Mountain Heritage

710 or 720 IH plow questions

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Guy has a 710 or 720 plow for sale - isn't sure of model?  Thinking about going to look at it sometime - thoughts on there models?  It's a 4 furrow. Price is right if it is in decent condition.  I am very sure it will need new wear parts, couldn't imagine buying a plow and not having to replace wear parts - who could be that lucky!

Are they a heavy enough plow for sod or corn stalks?  Anyone find they plug up much?  Was told the Super Chief bottoms were best because the wear parts are cheap to replace??

Appreciate any input.

Thanks

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pt756    0

we had a 710 and when plowing corn stalks under did not go well would have to remove coulters. then chopping heads came along would probably be okay now,

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George 2    0

A 16 inch frame 720 will plug up lots in corn stalks. Voice of experience and I no longer own this plow. The 18 inch frame 720 will plug occasionally but is tolerable. Your 3688 should have no trouble with a 4 furrow 18 inch bottom auto reset 720 plow. Plow is designed for Super Chief bottoms. The European bottoms are hard to keep in the ground as they pull harder and the springs in the auto reset mechanism are not really strong enough to handle the Euro bottoms.

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rcb    0

I've heard good on the 710 and 720 but the 720 is preferred. Auto reset is the way to go of course. All the 720s out by me seem to be 6 bottom. I've been looking for a 4 and am still looking. However our needs are much smaller so my opinion is based on our small scale.

 

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So just curious, of the decals and serial plate is off plow, how do you tell the 710 from 720?  Is there anything different that is noticeable?

i am just hoping the plow isn't bent?

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CDN 400    0

A 720 16" bottom will not plug in cornstalks as long as you have decent coulters and they are set correctly. I have been pulling 5-16's for years and it has euro bottoms on it as well. Last fall I acquired a 735 vari width with super chief bottoms on it and against my better judgement I did half my plowing with it. This spring after riding over the ground it plowed I was ready to cut it up into small pieces and send it to China. Half of our land is hard enough it doesn't crumble when it leaves the mouldboard so the good old super chiefs leave it standing straight up no matter how fast or slow you go. The euro's lays it over flat and smooth. And yes the euro bottoms pull easier I know because I have both and even the amish manufacturers are using euro bottoms because the pull easier and do a smoother job. I will never use super chiefs again.

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SMOKER 1    0

I have plowed several thousand acres of corn stalks with a 720 and the only time it plugged was where the combine stopped and cleaned out. This was with a 6/16. Coulter have to be good and set correctly. 

Jerry

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George 2    0
5 hours ago, CDN 400 said:

A 720 16" bottom will not plug in cornstalks as long as you have decent coulters and they are set correctly. I have been pulling 5-16's for years and it has euro bottoms on it as well. Last fall I acquired a 735 vari width with super chief bottoms on it and against my better judgement I did half my plowing with it. This spring after riding over the ground it plowed I was ready to cut it up into small pieces and send it to China. Half of our land is hard enough it doesn't crumble when it leaves the mouldboard so the good old super chiefs leave it standing straight up no matter how fast or slow you go. The euro's lays it over flat and smooth. And yes the euro bottoms pull easier I know because I have both and even the amish manufacturers are using euro bottoms because the pull easier and do a smoother job. I will never use super chiefs again.

Your experience is different from mine in corn that has not had the stalks chopped. And by the way that is why CIH stopped selling the 7500 with the Euro bottoms after 1997. From then until 2004 they were only available with Super Chief bottoms. In hard packed clay they will not penetrate and push the springs up and ride on top of the ground. Go ask Artsway in Listowel if they sell the 7501 with Euro bottoms and you will hear the same story. In soft or sandy soil the Euro bottoms work OK but in hard packed clay they do not (like around Glencoe where CIH tested them back in 1991 -1992). I knew the Project engineer back then and that is why the Hamilton boys selected Glencoe and a location in NW Ohio to test them in heavy clay. 

And by the way my 720 had new CIH coulters put on it just a couple of years before I got rid of it. I found that that 20 years ago the 720 5x16 worked fine in 125 bu cornstalks on 36 inch rows. Fast forward to today in 190 Bu Pioneer 9675 AMXT corn on 30 inch rows, they plug so often that I got fed up with it and bought a late model 735 plow. With it at 16 inch cut, it also plugs up far too much. Then adjust to 18 inch cut and just the occasional plugging. Set it to 20 inches and absolutely ZERO plugging. So I run it at 18 inches. And the 735 has one year old colter blades, and brand new Superchief bottoms and shins. And the 18 inch cut leaves a rougher soil surface and you need the duals on in spring to work the land if you value your back side. 

 

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IH Forever    0

What's a plow?😁 I can't think of anyone who has used one for 20+ years except for a plow day.

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SMOKER 1    0

I plow a couple hundred acres of corn stalks every year not chopped and not disked for the local pickle growers. Run CIH moldboards 7 to 8 inches deep and never plug. I run 20 inch cutters within an inch of the plow depth. Also run plastic cover boards, if that makes a difference. No issues what so ever!!!  My ground maybe different than yours but it works for me.

as for not plowing anymore, we may have to revisit that thinking to control the roundup resistant weeds.  Have plowed a bit for beans the last couple years and there is no marestail or water hemp in those fields.  It has also slowed the burr cucumber.

jerry

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10 minutes ago, IH Forever said:

What's a plow?😁 I can't think of anyone who has used one for 20+ years except for a plow day.

That's them there funny looking things us poor farmers tow around to cut trenches in our fields in hopes of making it black before freeze up!  OR is it some of us who aren't sold on vertical tillage yet?  :o :ph34r: 

 

7 hours ago, rcb said:

I've heard good on the 710 and 720 but the 720 is preferred. Auto reset is the way to go of course. All the 720s out by me seem to be 6 bottom. I've been looking for a 4 and am still looking. However our needs are much smaller so my opinion is based on our small scale.

 

I too am operating on a small scale, still trying to consistanly have 100 - 120 acres each year.  I don't have very much clay land so far, mostly sandy loam and one 20 acre chunk that is almost a beach of white sand.  But like George said, with the corn getting higher in yields over the years and stalks starting out at 8 and 9 feet tall before the combine head beats them up - need something that can handle them pretty good.  Watched the neighbor plow two years ago with a smaller Hesston 2wd tractor and a 3pth Kevernland plow.  Still shaking my head how well he did.  The field was a MESS with stalks from a JD combine - those damn things have to do the crappiest job of chewing up the stalks after going through the snap rolls, you couldn't pay me to own one!  Shockingly though, I'd say he made 80% of the stalks in that field dissappear.  How, I don't know, but he did.  They weren't chopped before he started and the big green box on wheels didn't have a special head with chopper knives on it either.  Its not real heavy soil, so that likely helped, but there was still a lot of trash there.  Rode a few rounds with my Uncle in his green machine with a new Salford plow in corn field (mine actually, no chopping of the stalks either) What a crappy job it did!  At least I thought it was crappy for such a big, new, fancy, boat anchor of a plow.  I am sure you could plow 2 feet deep with it, but I found it didn't roll the ground over nice and smooth like his Kevernland plow does.  And this man screws around with the settings a lot to make it right.  My pea brain didn't see how it was worth as much as he had to pay for it?  I think he should have bought another Kevernland for what he does.

Anyone ever run into issues with the linkage to the tail wheels on the 710 or 720 plows?  Are they beefy enough to stand up to many years of wear and tear?  Have to do a fair bit of road running to get to my fields, so is there bushings that need to be replaced often or anything?  Or is it pretty much just maintain the wheel bearings properly and have a good tire on it?  Did they all come with a land wheel or was that an option?

 

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SMOKER 1    0
1 minute ago, Mountain Heritage said:

That's them there funny looking things us poor farmers tow around to cut trenches in our fields in hopes of making it black before freeze up!  OR is it some of us who aren't sold on vertical tillage yet?  :o :ph34r: 

 

I too am operating on a small scale, still trying to consistanly have 100 - 120 acres each year.  I don't have very much clay land so far, mostly sandy loam and one 20 acre chunk that is almost a beach of white sand.  But like George said, with the corn getting higher in yields over the years and stalks starting out at 8 and 9 feet tall before the combine head beats them up - need something that can handle them pretty good.  Watched the neighbor plow two years ago with a smaller Hesston 2wd tractor and a 3pth Kevernland plow.  Still shaking my head how well he did.  The field was a MESS with stalks from a JD combine - those damn things have to do the crappiest job of chewing up the stalks after going through the snap rolls, you couldn't pay me to own one!  Shockingly though, I'd say he made 80% of the stalks in that field dissappear.  How, I don't know, but he did.  They weren't chopped before he started and the big green box on wheels didn't have a special head with chopper knives on it either.  Its not real heavy soil, so that likely helped, but there was still a lot of trash there.  Rode a few rounds with my Uncle in his green machine with a new Salford plow in corn field (mine actually, no chopping of the stalks either) What a crappy job it did!  At least I thought it was crappy for such a big, new, fancy, boat anchor of a plow.  I am sure you could plow 2 feet deep with it, but I found it didn't roll the ground over nice and smooth like his Kevernland plow does.  And this man screws around with the settings a lot to make it right.  My pea brain didn't see how it was worth as much as he had to pay for it?  I think he should have bought another Kevernland for what he does.

Anyone ever run into issues with the linkage to the tail wheels on the 710 or 720 plows?  Are they beefy enough to stand up to many years of wear and tear?  Have to do a fair bit of road running to get to my fields, so is there bushings that need to be replaced often or anything?  Or is it pretty much just maintain the wheel bearings properly and have a good tire on it?  Did they all come with a land wheel or was that an option?

 

On ones that have been abused it is a problem. On a couple of mine that have always been stored inside and kept greased, are like new. You want a good tail wheel tire when roading. Nothing worse than a tail wheel flat on the highway. I thing the depth wheel was an option but have never seen a plow without one. Much easier to adjust depth. 

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That's what I am sort of worried about this plow - haven't seen it yet, but am thinking it might have been abused at one time?  The farmer (who I found on line last fall) that is selling it says he can never seem to get it to work right.  He said it won't work in heavy ground or sod?  Its either the front two or back two that will go in the ground, but never all four at once.  So either its bent, or the wear parts are WORN out?  There should be no reason the plow won't go into the ground if set right and it has at least some point left to the share??  I will have to see when I go?  He is asking $700.00 for it, so I like the price!!  I certainly would like to have a land wheel on it to help in getting the depth more consistent through out the field.   

 

So you are saying you wouldn't trade your's for another model then?? 

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Bdse25    0

I picked up a 710 with 5-16 super chiefs on it and new moldboards for 250 last summer. No auto resets though. There's a lot of plows stuck in fencerows guys will just about give away. Ask your neighbors and see what's laying around 

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George 2    0
3 hours ago, Mountain Heritage said:

That's them there funny looking things us poor farmers tow around to cut trenches in our fields in hopes of making it black before freeze up!  OR is it some of us who aren't sold on vertical tillage yet?  :o :ph34r: 

 

I too am operating on a small scale, still trying to consistanly have 100 - 120 acres each year.  I don't have very much clay land so far, mostly sandy loam and one 20 acre chunk that is almost a beach of white sand.  But like George said, with the corn getting higher in yields over the years and stalks starting out at 8 and 9 feet tall before the combine head beats them up - need something that can handle them pretty good.  Watched the neighbor plow two years ago with a smaller Hesston 2wd tractor and a 3pth Kevernland plow.  Still shaking my head how well he did.  The field was a MESS with stalks from a JD combine - those damn things have to do the crappiest job of chewing up the stalks after going through the snap rolls, you couldn't pay me to own one!  Shockingly though, I'd say he made 80% of the stalks in that field dissappear.  How, I don't know, but he did.  They weren't chopped before he started and the big green box on wheels didn't have a special head with chopper knives on it either.  Its not real heavy soil, so that likely helped, but there was still a lot of trash there.  Rode a few rounds with my Uncle in his green machine with a new Salford plow in corn field (mine actually, no chopping of the stalks either) What a crappy job it did!  At least I thought it was crappy for such a big, new, fancy, boat anchor of a plow.  I am sure you could plow 2 feet deep with it, but I found it didn't roll the ground over nice and smooth like his Kevernland plow does.  And this man screws around with the settings a lot to make it right.  My pea brain didn't see how it was worth as much as he had to pay for it?  I think he should have bought another Kevernland for what he does.

Anyone ever run into issues with the linkage to the tail wheels on the 710 or 720 plows?  Are they beefy enough to stand up to many years of wear and tear?  Have to do a fair bit of road running to get to my fields, so is there bushings that need to be replaced often or anything?  Or is it pretty much just maintain the wheel bearings properly and have a good tire on it?  Did they all come with a land wheel or was that an option?

 

I didn't know your land was mostly sandy loam with 20 acres of blow sand. Now that I know, I am going to try point you in a different direction. Your problem with plowing and tillage is that it just dries the land out such that summer drought will result in low yields. I went through that with a sand farm I once owned.  Since then there is a guy down the road I have learned a lot from. He also has a sand farm across the road from where I once lived. He has gone no till and it works well for him. In clay, you can't no till as the soil stays too cold in the spring. However, no tilling keeps the soil moisture intact and adequate for later in the season. So what I would do is find an old stalk chopper and chop the stalks in the fall. Then in the spring with the fluted disks on the planter or grain drill just no till into it. Or buy a no till drill and a set of fluted disks for your corn planter. No till drills are becoming cheap around western Ontario now as most have gone to air drills. The beauty to doing it this way is that the sand will warm up soon enough to help germination once the no till drill opens up the seed trenches. That way you save the cost of plowing and the large yield reductions when using conventional tillage of sandy soil in the spring. My neighbor gets away without stalk chopping his corn in the rotation. The winter snow usually breaks the stalks down pretty well and if you use something like a CIH 5400 mulch till drill with a Bluejet coulter cart, the fluted coulter disks will cut right through the corn stalks that are left. I know this to be true because I have done it myself on a sand farm I once rented about 10 years ago on a one year rental. For me this was minimum cost planting and I had a good crop of soybeans on that sand that year. The other thing with no tilling sandy loam, is that over a few years you build up a nice mulch of organic matter on the surface. With Roundup ready corn and soybeans this whole scheme is a successful method if you have sandy land.   No till will only work on clay land here if you plant about 2 -3 weeks late and the soil has already warmed up. However this can backfire if you have a dry spring like we had a year ago. I no tilled a clay farm and got good seed placement down into moisture. Even so I got 38 bu beans after experiencing a bad summer drought. The beans I put in early with conventional tillage gave me 45 bu as a comparison. I hope this helps you make your mind up. The cardinal rule is however NEVER PLOW SANDY LAND unless you are willing to take large yield reductions in summer droughts.       

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IH Forever    0
8 hours ago, George 2 said:

 No till will only work on clay land here if you plant about 2 -3 weeks late and the soil has already warmed up. However this can backfire if you have a dry spring like we had a year ago. I no tilled a clay farm and got good seed placement down into moisture. Even so I got 38 bu beans after experiencing a bad summer drought. The beans I put in early with conventional tillage gave me 45 bu as a comparison.

How can you contribute the yield difference to no-till? Wouldn't the sandy soil yield less in a drought due to moisture availability?

I agree about maybe not plowing sandy loam. Sandy ground plowed around here would have terrible wind erosion in the winter.

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George 2    0

Yes sandy soil will yield less due to moisture not being available. What I am saying is with having to delay the planting date by 2 - 3 weeks in a drought year, there is less moisture left in the topsoil. This is the probable cause of reduced yield. If I had no tilled at normal planting time the cold soil would have resulted in poor emergence in clay land. 

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We don't plow any more but in the 60's to 80's we used 720 plows , dad had 5-16, I ran 5-18 then went to 6-18 plow. When set right a 720 will not plug up in corn stalks, I think in all of those yeas maybe less than 10 times.. The old 550 plows would do that in a few rounds every day and the JD plows even more. Why  do you think JD farmers in the corn belt used IH 720 plows untill JD made a copy of the IH 720 plow which by the way JD lost a court case and had to pay up  for IH patent rights.

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George 2    0

You said it exactly. The 720 in a 5 x 16 configuration would not plug in the 125 bu corn on 36 inch rows at 20,000 plants per acre back then. I kept on plowing right up to 2014 with this plow. What happened with the passage of time is that the corn stalks became tougher and tougher. Then we went to 30 inch rows and started planting at 31,000 plants per acre . When I switched over to higher populations the plugging increased exponentially and to the point I wouldn't put up with it any more. It was as worse as the old 550 was back in 1980 before I got the 720. The cause of the plugging was the 50% increased stalk volume going through the same space and narrower spacing of the rows. The 735 will also plug badly at 16 inch setting but plugs minimally at 18 inch setting. At 20 inches it does not plug at all but it leaves rough slabs of soil..

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So looked at the plow this morning.  It hadn't been pulled out of the weeds so it was still sunk in the ground from not being used.  It needs shares, land sides, two coulter assemblies, a new tire on the tail wheel and some bolts here and there.  Not sure why the bolts were removed??  The owner wasn't there to ask. 3 of the 4 boards had Case IH stamped in the back of them. The third one looked different, had a different twist to it from the other 3.  Frame didn't seem bad, didn't see any cracks.  It is an International 710, decals are all there. It has a sticker on it from the old local Massey Dealership, so it's seen more than one farm over the years. So going to prove out what complete Super Chief bottoms are selling for and go from there. Get a worst case scenario if I was to buy it??

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CDN 400    0

There was something wrong with your set up if you could not plow stalks a 16". I plant 32500 population and average 180 -200 bpa dry and have no problems. The 735 I bought was seized at 16" and came off a tobacco sand farm and they plowed stalks with it. No matter what you say something wasn't right.

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IH Forever    0

I have a 710 3x18 that I play with occasionally. I have had no problem with plugging in 30" row 200 bu. corn but I think the 2208 corn head does a good job of chewing up stalks.

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jass1660    0
4 hours ago, George 2 said:

You said it exactly. The 720 in a 5 x 16 configuration would not plug in the 125 bu corn on 36 inch rows at 20,000 plants per acre back then. I kept on plowing right up to 2014 with this plow. What happened with the passage of time is that the corn stalks became tougher and tougher. Then we went to 30 inch rows and started planting at 31,000 plants per acre . When I switched over to higher populations the plugging increased exponentially and to the point I wouldn't put up with it any more. It was as worse as the old 550 was back in 1980 before I got the 720. The cause of the plugging was the 50% increased stalk volume going through the same space and narrower spacing of the rows. The 735 will also plug badly at 16 inch setting but plugs minimally at 18 inch setting. At 20 inches it does not plug at all but it leaves rough slabs of soil..

This is a case where the jd heads leaving the stalks longer and standing some actually flowed thru better then where the ih heads chewed them up and made a mat of them. 

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George 2    0
8 hours ago, Mountain Heritage said:

So looked at the plow this morning.  It hadn't been pulled out of the weeds so it was still sunk in the ground from not being used.  It needs shares, land sides, two coulter assemblies, a new tire on the tail wheel and some bolts here and there.  Not sure why the bolts were removed??  The owner wasn't there to ask. 3 of the 4 boards had Case IH stamped in the back of them. The third one looked different, had a different twist to it from the other 3.  Frame didn't seem bad, didn't see any cracks.  It is an International 710, decals are all there. It has a sticker on it from the old local Massey Dealership, so it's seen more than one farm over the years. So going to prove out what complete Super Chief bottoms are selling for and go from there. Get a worst case scenario if I was to buy it??

Turn around and run like ****. That is a money pit. CIH plow parts have become very expensive in the last few years. First of all a 710 is at least 43 years old and could be as old as 47 years. From what you say that plow is a good candidate for Bearingers salvage row. To be blunt there are relatively few good condition IH or Case IH plows out there any more. I did a lot of looking before I bought my 735. I couldn't find anything decent and I eventually came across a 1990 model that had sat for at least 15 years in the owners shed. The machine needed new coulters and landsides right away. I got 2 years out of the moldboards before I changed them and the shins last fall. Now I have a plow in top condition. The moldboards on it were original when I bought it. But I paid a premium price for it and the repairs weren't cheap either. So I have an expensive plow but it is one that I know I can go to the field with and not expect any issues with. I talked to Bearingers before I rebuilt it and they assured me that a good late model 735 in top notch condition will still bring good money because there are still certain numbers of farmers who still want to plow.    

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One thing I will add about plowing in todays world, with the exception of some guys on this site, it is hard to find someone that actually knows how to set up a plow correctly. I cant think of one neighbor in my area that knows a lot about it. And a lot of guys still plow in my area and sometimes it makes me laugh how rough of job they can do. I have a smaller operation also and still plow. I tend to bush hog my stalks in the fall after harvest or make a pass with the disc before plowing. It doesn't take that long and the plow does a better job. I realize guys farming more ground don't have the time and that's understandable. When you said the guy couldn't ever get it set right I wouldn't be afraid of it because of that. There are too many variables that he may of never had right. I spent the better part of a week reading and setting my plow up in my spare time. It really is fascinating to me the proper way to do this. I am a young pup but figure If I am going to plow I may as well know how to set it up. I am running a lower clearance Jd F145 plow because it was a good deal and parts are very easy to find.

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