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FarmerFixEmUp

Inside a Spragless TA

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I am replacing a TA in a 1086 for a neighbor and finally got it apart today. The clutch was totally shot and he said the TA shifted slow and the lube light flickered at idle in direct drive when hot. Turn the steering wheel and the lube light stayed on. It  has a spragless TA decal on it. He has only had the tractor for 3 years or so and we don't know how many hours are on it. I did pressure tests and it had 240 in ta 22 lube psi and 160 in direct and 12 lube psi. But when it was hot if you  turned the steering wheel to the stop the pressure in direct and TA would drop to 0 and stop moving. A new pump and a seal kit in the mcv didn't help much. So we're putting a Ag Parts Super HD TA unit. I've never had a spragless TA apart before so thought I'd look into it. Hope they take it as a core! 

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The selector spool is modified according to HyCapacity. I called them to tell them we were replacing a spragless unit and wanted to make sure I had everything back to original. We are also adding a supercharge eliminator kit. The modified spool is the top one. One of the sections looks narrower than the other. KIMG0511.thumb.JPG.880a1c8cea7fedaa43033b991f7fc94d.JPG

The carrier housing had pretty deep grooves wore into it, especially the center one. 

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The center seal ring on the shaft was broken. 

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They have the nuts welded to the bolts that hold the TA together for some reason. Hit them with an air impact and they came right off. 

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4 clutch discs in direct drive. 

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4 discs in TA. 

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Front view of shaft assembly. 

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Direct clutch pack. 

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TA clutch pack. They look a little burnt. 

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Looks like the problem with this TA is the shaft ring and the worn bushing in the carrier, which all TA's have. Seems like they can make a bulletproof Sprag or use the 2 clutch packs like this one has, but if the pressure can't get to the clutches because of the shaft and bushing wear what's the point?  

I've heard Allied makes a puller TA with a ball bearing in the front instead of the bushing but haven't ever seen one. Anyone ever used one of them? 

 

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I think your problem is a faulty mc  pump   doesn't have enough flow when oil gets hot. The spragless HyCap. TA was made for pulling . The  pictures of the TA unit don't look that bad.

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It is a new pump. After checking the pressures I replaced that and went through the MCV. The first thing I did.

2 hours ago, FarmerFixEmUp said:

I am replacing a TA in a 1086 for a neighbor and finally got it apart today. The clutch was totally shot and he said the TA shifted slow and the lube light flickered at idle in direct drive when hot. Turn the steering wheel and the lube light stayed on. It  has a spragless TA decal on it. He has only had the tractor for 3 years or so and we don't know how many hours are on it. I did pressure tests and it had 240 in ta 22 lube psi and 160 in direct and 12 lube psi. But when it was hot if you  turned the steering wheel to the stop the pressure in direct and TA would drop to 0 and stop moving. A NEW PUMP and a seal kit in the mcv didn't help much. So we're putting a Ag Parts Super HD TA unit. I've never had a spragless TA apart before so thought I'd look into it. Hope they take it as a core! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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New doesn't always mean good I have had new pumped bad. Was the pump new or reman.?

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It was new. 

 

It's not eliminating it, just rerouting it. I've done lots of these. 

 

 

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Dad had a Hy Capacity spragless TA in his 856 Custom. One of the first in our area. Hy Capacity came out to our farm and talked with Dad a few times about how the TA was performing.  Dad's brother installed the TA at Custer Implement in Tama.  That tractor pulled hard and never had any trouble. Wore out a clutch years later, but that TA had 10,000 hours on it when we sold the 856. 😕

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I wonder if this one has been rebuilt before since it has holes in the nuts to hold it together for cotter pins or roll pins and it they were  also welded on. 

I asked the owners about getting this one fixed but they want a reman conventional TA. They at first wanted to put in a straight shaft but I got them to at least put another TA in it. 

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Yep sounds like an internal leak in ta unit. Glad you talked them into keeping the TA, a good TA really makes these red tractors shine.. let me know how you like the super HD ta, I've been installing just the HD ones from Ag parts.

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Lyle I have put an allied t/a with front support bearing in a puller. It looks to me like that's the answer. Give them a call and visit with them. Really good people that will answer any questions you have about there T/a

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The oil flow to the TA should be 5 gpm whether the steering is at rest or held against either the left or right stop. When at rest this 5 gpm goes to the steering hand pump and returns through the top of the TA housing back into the MCV. When the flow is cut off by holding the steering against the stops the steering relief valve opens to allow the oil to flow into the same circuit as the oil returning from the steering. If the pump is working correctly and there are no other leaks in that part of the system there should be no change in the DD and TA pressures when the steering is against the stops.

If someone has turned in the screw in the bottom end of the steering relief valve to raise the steering pressure it may not be able to open enough to maintain the proper flow.

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Came across an Allied T/A a couple months ago on a 1486.  Neat idea, but you have to install a modified PTO gear when you install an Allied T/A.  And I think it's a tight fit, but it works.

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Travis

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