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TD14A suck or blow?


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#1 actvd@bigpond.com

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 04:39 AM

While getting familiar with my TD14A it has been running a little too warm after working for a while, today while it was running I noticed that the fan was blowing air forward instead of pulling air through the radiator like I assumed it would.
My question is, I have heard that some fans are reversible, what is the point in doing that? Surely if a radiator has an effective shroud, then it should be pulling air through the radiator instead of pushing air through it?
Can someone let me know what is the correct way to have this set up?
Regards, Tony Brown
"Without question, the greatest invention in the history of mankind is beer. Oh, I grant you that the wheel was also a fine invention, but the wheel does not go nearly as well with pizza.

#2 LoggerLee

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 06:01 AM

Should pull air through the radiator, if you run it in the hot weather only then you might want to leave it the way it is.
1 T20
1 TD14A
3 TD9s
And some TD14 street tracks and chains and sprockets I'd like to sell.

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#3 kennymopar

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 06:07 AM

well it should be pulling air through the radiator ...being a old machine as they are ..you may have to check things like the thermostat.is the radiator internally blocked?.are the radiator fins blocked with dirt/debris,is the water pump doing its job etc ..worst case scenario would be a head gasket or cylinder head problems
cheers ken

#4 LoggerLee

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 06:15 AM

LOL Ken...the air is just going the wrong way. All that can be is someone put the wrong fan on it or deliberately put fan blades on there to push it instead of pull it.

D9G you could change the fan blades to push or pull, my dad got tired of freezing his butt off co one winter so he changed it to pull air...changed it back at lunch since he was roasting by then.

Far as I know to changed the air direction on the 14 you need to put a different fan on it.
1 T20
1 TD14A
3 TD9s
And some TD14 street tracks and chains and sprockets I'd like to sell.

International Harvester crawler group on Facebook http://www.facebook....57096181046179/

#5 chumduffy

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 07:56 AM

It should cool the engine either way.Most old dozers push air out (summer fan) and the fan that suck air back (winter fan) are generally too hot for the operator to stand in warmer weather.

#6 Rawleigh99

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 09:27 AM

Also a pusher fan kept most of the dust and debris out of the radiator. Normally dozer fans push. With a puller fan all of the stuff that comes over the top of the balde gets pulled up against the grill or worse, through the radiator. The reversible ones could be changed to pull and warm the operator in the winter. Modern dozers have an electronically reversibel fan that changes direction every ten or fifteen minutes to clean it.

If it is not cooling it is probably not only the fan's fault. You need to make sure that the radiator is clean inside and out and that the pump is properly circulating the coolant. Also, you may want to do a coolant flush. I had a TD9 that had a sand bar in the bottom of the radiator. When I flushed it out a crawfish claw came out of the radiator. Evidently someone had refilled it with ditch water at soem point in the past!

Make sure that the thermostat is opening fully. Take it out and put it in a pot of water on the stove to check the opening temp and that it fully opens. An inexpensive infared non contact thermometer is your best tool for diagnosing this problem. You can take the temp of any part of the engine while it is running frmo a safe distance. Just be sure to look at the chart that comes with the IR thermometer so that you will know what the test area size is at any given distance. The test area is conical on those and the further you get away from what you are testing the bigger the cone is ( think of a shotgun pattern: The farther away you are from the target the bigger your shot pattern is).

http://www.harborfre...eter-96451.html

Any sign of bubbling in the radiator when the machine is running? Also remember these are very low pressure cooling systems so don't put a high pressure cap on it.
Rawleigh

1973 IH 500C a.k.a."Calico Cat"
1955 Cat D2 5U bulldozer with Hyster D2N winch
1945 Cat D2 3J crawler tractor
1979 Pettibone "Super 6" Forklift a.k.a. "Too Tall"
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1980 Ford F350 Flatbed a.k.a. "Beastie"
1960 Allis Chalmers Model 72 All Crop combine
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1988 Mack R688ST Road Tractor
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#7 farmalldr

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 09:45 AM

Thr tractor should cool either way. Suction fan in winter and blower fan in summer.
Could be that someone turned the suction fan around thinking it would cool as a blower but it will not.
Check the cup of the blades, maybe it's just on backwards.
good luck
Dennis

#8 M Diesel

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 12:25 PM

Technically pushers have the ability to cool better but these basic fan designs really preclude any real gain.
I refer pushers but in the southwest there is another lesson to be learned. Pushers are nice but eat radiators quickly. Sucking gritty dusty dirt doesn't give the dirt much velocity, however grit coming off a pusher fan turns it into a sand blaster. Ed tells me Cat learned this lesson yet again in recent times.
Gary M
1951 M -- 1951 MD
1953 Super C -- 1957 Farmall 450
1953 TD9 "Ichabod JR" aka "Icky"
1949 TD18 "Brutus" -- 1956 TD18-182 "Yard Dog"
1964 Loadstar 1600 -- 1975 Loadstar 1700 dump truck
1949 Massey 44

#9 LoggerLee

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 12:30 PM

If you put the fan on backwards it still does whatever it did before... :lol:
1 T20
1 TD14A
3 TD9s
And some TD14 street tracks and chains and sprockets I'd like to sell.

International Harvester crawler group on Facebook http://www.facebook....57096181046179/

#10 actvd@bigpond.com

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 01:30 PM

Some good info there, thanks guys. I know the previous owner rebuilt the water pump, maybe he just put the fan on the wrong way? My understanding of fans is that simply reversing rotation will make it blow but not efficiently, if it is designed to pull, then it should pull air. Judging by the amount of dust and crap on the block, I would think that it has been pulling in the past. The dust and crap wont be helping and will be removed as part of my cooling system checks.
No bubbles in the radiator, the water pump has a slight leak that I can adjust to stop it. The radiator has some minor blockage on the outside that will also be cleaned, this was my first close look at the cooling system and did not seem right, but I have learned something new today, I didn't know that dozers can work either way, but I think farmalldr is correct in saying:
"Could be that someone turned the suction fan around thinking it would cool as a blower but it will not"
I believe that if pushing air was required then a different fan would be required to work effectively. Have I got this right?
"Without question, the greatest invention in the history of mankind is beer. Oh, I grant you that the wheel was also a fine invention, but the wheel does not go nearly as well with pizza.



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