster built worldwide series and later models had JIC and UNOring fittings on them, but often wondered about the ones before (lol......i make hyd hoses for a living).........

In the UK the early ones had a single Dowty screw up hyd fitting for tipping trailers etc, later ones were fitted with a 1/2 inch quick release coupling, double acting ones were an optional extra

I have a SERIAL NUMBER list for, I assume, the US built 444-

http://www.ytmag.com/cgi-bin/snlookup.cgi?...NT&md=I-444

Does anyone have a SERIAL NUMBER list for the UK built tractors?

Thanks again from Michael H

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These are the serial numbers for the 444 build in Bradford, UK:

444 Diesel for the UK

1972: 501 – 792

1973: 793 – 1240

1974: 1241 – 1836

1975: 1837 – 2407

1976: 2408 – 2544

444 Diesel for exports

1972: 501 - 1377

1973: 1378 - 3242

1974: 3243 - 5993

1975: 5994 - 10232

1976: 10233 - 14388

1977: 14389 - 19127

1978: 19128 - 19674

444 Gas for Canada

1972: 501 - 732

1973: 733 - 903

1974: 904 - 1015

444 Diesel for Canada *

1972: 501 - 804

1973: 805 - 1511

1974: 1512 - 2954

1975: 2955 - 4282

1976: 4283 - 5766 *

1977: 5767 - 6678 *

* for 1976 and 1977 the 364 Diesel for the USA seems to be included. That model is essentially the same as the 444.

444 4WD Diesel

1973: 501 - 514

1974: 515 - 516

In addition this, large numbers of 444 skidded units were shipped to several equipment manufacturers like Braud et Faucheux (Manitou), Overlander and RECO.

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My uncle bought the US 444 around 67,new.He didn't have it long before it was lost in a fire to the packhouse it was parked under.I'll never forget that day,I was only 5 or 6.We were having Sunday dinner at my grandma's house when one of the ladies in the kitchen looked out the window and the packhouse was ablaze.The 444 and my grandpa's 404 were parked under the sideshelter of the packhouse.I think it was my dad that got the 404 out,but my uncle couldn't get the 444 cranked.After the fire was out,my uncle looked at the tractor,the fuel shutoff knob was still out and apparently in the excitement he never pushed it in when he was trying to crank it.He got another to replace it and it was a good little tractor that is still in operation on a local small farm.

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444 Gas for Canada

1972: 501 - 732

1973: 733 - 903

1974: 904 - 1015

444 Diesel for Canada *

1972: 501 - 804

1973: 805 - 1511

1974: 1512 - 2954

1975: 2955 - 4282

1976: 4283 - 5766 *

1977: 5767 - 6678 *

* for 1976 and 1977 the 364 Diesel for the USA seems to be included. That model is essentially the same as the 444.

444 4WD Diesel

1973: 501 - 514

1974: 515 - 516

In addition this, large numbers of 444 skidded units were shipped to several equipment manufacturers like Braud et Faucheux (Manitou), Overlander and RECO.

Brilliant information!

The Canadian market was different to the US market: they had a lot more British imports, possibly because as a British Commonwealth country there was a favourable import / export relationship.

The 364's Serial Numbers started at 4283 and always looked strange to me: this appears to solve the mystery.

The 444 4WD Diesel is a real surprise.

I never knew it existed: there appears that only 16 were built, I wonder if any survive!

Regards from Michael Halsall

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The 444 4WD Diesel is a real surprise.

I never knew it existed: there appears that only 16 were built, I wonder if any survive!

I found the attached picture on the web in October 2003, but unfortunately I forgot, where exactly I found it. Otherwise I could probably ask the owner about the serial number and find out, if it is one of those 16 tractors or an after sales conversion.

By the way: From 1975 until 1982 - which means after the 16 tractors mentioned above - they shipped exactly 975 more 444 4WDs to Braud et Faucheux with the serial numbers 4018 to 4992. It looks as they switched directly from No. 516 to 4018 with leaving out No. 517 or 4017. Therefore I am not sure if No. 501 to 516 were probably shipped to Braud et Faucheux, too.

post-5724-1203637457_thumb.jpg

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444 Diesel for Canada *

1972: 501 - 804

1973: 805 - 1511

1974: 1512 - 2954

1975: 2955 - 4282

1976: 4283 - 5766 *

1977: 5767 - 6678 *

* for 1976 and 1977 the 364 Diesel for the USA seems to be included. That model is essentially the same as the 444.

*I always assumed that the 364 was built at Louisville using Britain components: it appears it was British built for the North American market.

444 4WD Diesel

1973: 501 - 514

1974: 515 - 516

*The 444 4WD Diesel would probably have used the British built ROADLESS TRACTION 4WD conversion similar to the one used on the B-450 etc.

Regards from Michael Halsall

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My uncle bought the US 444 around 67,new.He didn't have it long before it was lost in a fire to the packhouse it was parked under.I'll never forget that day,I was only 5 or 6.We were having Sunday dinner at my grandma's house when one of the ladies in the kitchen looked out the window and the packhouse was ablaze.The 444 and my grandpa's 404 were parked under the sideshelter of the packhouse.I think it was my dad that got the 404 out,but my uncle couldn't get the 444 cranked.After the fire was out,my uncle looked at the tractor,the fuel shutoff knob was still out and apparently in the excitement he never pushed it in when he was trying to crank it.He got another to replace it and it was a good little tractor that is still in operation on a local small farm.

Also the engine in the 444 had a unique crisp sound to it,unlike the 464 he has now which is a rougher running engine due to the fact it's a 3 cyl.

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The Canadian market was different to the US market: they had a lot more British imports, possibly because as a British Commonwealth country there was a favourable import / export relationship.

George2 likely knows this better than I, but Canada had British and German IH's that weren't sold in the US, or the UK version of a tractor (i.e. 674 with lights in grill) rather than the US one (lights on fenders). I think it had something to do with exchange rates USD to CDN $ to the pound etc. I would bet the 844-S was the biggest euro IH that was imported to Canada.

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From memory, I am sure that there was one 444 mfd brought to Canada by IH for evaluation purposes.

It had a loader mounted and was used some by various customers, but IH Canada rejected importing that version as it did not have power steering. I never saw this tractor, but was told about it by IH service people that had occasion to be involved with it.

Don

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From memory, I am sure that there was one 444 mfd brought to Canada by IH for evaluation purposes.

It had a loader mounted and was used some by various customers, but IH Canada rejected importing that version as it did not have power steering. I never saw this tractor, but was told about it by IH service people that had occasion to be involved with it.

Don

No power steering kills a 2wd loader....let alone a fwa!..

The 633 fwa (D179) would have been the small fwa IH in Canada, seen a couple wearing 2250 loaders. The next one would have been the 584(D206) fwa?

a 444 fwa would have given a slot in the under 40 PTO class

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I would bet the 844-S was the biggest euro IH that was imported to Canada.

Yes, they had the french/german 633 (D-179 engine with 49 PTO hp) and 844-S (D-268 engine with 73 PTO hp) - as 2WD or optional 4WD - from 1975 until about 1978, when the Doncaster made 84 series was introduced, which was available with optional 4WD.

In the world wide series from 1970 until 1977, Louisville as well as Bradford an Doncaster assembled tractors were offered in Canada, therefore:

- the Bradford made 444 (38.8 PTO hp) was offered

- the Louisville made 464 (45 PTO) was introduced in 1973, but only with the C-175 gas engine

- after the intruduction of the 464, the 454 (42 PTO hp) was continued, but only with the D-179 diesel engine

- the Doncaster made 51 PTO hp diesel tractors 474 (D-206 engine) and 475 (Perkins engine) were offered

- the Doncaster made 574 Hydro (56 PTO hp) was offered, but only with the D-239 diesel engine, since Doncaster didn't make tractors with gas engines larger than the 444

- the Louisville assembled 574 and 674 were offered with C-200 gas and D-239 diesel engines

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vee eight: You almost got it right. The 464, 574, and 674 Louisville tractors were offered in Canada only as gas tractors. All diesels came from Doncaster. Like you said the Doncaster 574 and 674 had rear fenders similar to Louisville product except there were no front lights on the fenders. The front lights were in the grille like the 454 and 464. Having said this, I will add that in 1976, there were a few Doncaster gas tractors imported into Canada. They were similar to the Doncaster diesels except that the engine must have been shipped from Louisville to Doncaster first. They had one obvious distinguishing feature. The air intake formed suction pipe from the filter to the carburettor was not the fully formed type like on the Louisville product. Instead it was composed of straight pieces of tube made up of welded segments for the curves in the pipe. I have seen about 4 of them here in southern Ontario. They were a mix of 454, 574 and 674 models. I think they were customer evaluation units. They all seemed to be centered in the area north of London. One of them ended up in the Chesley area and another was in the Seaforth area

There were no 475, or 575 models imported into Canada.

I also know that the very first 484, 584,684, 784, and Hydro 84 were also sold out of the old Medway International dealership on Dundas street in London. In about April 1978, I saw the Hydro 84 S/N 501 and 684 S/N 501, & 502 There was a 784 with S/N 502. They were all sold out of there. A few years back I saw the 684 S/N 502 at a farm sale. It was rough and I don't know where it went. I suspect these were the tractors used in the first advertizing brochures. I suspect the rest are somewhere near London. Speaking of the old Medway dealership on Dundas street, I think it is a ****shame the way they painted that nice IH brick building and made a flea market out of it. IH of Canada built it sometime in the 1950's and then sold it to Medway in the late 1970's.

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There were no 475, or 575 models imported into Canada.

Thank you for all the information. Indeed I only saw Canadian brochures for the 474 and suspected they sold its successor 475 there as well ... B)

Are you sure they ever built a 575? I never saw this model designation anywhere ... :unsure:

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vee eight: Now that you mention it, I am not as sure as when I wrote that. I will have to look up the sales brochures I got in England back in 1978. The 84 series were already out but there were some old 74 and 75 series brochures still available. Maybe Alex UK or some of the other UK members can confirm for sure.

I was always surprised at the first 84 series tractors being in London, Ontario. Or by any chance were there separate serial numbers for the European and world destination 84 series, and another separate set of serial numbers for those sent to North America?

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vee eight: Now that you mention it, I am not as sure as when I wrote that. I will have to look up the sales brochures I got in England back in 1978. The 84 series were already out but there were some old 74 and 75 series brochures still available. Maybe Alex UK or some of the other UK members can confirm for sure.

I was always surprised at the first 84 series tractors being in London, Ontario. Or by any chance were there separate serial numbers for the European and world destination 84 series, and another separate set of serial numbers for those sent to North America?

All the brochures I ever saw and even production statistics only mention a 475, but no 575.

Concerning 84 series, there were indeed two separate sets of serial numbers:

- one running from late 1977 until 1981 for outside the USA (I assume they meant outside North America)

- one running from 1978 until 1984 for the USA (I assume they meant North America)

The little, Bradford made 384 was an exception as it had three separate sets of serial numbers:

- UK (late 1977 until 1981)

- exports outside USA or North America (late 1977 until early 1982)

- USA or North America (1978 until 1981)

In Europe the 85 series with the optional XL cab started as early as 1981, while the first of these tractors didn't arrive in the USA before 1985 (then already under the CaseIH brand; only the first 385 may have arrived slightly earlier). What was it like in Canada?

If they got the 84 series until 1984 as well, they would have used the same serial number set as the USA ...

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vee eight:

The 385 arrived in early 1984 to replace the 383/483 which never showed up (still born). It looked just like the red 84 series. One thing though, the later all red 84 series were still arriving here as late as June 1985. The new black 85 series did not arrive until August - September 1985. They were the first to have the new cab. The serial numbers for all 84 series here are the same as the US ones. The only difference was in the early 84 series fenders. The Canadian ones all had the non headlight version crown version like the US 484 had. After 1981 they had the headlight mounted in the fender type here also as an option. Pretty well all of them were equipped that way.

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We had a brand new International 385 (all red, IH grill and emblems) bought new in the fall of 1985 with a 2200 loader, traded a 384 w/1850. It was likely one of the last IH's sold around here. Not sure if the serial number is on any paper work or not, only kept it two years.

The North American "SIMS" cab was the factory IH cab over here, I have a 1987 CIH buyers guide that refers to the XL cab as new "this year"

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Just to throw another equasion into the discussion, Mahandra of India built a model that was almost identical to the 444 into the late 1990's, possibly 2000. It even still had some of the IHC casting numbers and part numbers.

Harold H

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Just to throw another equasion into the discussion, Mahandra of India built a model that was almost identical to the 444 into the late 1990's, possibly 2000. It even still had some of the IHC casting numbers and part numbers.

Harold H

They still make tractors like that, but nowadays they use direct injection engines based on the old IH indirect injection design ...

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