pirlbeck

Magnum TCV shuttle spool ID help needed.

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I am installing a Ez-shift kit on my very early SN (JJA0002383) 7120 and from what I have read on this site I think it may be a good idea to put the updated 94777C5 shuttle spool in it. The problem is that Case-IH wants $792.00 for this part and I am not wild about spending that kind of money. I have found a salvage yard that shows to have a number of these 94777C5 shuttle valves in stock, but after talking to them they are not sure that what they have are the latest improved design. I have a TSB # NTR SB 086 90 dated 11-20-1990 that talks about the release of this new shuttle spool, but it gives no information on what is different and how you identify the late spool vs. the early spool. Anyone out there been around these enough to know how to tell the difference between the 3 different part numbers? The very early number was 1994569C1 then it went to a 94777C4 which is the one that the TSB references as subbing up to 94777C5.
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
Thanks!

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We put the easy shift on our 7140. We bought the kit new from CNH. Well worth it imo. The plastic "gear" in the tcv seems to wear with higher hours and sometimes they start to shift harder than they used to. 

I would only buy one that is on a running tractor so it can be tested before it's removed

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4 minutes ago, bitty said:

We put the easy shift on our 7140. We bought the kit new from CNH. Well worth it imo. The plastic "gear" in the tcv seems to wear with higher hours and sometimes they start to shift harder than they used to. 

I would only buy one that is on a running tractor so it can be tested before it's removed

I am installing the OEM easy shift kit in my tcv. Also, I am replacing the plastic shift cam that the detent rollers run on with a new one.

I am wanting help in identifying  the shuttle spool assy. that goes in the front side of the tcv housing, as I would like to buy this spool assy. used and need to make sure it is the updated one. 

Thanks!

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25 minutes ago, pirlbeck said:

I am installing the OEM easy shift kit in my tcv. Also, I am replacing the plastic shift cam that the detent rollers run on with a new one.

I am wanting help in identifying  the shuttle spool assy. that goes in the front side of the tcv housing, as I would like to buy this spool assy. used and need to make sure it is the updated one. 

Thanks!

Ok. I am not sure how to tell. The one plate on ours was replaced by a new one ( different oil galleys?) And another one we had to drill a hole in for an oil passage. I am assuming that yours would be the same. Did the plastic gear come in the kit? That is all I can recall about ours as I was just summoned to drill the hole

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5 minutes ago, bitty said:

Ok. I am not sure how to tell. The one plate on ours was replaced by a new one ( different oil galleys?) And another one we had to drill a hole in for an oil passage. I am assuming that yours would be the same. Did the plastic gear come in the kit? That is all I can recall about ours as I was just summoned to drill the hole

Yes, this kit came with a  new valve mounting plate, which is the first plate to go on the speed housing. It is the one that the jumper pipes/tubes go into. I had to drill 2 holes in another plate and drill a hole in the valve body and install a check ball and screen. My Bridgeport mill with DRO sure came in handy to accurately drill these holes in the proper location as shown in the prints that came with the kit.The installation procedure is different and more steps are involved for the 2 speed reverse tractors.

I am also doing the "increased clamping force" update, so I had to drill out 2 holes in the spacer plate and get 2 longer allen head cap screws. The new valve mounting plate already had the holes drilled and tapped for these longer bolts, so that was already done.

I had to purchase the plastic cam separately as it is not in the easy shift kit.

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Ours is 4 speed reverse

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Pat, this is going from memory from 20 years ago or so. IIRC, the improved spool had the lands that fit to the bore about twice as wide or so as compared to the old spool. I remember when you put the 2 side-by-side it was rather noticeable. I think the idea was that the wider spool lands prevented excessive leakage with the spool-to-bore fit of the detent spool.

Also, IIRC, the older spools did NOT have the slot on the one end to help the tech know which end was which on the spool. The slot(think large flat-blade screwdriver slot) was to face the spring/cap side of the valve. The spool could be installed either way into the valve but it only worked properly in one direction.

Hope this helps and good luck!!

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7 hours ago, SDman said:

Pat, this is going from memory from 20 years ago or so. IIRC, the improved spool had the lands that fit to the bore about twice as wide or so as compared to the old spool. I remember when you put the 2 side-by-side it was rather noticeable. I think the idea was that the wider spool lands prevented excessive leakage with the spool-to-bore fit of the detent spool.

Also, IIRC, the older spools did NOT have the slot on the one end to help the tech know which end was which on the spool. The slot(think large flat-blade screwdriver slot) was to face the spring/cap side of the valve. The spool could be installed either way into the valve but it only worked properly in one direction.

Hope this helps and good luck!!

SDman,

Thanks a lot, that will give me something to have the guys at the salvage yards look for. One place shows to have 5 of them, so maybe they can compare the 5 now that we have some idea of what they are looking for.

I saw the reference to the slots going to the spring end on the TSB and wondered if that was something new with the latest valve.

Thanks again!

 

 

 

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Memory is saying that the end of the new spool stained blue but I could be wrong.

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5 hours ago, pirlbeck said:

SDman,

Thanks a lot, that will give me something to have the guys at the salvage yards look for. One place shows to have 5 of them, so maybe they can compare the 5 now that we have some idea of what they are looking for.

I saw the reference to the slots going to the spring end on the TSB and wondered if that was something new with the latest valve.

Thanks again!

 

 

 

One operational characteristic will change with the new style shuttle spool, when shifting from neutral into gear it will skip 1st and go straight to second gear. 

4 hours ago, Big Steve said:

Memory is saying that the end of the new spool stained blue but I could be wrong.

I don't remember a blue stain but the slot was always there. 

 

I also have no idea where CNH came up with $792.00 for that little spool with a handful of parts inside.  SMH

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I thought the "starting out in 2nd gear, not in first" characteristic happened only when the EZ-shift kit was installed-whether field-installed or factory installed. I don't ever remember a Magnum starting out in 2nd gear until the late 7100s when all the hype around the EZ-shift came out. We used to put the updated shuttle spool in several older tractors for shifting improvements(slow shifts, missed shifts when shifting gears, etc)-I don't ever remember them starting out in second gear when shifted from neutral.

Pat, did you get this kit just recently through parts? The reason I ask is that I remember a few years ago my parts manager showing me a letter from CNH showing that they only had 20-25 EZ-shift  kits in their parts system anymore, and the letter said that when they were gone CaseIH would not replenish them. So if anyone wants to install this into an earlier 7100 series, they better step up to the plate before they are all gone.

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OK, I have a little more info on this deal.

I pulled the shuttle spool out of my valve this morning (something I should of done right away) and it has the slot in one end AND the slotted end is painted/dyed red. I am not sure what this means though as I find no documentation on the color meaning something.

I also took a trip to my Worthington Ag Parts store. They have 3 Magnum TCV's in the bin and we looked at the shuttle spools in all there. One had no slots on either end and 2 had slots on one end. The land width and hole configuration looked the same on all of them. I did not remove the inner spool, so I can't say if something is different internally. None of them had any visible coloring on either end. So as of now I am not sure how to tell what the updated one would look like. At least for now I am going to leave my original spool in the valve. I am hoping the red color means something. One other thing we did notice is that one of the valves had a red spring between the plug and spool. Mine and the other 2 at the salvage yard were not colored.

At the bottom of page 1 of the 26 page TSB NTR SB 016 96  titled "Troubleshooting the Magnum Transmission Valve" it talks about the skip 1st forward and 1st and 3rd reverse. Here is what it says.

" Tractors equipped with EZ shift kits skip 1st forward and 1st and 3rd reverse when shifted into gear from park. This feature allows the operator to skip the slower and often unused 1st speed when starting out. The 1st and 3rd speed gears will be available when down shifting. This characteristic occurs because the detent spool will only receive oil pressure after the L,M,H clutch has been filled (range blocker spool position controls supply to the detent spool, L,M,H and master clutch) This cannot be changed"

 

SDman, my kit came from the Depot obsolete parts warehouse. This was a couple of years ago and I think it was still available from Case-IH, but I could save some money going to the Depot. 

Thanks to everyone for the help!!

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6 hours ago, SDman said:

I thought the "starting out in 2nd gear, not in first" characteristic happened only when the EZ-shift kit was installed-whether field-installed or factory installed. I don't ever remember a Magnum starting out in 2nd gear until the late 7100s when all the hype around the EZ-shift came out. We used to put the updated shuttle spool in several older tractors for shifting improvements(slow shifts, missed shifts when shifting gears, etc)-I don't ever remember them starting out in second gear when shifted from neutral.

Pat, did you get this kit just recently through parts? The reason I ask is that I remember a few years ago my parts manager showing me a letter from CNH showing that they only had 20-25 EZ-shift  kits in their parts system anymore, and the letter said that when they were gone CaseIH would not replenish them. So if anyone wants to install this into an earlier 7100 series, they better step up to the plate before they are all gone.

We had a little trouble locating a kit for the 7140 this summer. It came from South Dakota iirc , dealer had new old stock

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The last kit I put in was probably 8-10 years ago anymore. The cardboard for the kit had some deterioration as well as having an old CaseIH decal so I'm sure it was many years old.

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I got the valve back together and installed yesterday and so far everything looks good. It sure does pull out of park a LOT easier, which was my main complaint.

The regulated pressure is running right around 280 PSI so I may bump that up a little as this thing is turned up some. Also the MC clutch pressure is a little low (140-145) in gears 1-6. In the higher gears it is running at the regulated pressure like it should be. I am hoping bumping the regulated pressure up a little may increase that some too, if not I may have to add shims to the regulator spool springs for it.

Thanks to everyone for the help!

Pat

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What is pressure suppose to be in 1-6, I was thinking around 150psi?

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Pat, to be honest with you I don't know if I have ever seen the 150psi specification in a Magnum in the 25 years I've worked on them. They were 140-145 psi when they were new; 10,000 hours later they were still at 140-145psi. The pressure is determined by a pressure reducing valve in the TCV, regardless of regulated pressure setting.

My tractors around here never pulled hard in the low range(1-6) gears so I've never really tried much to increase that pressure. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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SDman,

Yea, I kind of debated if I should mess with the pressures at all. But it is hard to find time to work on my own stuff, so when I do have it in the shop I try to get it 100% . I thought I would see if any of the local dealers even stock the shims it takes for the pressure reducing valve and then decide. 

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I would agree with SDman, I don't think I have ever seen one make more than 145ish. 

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