Sign in to follow this  
FarmerFixEmUp

IH service bulletin S-5047

Recommended Posts

Anyone have a copy of Bulletin S-5047? It deals with the supercharge line on the 86 series.  Been working on an early 1086 (open center hydraulics) with what I believe is a spragless ta (customer has only owned it 2 or 3 years and doesn't know the service history of it) and a lube light flickering at idle. There's a decal on the tractor that say equipped with spragless TA, but who knows how long ago that was. Replaced the mcv pump which was scored inside and had pieces missing in the seals behind the gear plate and went through the mcv  valve and it's a lot better, but when hot at engine idle and Steering to the stops the light comes on and the tractor totally stops moving. With the TA back or ahead. Above 1300 rpm or so it works fine.  I disconnected the supply lines to the brake valve, clutch booster, and the line to the diff lock valve. (No hydraulic seat) Still does it. I finally disconnected the lube line to the brakes and it stops doing it until I put the flow rater on the remote and got the oil hot. I'm thinking it needs a TA but we're trying to avoid that since he wants it back asap. Oh by the way, the clutch slips too!:wacko:Which is why I'm trying to fix this hydraulic issue before splitting it. 

According to Allied they run the brake lube off the hitch pump with the superccharge elimination kit they offer. Allows another 2 to 3 gallons of oil for the mcv pump. I'm not sure that is enough to cover this up. Having it disconnected to the brake lube fittings now and still having the light come on at idle makes me skeptical. It would probably work as is, but if he is moving in a small space at low idle like backing a wagon it may just stop moving. That's not very safe. 

59b0c0350bc47_1086decal.JPG.451e4d66114f74d5f28d7887d503de80.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete23    0

I don't know that the bulletin you refer to would help you.  Quick easy way to tell if you have a spragless TA is to put TA lever in middle positon. It will act just like a hand clutch and tractor will stop even if tractor is capable of pulling a heavy load on the low side.  I installed only one of them against my better judgement but customer insisted.  It worked all right for him but he is or I should say  was, a different story.  I ran across that tractor about ten years ago and TA was still working, miserable as ever with that neutral in middle.  

I would also be eager to know what the regulated pressure is when that TA lever is in middle positon, in TA, in DD and steering to stops.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does stop with the lever in the center. I've only ever put one in too many years ago in a 1566  with an intercooler running about 300 HP! He also wanted a 12 pad clutch. I have pressure gauges at the bottom below the steering safety valve and at the port where the dump valve goes.  There is a spool that goes in there to check the pressure at the TA. That is where I am losing the pressure, not at the bottom gauge. That stays at about 240 with the  steering at the stops. Not sure about the middle position.  

I talked to HyCapacity yesterday and asked what they do to the MCV when using a spragless TA. He said they modify the TA selector spool. Allied has a switch and valve of some type that goes on the MCV.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Maynard    0

Here's S-5047

Is the MCV modified with a different spool that eliminates feathering during shifts? Has a pressure switch attached to the front of  the MCV?

S-5047 Supercharge.1.png

S-5047 Supercharge.2.png

S-5047 Supercharge.3.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I didn't have the selector spool out so I don't know if it's modified in some way, but that's what the tech at Hy capacity said they do for a spragless TA. There is no switch. I will try to diisconnect the supercharge line and dump it into the hydraulic fill tube and see if it helps. Thanks for the bulletin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete23    0

I know nothing about the modification referred to.  Interesting. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Maynard    0
5 hours ago, FarmerFixEmUp said:

I didn't have the selector spool out so I don't know if it's modified in some way, but that's what the tech at Hy capacity said they do for a spragless TA. There is no switch. I will try to diisconnect the supercharge line and dump it into the hydraulic fill tube and see if it helps. Thanks for the bulletin.

I should have said sender instead of switch.  IIRC the sender was plumbed in to read actual lube pressure directly in the TA lube circuit. The modifications were not reversible so MCV replacement would have been necessary to undo the changes. The  information I received said the purpose was to provide quicker shifts without allowing feathering of the TA. It was having some low lube pressure at idle issues, pump replacement and a cleanup took care of that. That MCV has not been available for several years.

I have some pictures of it somewhere at home. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pete, The tractor will stop moving if you get the TA lever in the right position. The regulated and pressure at the dump valve location is 240 unless you get the lever between TA and direct it will drop to 40 but the regulated pressure stays at 240. 

I disconnected the supercharge line and connected a hose to it and dumped it into the fill tube, it's some better, but if you move one of the remote levers it will stop like before at idle. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete23    0

A couple of things are puzzling me here.  If regulated pressure remains constant when steering to stops, the tractor should  not stop moving.  Also, regulated pressure should change about 20 psi when TA lever is in middle position to show that the regulating pressure valve is moving in it's bore.  IH referred to that as establishing the personality of the regulator valve.  Then, about the other gauge.  You say you have it plumbed into the normal dump valve location. Has the dump valve been eliminated or what. Not familiar with that. The normal spot to check lube pressure is where the lube pressure sender is located.  I know HY   Capacity has some modifications they do also with a special tool or adaptor to test mcv's but I never had anything to do with that. I always just went by IH's test methods all the years. Sorry.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is the tool I have. It checks the actual pressure at the TA itself, not system pressure. They should be the same, but sometimes the TA doesn't get the same pressure as the regulated pressure.  Mine is actually from Allled but it's the same thing. 

http://www.agpartsltd.com/shopping/productDetails.aspx?i=1052073

Here's the instruction sheet. It's a little dirty but hope it can be read. 

Scan_20170907.png.f8d69a5ea7e9a8748fedbbd387d621b2.png

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this